The Real reason why one cannot be saved by faith alone.

[whowantsumadebo]

YAQUBOS:

( Galatians 1:8-9 )
QUOTE]

This warning doesn’t even say anything about scripture, at all. I would suggest that Paul did not even consider his own writings to be equal to the Old Testament. In fact, it seems to me that using this passage against your opponent presupposes your doctrine. Catholics use this verse against Protestants by saying no-one taught protestant doctrine until the 16th Century.

 

[Pax]

mayra hart:

And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, full of grace and truth."* –John 1:14
“But grace was given to each of us according to the measure of Christ’s gift.”

*–Ephesians 4:7
“Having gifts that differ according to the grace given to us, let us use them.”

*–Romans 12:6
“But by the grace of God I am what I am, and his grace toward me was not in vain. On the contrary, I worked harder than any of them, though it was not I, but the grace of God which is with me.” *–1 Corinthians 15:10
“For by grace you have been saved.” *–Ephesians 2:8
“And God is able to provide you with every blessing charis, “grace”] in abundance, so that you may always have enough of everything and may provide in abundance for every good work.” *–2 Corinthians 9:8
“My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.”

*–2 Corinthians 12:9
“. . . it is well that the heart be strengthened by grace, not by foods.” *–Hebrews 13:9
“But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.”

*–2 Peter 3:18
What do all of these verses tell us? What is this gracethat is being described in all of these verses? What are its qualities and attributes? The passages above tell us, in order, that (1) Jesus was full of this grace, (2) thisgrace is given in measures, (3) it is responsible for the various gifts, (4) it empowered St. Paul to work harder, (5) it saves us, (6) it can be given in “abundance” unto us (this again speaks of grace as measurable), (7) it is a kind of “power” of God, (8) it strengthens our hearts, much like “foods” strengthen the body, and (9) we can grow in it.

Nicely done summary

 

[Pax]

YAQUBOS:

Peace be with you!

Not all what the apostles wrote is Scripture. And if they thought anything contrary to Scripture, they are accursed:

…

So if you find anything said or written by an apostle, and yet contrary to the Scripture, then you don’t have to believe it!

And only this part of that letter, mentioned in this verse, is binding as Scripture.

In Love,
Yaqubos†

Yaqubos,

How do you know that the apostles wrote other things? It also seems contradictory to say that they would have inspired writings that are true teachings, and that they would also have non-inspired writings that were contrary to scripture. You’ve lost me on this one.

Many writings that were not included in the canon such as the gospel of Peter were not included because authorship could not be established. The letter of Clement was considered by many to be inspired before the canon was established, but the Church decided that it was not scripture. Clements letter is free from teaching errors, but it is not considered inspired scripture.

I don’t think anyone seriously believes that any of the apostles ever taught errors.

P.S. We do know that there is a lost letter of Paul because scripture tell us this. We do not know its content but again I doubt that Paul taught any errors in that letter.

 

[whowantsumadebo]

Pax:

P.S. We do know that there is a lost letter of Paul because scripture tell us this. We do not know its content but again I doubt that Paul taught any errors in that letter.

Indeed, there are at least 2 letters referred to by Paul himself which are not found in our Canon. The first, I guess would be 0 or -1 Corinthians and the other; a mysterious epistle to the church in Laodicea. Who knows what they said.
Then there are all those spurious deutero-Pauline letters like the Correspondence with Seneca.
Also, it is believed by many that some of Paul’s letters may in fact be several letters converged into one. I don’t know how this could effect either side (Caths or Prots). Just something to consider, somehow, when discussing the history, preservation, and authority of Scripture.
Seems a rather difficult road to travel to me. Either accept the Church’s final decision on what is scripture and what is doctrine, or decide that we can’t really know what scripture is or isn’t and become doctrinally agnostic. Or not.

 

[YAQUBOS]

Peace be with you!

Pax:

Yaqubos,

How do you know that the apostles wrote other things?

I didn’t say that the apostles actually wrote other things. I just meant that, even if they wrote anything else, only what is Scripture among their writings has authority.

Pax:

It also seems contradictory to say that they would have inspired writings that are true teachings, and that they would also have non-inspired writings that were contrary to scripture. You’ve lost me on this one.

I didn’t say that all what the apostles wrote other than Scripture ( in case they wrote anything else ) is wrong. But those other writings would not be infallible like Scripture. So we test them by the Sword of the Spirit.

Pax:

Many writings that were not included in the canon such as the gospel of Peter were not included because authorship could not be established.

This is not the only reason for their exclusion.

Pax:

The letter of Clement was considered by many to be inspired before the canon was established, but the Church decided that it was not scripture. Clements letter is free from teaching errors, but it is not considered inspired scripture.

Nobody decides which is Scripture. Only God decides. And the Church just ACCEPTS, and do not decide.

Pax:

I don’t think anyone seriously believes that any of the apostles ever taught errors.

See in the following if Paul is serious:

"But when Cephas came to Antioch, I opposed him to his face, because he stood condemned.
For prior to the coming of certain men from James, he used to eat with the Gentiles; but when they came, he began to withdraw and hold himself aloof, fearing the party of the circumcision.
The rest of the Jews joined him in hypocrisy, with the result that even Barnabas was carried away by their hypocrisy.
But when I saw that they were not straightforward about the truth of the gospel, I said to Cephas in the presence of all, "If you, being a Jew, live like the Gentiles and not like the Jews, how is it that you compel the Gentiles to live like Jews?
“We are Jews by nature and not sinners from among the Gentiles; nevertheless knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the Law but through faith in Christ Jesus, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, so that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the Law; since by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified.” ( Galatians 2:11-16 )

Cephas is Peter. Paul says here that he stood condemned!

