The Most revered woman in History- But not by Protestants

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liturgyluver said:
Perhaps I misunderstood, but by using “rail against this woman” and “majority of protestants” in the same sentence, the clear implication to me (and to others clearly) was that you were saying that the majority of protestants are anti-Marian.
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This is my exact post
Marybeloved said:
This is a bonafide fact, thanks to Catholics, Orthodox and even Muslims! Who honor the mother of Christ among all women, a little fact that I find very interesting considering the words of the Archangel, st. Elizabeth and the Virgin herself under the influence of the Holy Spirit.

How do the protestants who constantly rail against this woman square that attitude with God’s proclamation and prophecy about her and its amazing fulfillment among Catholics and Orthodox (even Muslims!) better than the vast majority of Protestant Christians? 🤷
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I have no idea how that sentence would lead you or others to the anti-marian conclusion- Unless you deny that there are those who do rail (in fact almost constantly) aout her? I’m pretty sure CAF alone has more than enough evidence if you have not encountered these folks yourself- I should say you must be very lucky not to have met them. My question is not that difficult- How do the Protestants who constantly rail against her square that attitude with scriptural praise of her? You’ll have to explain how that question means most Protestants are “anti-marian” or even “rail against her”- The Question still stands. Also note that I said that the prophecy is fulfilled amongst C, O & Muslims BETTER than the vast majority of Protestants. Not true? Again, You’ll have to explain how that amounts to saying that most Protestants are anti-Marian.
I agree with you that disrespect to Mary is unnaceptable but the fact remains for this well-travelled European Catholic, I have never seen or heard any of the traits that you ascribe.
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Which attitudes? Indifference? Her virtual non-existence in most Protestant church and services? Just give me examples of modern day praising of Mary? And the trait of the ones who attack us (and Mary without really realizing it)? Just read the internet if they are not on your TV, radio or tracts handed out in many places.
 
Mary was one of the key sticking point for me that caused me to leave my old Church. My old pastor would mock her and the Catholics for how they treated her. He even one day said he would do the Rosary and just leave out the parts about Mary. I was floored and it started my journey home. Also as for hatred there are some pretty shocking things out there. Just Go on Youtube and Check out Pastor Gino Jennings clip breaking A statue that he thought was Virgin Mary but was actually a statue of our little flower.

I know there are some of the 30,000 different Protestant Denominations that have affection for the Holy Mother but there are many that are not also.🤷
 
Marybeloved said:
With all due respect to you and your country, isn’t John Hagee (and his many friends) American? Isn’t TBN?
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Perhaps one of my brother/sister Americans of the USofA could point us to a Channel, Cable Link, or You Tube video where “any” Protestant denomination talks about their respect of the Mother of God. Pehaps we are waaaaaayyy off track here, and there’s something to be learned?

The fact Christmas Trees are put up once a year means what? You mean like Rhode Island where they refused to call it a Christmas Tree but perfered a “Holiday Tree” . 🤷

Or you mean like the “White House” where President Obama balked at the Nativity scene and perfered to call the Christmas Tree a “Holiday Tree”.

Well perhaps we shall watch Mr Obama tonight with his tree lighting agenda and see how wondeful he speaks for the Kingdom of God and Country. Since he “forgot” to mention this at Thanksgiving, I would think he would pay particular interest to Christmas or umm the Holiday Tree season?

Peace
 
Marybeloved said:
How do the protestants who constantly rail against this woman square that attitude with God’s proclamation and prophecy about her and its amazing fulfillment among Catholics and Orthodox (even Muslims!) better than the vast majority of Protestant Christians? 🤷
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“Protestant” is a broad word that encompasses many non-Catholic denominations each with their own view of Marian dogma. I would say the Protestants who rail against the Blessed Mother are the “reformed” churches and fundamentalists.
Interestingly, it is Marian dogma that keeps the Catholic Church from falling into the abyss of denying the Virgin Birth and the Incarnation, which many Protestant churches have slid into.
I would say that is a consequence of the Protestant Rebellion, but that’s another thread.
 
Marybeloved----

I’m sorry that you seem to have experienced Protestants “railing” against Mary.

I’ve been a member of non-Catholic churches for nearly 45 years, and have never —not even once—heard a Protestant speak with anything but admiration and respect for Mary. She’s considered an beautiful example of trust and obedience towards God, and as such, we bless her and look at her as someone to learn from.
 
Cat said:
Protestants do not “constantly rail against this woman.” Most Protestants are respectful of Mary and honor her as the Mother of God.
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Not the protestants I know. I live in an area heavily populated with ELCA . They most defiintely do NOT honor her.

I used to live in a Baptist area…they strongly do NOT honor her, and a lot of them think having anything to do with her is a sin “from the pits of hell”…that is one for you Grace, You are SO WRONG.
 
scottmac said:
Not the protestants I know. I live in an area heavily populated with ELCA . They most defiintely do NOT honor her.

