The Mark of the Beast

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I don’t need to read Josephus about Pilate when the Scriptures tells me what happened. The Jews are in DENIAL about Jesus Christ. They were 2,000 years ago, and continue to be today. You are in for a rather rude awakening. You interpret everything just the way you want to. The Messiah, Jesus is so foretold in the OT it’s like having a red ball in front of you and you are saying it isn’t red, even though it is perfectly red. Read Isaiah 53.
**I read Isaiah 53. Do you really believe that the Suffering Servant of Isaiah 53 is the Messiah? If you do, read Isaiah 41:8,9; 44:1,2,21; 45:4. Isaiah identifies that Servant with Israel by name, so that you don’t have to assume that he was Jesus.

Ben: 😊**
 
I can see your point, if you willfully misinterpret the meaning of Paul’s letter then you could bend and twist the words to mean what you will. However, seeing as Paul was merely stating that one did not have to be a Jew in order to be a Christian your point fails.
**Sorry but your reply to my exegesis on Galatians 4:21-31 only tells me that you are beyond repair.

Ben: 😊**
 
OK, Ben. Will you settle the issue by giving us the Jewish interpretation.
If you are referring to that prophecy of Daniel, it was fulfilled in the course of time between 587 and 100 BCE. You will understand when I produce the Jewish interpretation of that prophecy. I mean, if you are ready to remove the blinders.
Please stop dodging the question and tell us who the anointed most holy was, that ended sin and brought everlasting justice.
**Very good! You asked for it. Read Habakkuk 3:13. It says in there that the anointed of God is Israel, the Jewish People, whom God assigned with the mission to represent the glory of God in the world, if you read Isaiah 44:23; 46:13 and Ezekiel 20:41. However, since you are referring especially to Daniel 9:24, the Prophet is talking about the return of the Jews from the Babylon exile, when after 70 years, the transgression which had caused the exile had stopped, and the sin had ended, and the guilt had been expiated.That’s when Everlasting Justice which is the Almighty Himself, returned with His People to Zion, and again a most holy was anointed. “A most holy,” not the Most Holy. That’s where the KJV starts failing.

Good luck!

Ben: 👍**
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Perhaps you don’t know what is Replacement Theology. I would recommend you to read the Pauline Letter to the Galatians 4:21-31.

In Isaiah 40: 1-2 Israel could only be comforted by the coming of her Redeemer. Both Micah and Isaiah had predicted that God would include the gentiles in His Plan of Salvation In Luke 2: 21- 39 is the description of the Presentation of Jesus in the Temple. Simeon had received a specific revelation from God that, before he died, his eyes would behold the Christ of the Lord . Mary and Joseph were astonished that this complete stranger was telling them who Jesus was and why He came. This layman, filled with the Spirit, blessed God and the parents of the Messiah. Simeon’s Canticle EXPLAINS THE RELATIONSHIP OF CHRISTIANITY TO ISRAEL . Through Simeon, Israel, the Servant of God under the Mosaic Law can sleep in peace now that the Messiah has come. He will enlighten all the nations and be Israel’s greatest Glory, for through Him, God’s promises will be fulfilled. Jesus is pointed out by Simeon as the Glory of Israel, the new Tabernacle of God’s Presence ! Israel, who has been the Lord’s watchman in the Old Testament is now off duty and happily hands over to Jesus. It is not that she is irrelevant, but that all her hopes will be fulfilled and surpassed i Jesus her Saviour. The full message is revealed which includes the Suffering and the Glory. This should put to rest the replacement theology argument …
 
Ben Masada;5047614:
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In Isaiah 40: 1-2 Israel could only be comforted by the coming of her Redeemer.
Which is the Almighty Himself. Please, read Isaiah 41:14; 43:1; 44:22.
Both Micah and Isaiah had predicted that God would include the gentiles in His Plan of Salvation
The Gentiles have been always included in God’s plan of salvation. Don’t forget that Jesus said that salvation if of the Jews.
In Luke 2: 21- 39 is the description of the Presentation of Jesus in the Temple. Simeon had received a specific revelation from God that, before he died, his eyes would behold the Christ of the Lord .
That’s Christian assumption based on plagiarism of a Jewish prophecy.
. This layman, filled with the Spirit, blessed God and the parents of the Messiah.
**If Jesus was the Messiah, Isaiah would be in contradiction with himself by identifying the Suffering Servant of chapter 53 with Israel by name. Read Isaiah 41:8,9; 44:1,2,21; 45:4. **
He will enlighten all the nations and be Israel’s greatest Glory, for through Him, God’s promises will be fulfilled.
The mission to enlighten the nations has been assigned to Israel, the Jewish People and not to one Jew in particular. Read Isaiah 42:6. Even Jesus himself, delivering his sermon to a crowd of Jews, he said, “You are the light of the world.” Read Matthew 5:14.
Jesus is pointed out by Simeon as the Glory of Israel, the new Tabernacle of God’s Presence ! Israel, who has been the Lord’s watchman in the Old Testament is now off duty and happily hands over to Jesus.
That’s Pauline Replacement Theology, which has already been classified as a kind of Antisemitism.
The full message is revealed which includes the Suffering and the Glory. This should put to rest the replacement theology argument.
**Not so fast! Read Galatians 4:21-31. That’s the Pauline Carta Magna of Replacement Theology.