P.S.: As you see, in my last biblical quote I tried to return to our topic here. If anyone wants to discuss anything about the Scripture, we can do it in another topic related to that subject.

In Love,
Yaqubos†

 

[Psalm45_9]

YAQUBOS:

Peace be with you!

I didn’t say that the apostles actually wrote other things. I just meant that, even if they wrote anything else, only what is Scripture among their writings has authority.

I didn’t say that all what the apostles wrote other than Scripture ( in case they wrote anything else ) is wrong. But those other writings would not be infallible like Scripture. So we test them by the Sword of the Spirit.

This is not the only reason for their exclusion.

Nobody decides which is Scripture. Only God decides. And the Church just ACCEPTS, and do not decide.

See in the following if Paul is serious:

"But when Cephas came to Antioch, I opposed him to his face, because he stood condemned.
For prior to the coming of certain men from James, he used to eat with the Gentiles; but when they came, he began to withdraw and hold himself aloof, fearing the party of the circumcision.
The rest of the Jews joined him in hypocrisy, with the result that even Barnabas was carried away by their hypocrisy.
But when I saw that they were not straightforward about the truth of the gospel, I said to Cephas in the presence of all, "If you, being a Jew, live like the Gentiles and not like the Jews, how is it that you compel the Gentiles to live like Jews?
“We are Jews by nature and not sinners from among the Gentiles; nevertheless knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the Law but through faith in Christ Jesus, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, so that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the Law; since by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified.” ( Galatians 2:11-16 )

Cephas is Peter. Paul says here that he stood condemned!

P.S.: As you see, in my last biblical quote I tried to return to our topic here. If anyone wants to discuss anything about the Scripture, we can do it in another topic related to that subject.

In Love,
Yaqubos†

Pax Vobiscvm!

So the Bible just appeared on day and nobody, including Martin Luther, questioned it?

 

[exrc]

mayra hart:

In contrast to the biblical and historical teaching, James McCarthy would have us believe a false gospel that is alien to the passages we have just read. He explains: “[T]he Bible teaches that the standing of a justified sinner before God is perfect. Neither justification nor the grace of God toward the justified can be increased by sacraments or good works.” Does McCarthy’s gratuitous assertion have any merit? It does not, for if the “standing of a justified sinner before God is perfect,” then the passages of Scripture which speak of a gradation of holiness and sanctity (such as Psalm 84, above) would be meaningless. Consider these several passages

:

“The prayer of a righteous man has great power in its effects.” –James 5:16

Yes, as opposed to one who is not born-again. His prayers are in vain because he is not justified or righteous.

“Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they shall be satisfied.”
–Matthew 5:6

When you love your Father because he’s a righteous man, don’t you long,and thirst to be just like him?

“For I tell you, unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.” –Matthew 5:20

The Pharisees were trying to justify their FLESH with the law.

Sound familiar?

The flesh can never be justified, it must die!

The spirit is made righteous, and it is at war with the flesh.

Jesus was speaking of true righteousness. The kind that he gives freely through his sacrifice to those who have trusted and believed.

Very good!you have given a perfect example of justification by faith alone in Mat 5:20

"

Strive for peace with all men, and for the holiness without which no one will see the Lord." –Hebrews 12:14

To be justified?

If all “justified sinners” have an equally “perfect” standing “before God,” then why does St. James indicate that personal righteousness (“righteous man”) directly affects the efficacy of one’s prayer? Why does Our Lord say that we must “hunger and thirst” after righteousness and

justice? Why does He say that unless we are more holy than the scribes and Pharisees, we will never go to Heaven? Why does St. Paul say that we must pursue after “holiness,” adding that without this, “no one will see the Lord?”

Why doesn’t God simply justify us and take us to heaven? After all why take the risk of becoming unjustified as you believe can happen?

Listen,the purpose for us being here as believers is to duplicate ourselves as many times as we can before we die.

The issue is NOT OUR justification, but the justification of OTHERS.

The more we look like our Heavenly Father the more successful we will be. (being holy)

Stop focusing on your sin! It’s paid for in full! He said"IT IS FINISHED" Just believe he did it all ,100%!!!

In love ,exrc

 

[YAQUBOS]

Peace be with you!
Psalm45:9:

Pax Vobiscvm!

So the Bible just appeared on day and nobody, including Martin Luther, questioned it?

When God gave His Word, nobody existed AS PEOPLE OF GOD to question it! God created His People by His Word. Those who question the Word of God are not believers. They are not accepting what God says. If someone is not born again of the Word, he cannot understand this Authority of the Word.

Read again my P.S.:

YAQUBOS:

P.S.: As you see, in my last biblical quote I tried to return to our topic here. If anyone wants to discuss anything about the Scripture, we can do it in another topic related to that subject.

In Love,
Yaqubos†

 

[Therese_Martin]

**Notice:

This thread was started September 23, has over 700 replies, and has eight pages. Thanks to all who participated in the discussion; the thread is now closed.**