I used to live in a Baptist area…they strongly do NOT honor her, and a lot of them think having anything to do with her is a sin “from the pits of hell”…that is one for you Grace, You are SO WRONG.
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A sin from the pits of hell? Speaking of ignorance rears its ugly head again…🤷
 
Marybeloved said:
This is a bonafide fact, thanks to Catholics, Orthodox and even Muslims! Who honor the mother of Christ among all women, a little fact that I find very interesting considering the words of the Archangel, st. Elizabeth and the Virgin herself under the influence of the Holy Spirit.

How do the protestants who constantly rail against this woman square that attitude with God’s proclamation and prophecy about her and its amazing fulfillment among Catholics and Orthodox (even Muslims!) better than the vast majority of Protestant Christians? 🤷
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Well one has to also understand their background and their church traditions. Many Protestants are simply raised in an environment were Mary has no importance or very little importance. I believe a lot of it has to do with the whole novel belief: If it is not in the Bible,then it is false.

Frankly, I do not let it bother me, because it is not about what Protestants believe about Mary;moreover, it is about Jesus Christ.
 
Nicea325 said:
A sin from the pits of hell? Speaking of ignorance rears its ugly head again…🤷
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Yes, that is what I expereienced. I did not believe it of course.
For what it is worth , I do not have any contact with baptists anymore. I don’t miss it either.
 
scottmac said:
Yes, that is what I expereienced. I did not believe it of course.
For what it is worth , I do not have any contact with baptists anymore. I don’t miss it either.
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Most Baptists I have encountered are very anti-Catholic. Not all,but most I have met displayed much hatred. Truly sad.

Were you Baptist in the past?
 
Nicea325 said:
Well one has to also understand their background and their church traditions. Many Protestants are simply raised in an environment were Mary has no importance or very little importance. I believe a lot of it has to do with the whole novel belief: If it is not in the Bible,then it is false.

Frankly, I do not let it bother me, because it is not about what Protestants believe about Mary;moreover, it is about Jesus Christ.
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I agree that it is about Jesus. And I have told people who have asked me why Catholics ‘worship’ Mary, I tell them we don’t ‘worship’ her, however, since Jesus loved and honored her, how can we not do the same. This usually takes them aback.

It may be a rather simplistic approach, but if Jesus felt someone was worthy, I think I have to do the same.
 
AbideWithMe said:
Marybeloved----

I’m sorry that you seem to have experienced Protestants “railing” against Mary.

I’ve been a member of non-Catholic churches for nearly 45 years, and have never —not even once—heard a Protestant speak with anything but admiration and respect for Mary. She’s considered an beautiful example of trust and obedience towards God, and as such, we bless her and look at her as someone to learn from.
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Indeed it is a very sorry fact.

What churches have you attended? I’m glad the members there do not fall in this trap- I see this attitude even on TV sometimes:shrug:. There certainly are Protestants who actively “preach” how Mary should NOT be praised, but without accompanying “honor” that they DO consider appropriate as an example, only just indifference. I’'ve seen sermons about Queen Esther in the OT that betray more respect for her than the Mother of God.

After the Passion movie depiction of a very dignified Mary- oozing with dignity and quiet holiness, and complete humility to God and love for Christ’s followers and perfect devotion to Christ as well as respect shown to her by Christ, I saw then (On TV) what I considered to be unprecedented respect and admiration shown for the Mother of God- But it only lasted a while. I saw this Easter program about the suffering of Christ, clearly based on the passion in every way- except that the dignified, holy, virtuous, submissive-to-God-even-in-suffering woman of the Passion was replaced with a deranged, crazy-looking woman who bitterly complained against God. Surely the Passion did not portray “Mary worship” yet they felt the need to “scale down” even ***that ***depiction of Mary and replace it with one that had lost all the dignity portrayed- isn’t this indicative of the low place in admiration and respect that she occupies in many Protestant circles?

I’m happy you and the Church you attend do honor her, but I see more evidence of Praise and respect of Esther than the Mother of Christ by many Protestants- That Honor that Protestants believe she does rightly deserve, should at least be as visible as the denouncement of Catholic “excesses” regarding Mary, don’t you think? 😉
 
I was very much discouraged from praying the rosary, by a Baptist. I was told that if Mary knew I was praying to her, she would cry. Also they denied her Immaculate Conception and that she remained a Virgin her whole life.

Not the kind of conversation I wish to get into again.
 
My two cents…

I have NEVER met a protestant who LIKED Mary. I have met a handful that have TOLERATED Mary.

I have quite often met Protestants who strongly DISLIKE Mary.

I have lived in different states as well and encountered this.
 