Ben: 🤷 **
 
**Sorry but your reply to my exegesis on Galatians 4:21-31 only tells me that you are beyond repair.

Ben: 😊**
That is quite funny. Whoever does not agree with you is beyond repair. Next it will be that whoever disagrees with you is an antisemite. Oh wait, you already said that. I’m sorry, when did you become THE authority on the new covenant?
 
That is quite funny. Whoever does not agree with you is beyond repair. Next it will be that whoever disagrees with you is an antisemite. Oh wait, you already said that. I’m sorry, when did you become THE authority on the new covenant?
**If you meant the NT, you have missed the target. That’s not the New Covenant. This was established with the House of Israel and the House of Judah as one, according to Jeremiah 31:31. And as you know, that New Covenant has nothing to do with Christianity. Your new covenant is between you and Paul. Sorry to rain in your parade.

Ben: 😊**
 
**If you meant the NT, you have missed the target. That’s not the New Covenant. This was established with the House of Israel and the House of Judah as one, according to Jeremiah 31:31. And as you know, that New Covenant has nothing to do with Christianity. Your new covenant is between you and Paul. Sorry to rain in your parade.

Ben: 😊**
Okay Ben,

I’m dropping out of this discussion now. You are so out there that there is no need to try to have a rational discussion with you.
 
**I read Isaiah 53. Do you really believe that the Suffering Servant of Isaiah 53 is the Messiah? If you do, read Isaiah 41:8,9; 44:1,2,21; 45:4. Isaiah identifies that Servant with Israel by name, so that you don’t have to assume that he was Jesus.

Ben: 😊**
It is said in Isaiah AND HE WILL BE BORN OF A VIRGIN…Helloooooooo?!
 
The Jews spent 70 years of exile in Babylon and not 490 years. Therefore, your computation is wrong.
Yes the Jews spent 70 years of exile in Babylon, but read again my post. It specifically states that the 490 year countdown STARTS at the time when the Decree is given to go and rebuild the city of Jerusalem. Or do you just choose to ignore this? The 70 weeks is not the same as the 70 years of captivity as it seems you are trying to have us believe.
Wrong again! The original brings, “until one who is anointed and a leader.” The KJV is an adulterated version of the Bible.
Ok, fine, however, Jesus was both anointed (by the Holy Spirit) at his baptism by John the Baptist and he was a leader of a great number of followers, not just the disciples.
Not the Temple nor Jerusalem itself, but the People. That’s a reference to the People who must rebuild themselves from the day they were exiled to Babylon. (Jer. 29:4-10)
This is the most convoluted interpretation of scripture I have ever seen. Wherein do you get the idea that this is talking about individuals and not the literal city. Gabriel is very specific in what he is saying. He does not mince words and you do, he tells Daniel to start the countdown from a specific event and Daniel had no problem understanding what was meant by Gabriel’s word. Why are you having such a problem with it? Is it because to admit that Jesus WAS and IS the messiah of the Jews that you would also have to admit that you forefathers actually had their messiah killed? Many of the time realized this very fact and repented of the deed and thus helped to build the church from the beginning.
This is Christian speculation on a Jewish prophecy with the purpose to plagiarize in their interest..
There is no speculation here. What has been presented has been accepted as truth by most christians and is supported by the other prophecies concerning Jesus. What you fail to understand is that there were two aspects of the messiah, the first was the suffering, sacrificial lamb, that was to come to teach. The second is when he returns to FIGHT for his people, those that have accepted him at his first coming and those that take by faith the truth that he was and is the one and only messiah. Your ancestors had it backwards, believing that the messiah would come and destroy their enemies and set up an eternal kingdom through them. They failed to understand or chose to ignore that God had not only made promises to the Jews but that he had also made promises to the Gentiles. And why would God do this? Because the Jews had failed in the assigned mission of God to teach the gentiles about God. God knew this would happen and so we have the suffering messiah, he that would come and take away the sins of man. Remember also that without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sins, therefore somebody had to die to make this happen. That somebody was Jesus, the SON OF GOD, the Messiah, Immanuel, The Prince of Peace.
That’s a reference to those 3.1/5 years the Greeks under Antiochus introduced the abomination of desolation in the Temple and caused a halt to the sacrifices for 3 1/5 years, until the Maccabees restored the Temple and purified the altar of sacrifices, which became know as Hannukkah.
That doesn’t wash either, seeing that it had to be someone who could “confirm” the covenant between God and Isreal. Where in history do we find that Antiochus even ever made a convenant with the Jewis people. We don’t. Plus the fact that the timing is all wrong. The seven years to confirm the covenant comes 483 years after the decree to go and rebuild Jerusalem. The time period you are referring to happens too early for it to fit into this prophecy.
The sacrifices did not cease when Jesus died. They continued being offered daily for another 40 years until the Temple was destroyed by the Romans. Nice try though..
On the day the Jesus died the curtian between the Holy Place and the Most Holy of Holies was rent in twain. At that moment GOD himself chose to no longer recognize any sacrifices made by the Priests in the temple. The sacrifce of that day was not finished because of this incedent. Once the curtain was repaired and the sacrifices were restored they became empty sacrifices, God had literally turned his back upon them because they had turned their backs upon Him by refusing to recognizing and accepting the messiah he had promised them. The sacrifices were totally stopped in 70 AD when the temple was completely distroyed. I doubt very seriously if it will be rebuilt or the sacrifices restored, in any case these will be useless as God willnot acknowledge them for Jesus was the ultimate sacrifice for all mankind and no other sacrifice will be ever needed again.
**Actually, Paul never became an apostle to the Gentiles, for 2 percent of one’s missionary activities among the Gentiles can hardly classify one as an apostle to the Gentiles. Paul never left the Jews in peace by dedicating 98 percent of his missionary activities to the Jews and the converts of the Nazarenes, whose synagogues he would overturn into Christian churches according to his custom. Paul was never able to build a church from scratch with Gentiles. **
I don’t know what fantasy books you’ve been reading or where you get your propaganda information but you need to go back and finds some more reliable information. Good luck.
Just wait a little longer and you will have it.
Yeah, I can’t wait.
 
Half true,Jesus was born a Jew but died a Christian…thats why His followers were not allowed into the synogues and those that died were stoned…very tolerant they were…this is what happened to the chief Rabbi of Rome .Zolli who converted to Cathlic Christianity because of being the only church to dare defend the Jews against the left wing nazis.and our of gratitude he chose Eugenio for his new first name…in honor of Pope PiusX11 who denounced in some 40 times as reported in the NYTImes from 1939-45…what these beasts were doing…all of the other churchs and even Jewish organizations in America were silent. Re: A Vatican lifeline .by Major William Simpson…a Brit,Tank Commander who was captured in North Africa,shipped to Italy,Escaped and made his way to Rome and worked in the underground saving thousands of lives with Monsg.OFlaherty…portrayed in a movie by G.Peck…I have the high honor of knowing the Major and pushed his great exciting book to dozens of Catholic publications…pick up a copy and send me a review…I am sure you will…you seem like such a fair person…
 
Like I said Ben, what is your excuse that in Isaiah which he clearly states in these words “AND HE WILL BE BORN OF A VIRGIN”. Can you explain this one?:rolleyes:
 
Hi guys, just a couple of thoughts…firstly;, we don’t know whether or not any of the Evangelists were Paul’s disciples since there is not enough evidence to suggest either way and secondly the conclusion one comes to largely depends on the exegetical method used when examining the texts…form critics will come to a very different conclusion than say redaction critics. We also only know about Paul what is disclosed to us in his letters…there were other letters written by him, for instance there was a letter written to the Corinthian commmunity that we know existed because of references to it in 1 cor but d we do not have a copy ourselves and so cannot hope to ever know what it said etc. I think it is very difficult for us to come to some of the conclusions that apperar to have been reached throughout the course of this discussion…especially since we cannot confirm Pauline authorship of some of the other epistles in the NT.