I have never met a Christian who went out of his way to dislike, disparage, condemn, curse, or express hatred or discuss of Mary ever. It doesn’t happen. I have met Protestants who go out of their way to explain that Mary was not God and that she was human like you or me.

Now, there are Protestants who see in Catholic Mary veneration not the honoring of Mary the Mother of God at all. Instead, they see this Catholic practice as idolatry with roots in pagan worship of the “Queen of Heaven” and other ancient deities. They attack what they see as idolatry being perpetrated by Catholics. They are not attacking Mary the Mother of God.
 
ltwin said:
I have never met a Christian who went out of his way to dislike, disparage, condemn, curse, or express hatred or discuss of Mary ever. It doesn’t happen. I have met Protestants who go out of their way to explain that Mary was not God and that she was human like you or me.

Now, there are Protestants who see in Catholic Mary veneration not the honoring of Mary the Mother of God at all. Instead, they see this Catholic practice as idolatry with roots in pagan worship of the “Queen of Heaven” and other ancient deities. They attack what they see as idolatry being perpetrated by Catholics. They are not attacking Mary the Mother of God.
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This is exactly true.

OP, surely you realize that Protestants have different teachings than Catholics. They are only following what they have been taught. Why are you so surprised and upset that others follow their own teachings? Of course they do.

BTW, I WAS raised Baptist (Conference Baptist), and was Baptist for the first 22 years of my life. I was married in the Baptist church. My family returned to the Baptist church for two brief years in the 1990s (during our “church search”).

If you would like to attempt to work with Baptists that you know to change their thinking about Mary, here is what you have to do:
  1. Stop condemning them with an angry tone. Yes, they are wrong about Mary, but it is out of ignorance, not vengeance, that they teach that Mary is a sinful human being and not worthy of veneration. Be much kinder in your words and attitude. And don’t be surprised or shocked when they follow their own teachings. That’s what anyone would do.
  2. Stop calling Baptists Protestants unless they say it’s OK. A lot of non-Catholic Christians have recently come to resent this “label” because they say that they are not “protesting” anything. I realize that the label is an historic one, but I see nothing wrong with granting the request of various non-Catholic Christians and just calling them “Christians” unless they are OK with the term Protestant. Check first–seek to not offend them over a “label.”
  3. There are a lot of different kinds of Baptists (several hundred), and it is very important that you KNOW what kind of Baptist you are dealing with. Be courteous enough to ask for their Statement of Faith, study it, and then you will know whether you are dealing with Conference Baptists, Southern Baptists, American Baptists, Independent Baptists, Reformed Baptists, etc. They are all very different and it’s important that you know not only what they believe, but how they practice their beliefs.
SOME Baptists are separatists, which means that they probably won’t even talk to you, a Catholic. These Baptists are very hard to reach out to.

But many other Baptists are evangelical and will be happy to become friends with you–always keep in mind that they want you to accept Jesus as your personal Savior, so make sure that you tell them that yes, Jesus is your Savior and you trust in Him to get you to heaven.

Also, some Baptists believe that the Catholic Church is the Whore of Babylon and they will beg you to come out and be part of a truly Biblical church. But many other Baptists accept the Catholic Church as a true Christian Church and they will be happy to that you are part of the Catholic Church. Revered Baptist teacher Chuck Colson has founded an organization called Evangelicals and Catholics Together, and he has done a lot of good in helping Baptists to understand that the Catholic Church IS a Christian Church.
  1. When you are speaking with Baptists (and many other evangelical Protestant Christians), only one thing matters–what does the Bible say? They will not care two hoots for the Pope, the Magisterium, Sacred Tradition, history, etc. The BIBLE is the Sole Authority. As an ex-Baptist, I believe that the Marian doctrines are Biblical. I would suggest that you get hold of Tim Staples’ CDs on Marian doctrine, which contain a lot of historical and Biblical apologetics supporting Marian doctrines. THIS is how you will reach out to Baptists–through the BIBLE.
Godspeed to you as you attempt to help Baptists come home to the Catholic Church and attempt to defend the Blessed Mother with a good, solid Biblical approach.
 
scottmac said:
My two cents…

I have NEVER met a protestant who LIKED Mary. I have met a handful that have TOLERATED Mary.

I have quite often met Protestants who strongly DISLIKE Mary.

I have lived in different states as well and encountered this.
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For many Protestants, Mary was merely a vessel for Christ, that’s it. He could have come to earth in any woman, He just happen to choose Mary. This is actually a Gnostic philosophy that dates back into the 2nd or 3rd century. Being in that position, Mary is simply ignored. Its not a question of liking or disliking her, they just don’t give her another thought. She becomes just another Biblical figure. When they do speak of Mary, it is often in a way that shows she was a sinner and totally unaware she bore the Saviour.
Which is why, BTW I despise the popular CCM song “Mary did you know?” and cringe when I hear it sung in a Catholic Church.
 
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