God bless!
 
very good but rather boring…Christian means love of neighbor,helping women and children.soup kitchens,tolerance,anti slavery etc etc…no true Christian ever hurt anyone…what you are ,as a left winger is ordered to do,is lumping any unfairness with folks who believe in fairness!!!..during ww2 some 6 million european Jews were murdered by the left wing nazi movement…only the RCC spoke out,FDR never spoke out…I still have my Honus Wagner baseball card to give to anyone who can p(name removed by moderator)oint one speech by the sainted FDR or any Jewish organization during the years 1936 to 1945 that spoke out in defiance against these left wing goons…not a whimper…dont try to come onto this generous site that tolerants silly comments and try to divide us by inuendo and just down right lies…Jesus,whom you obviously hate,ordered that we ,Hius followers ,love thy neighbor as thyself…meaning as our selves…so if a forlorn character did a bad thing towards innocent other people…he or she was WRONG…see thats the difference…we Catholic christians must always take it on the chin…while others, pedophile,child molestors, commies,(same club)immature no talent hollyweird types like Madonna,Obrah,Bill Reilly,Sean,Rush…etc etc…big deal…what a bunch of losers …let us all pray for them and fight to defeat their agendas…with love,caring,soup kitchens etc
 
If you are referring to that prophecy of Daniel, it was fulfilled in the course of time between 587 and 100 BCE. You will understand when I produce the Jewish interpretation of that prophecy. I mean, if you are ready to remove the blinders.
I would generally agree with you even though I don’t know why you chose those particual dates.

Why 587 BC? Why not 538 BC, when Cyrus decreed the rebuilding of the Temple?

It is I who confirm the words of my servants, I carry out the plan announced by my messengers; I say to Jerusalem: Be inhabited; to the cities of Judah: Be rebuilt; I will raise up their ruins. It is I who said to the deep: Be dry; I will dry up your wellsprings. I say of Cyrus: My shepherd, who fulfills my every wish; He shall say of Jerusalem, “Let her be rebuilt,” and of the temple, “Let its foundations be laid.” (Isa 44:26-28)

Why 100 AD?
**Very good! You asked for it. Read Habakkuk 3:13. It says in there that the anointed of God is Israel, the Jewish People, whom God assigned with the mission to represent the glory of God in the world, if you read Isaiah 44:23; 46:13 and Ezekiel 20:41. However, since you are referring especially to Daniel 9:24, the Prophet is talking about the return of the Jews from the Babylon exile, when after 70 years, the transgression which had caused the exile had stopped, and the sin had ended, and the guilt had been expiated.That’s when Everlasting Justice which is the Almighty Himself, returned with His People to Zion, and again a most holy was anointed. “A most holy,” not the Most Holy. That’s where the KJV starts failing.
Good luck!
I don’t disagree with what you are saying and I don’t use the KJV. My bible also says “a most holy” (But we christisans see more than one fulfillment of these verses).

In your opinion, is “a most holy” the reconsecration of the temple, the holy community, or an individual like Aaron (1 Chron 23:13)?

**And who is the “One” like a son of man in (Dan 7:13)? **
 
That is quite funny. Whoever does not agree with you is beyond repair. Next it will be that whoever disagrees with you is an antisemite. Oh wait, you already said that. I’m sorry, when did you become THE authority on the new covenant?
**Since the day God promised Noah that no more catastrophe of that size would happen again, as long as Israel, the Jewish People would exist. Read Jeremiah 31:35-37.

Ben: :)**
 
Okay Ben,

I’m dropping out of this discussion now. You are so out there that there is no need to try to have a rational discussion with you.
**How do you define a rational discussion, one that I would have to agree with your views? Not too likely!

Ben: 🤷**
 
It is said in Isaiah AND HE WILL BE BORN OF A VIRGIN…Helloooooooo?!
**And it is said in Amos 5:2 that that virgin is Israel. Helloooooo to you too. Then, after Amost 5:2, you can return to Isaiah 7:14 and next read verse 15,22 and Isaiah 8:8. The child born of that virgin is Judah, which Isaiah mentions by name, so that you won’t have to assume that he is Jesus.

Besides, there are two kinds of words for virgin in Hebrew. One is “Almah,” which means young woman at marriageable age. And “Betulah,” which means physical virginity. The word in the original in Isaiah 7:14 is “Almah.” Now, wake up and open the door of your heart for the Truth.

Ben: :)**
 
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