The Truth About Islam

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spn82756 said:
Can you imagine? We have to teach planten about his own beliefs! :rotfl:
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spn, Thanks for teaching me. What about your own religion which was active into politics of the state until King Henry the 8th revolted against the rule of the Roman Pope?? Perhaps that was a famous case of Bigamy, well against the church belief of one man one wife.

Church was very active in all politics (take the case of the Roman Empire) until the educated people knocked the church out of important affairs. After that church stopped interfering in the communal affairs and so the state was safely away from christianity.

You started the lecture to teach me. I thought I should also give you a lecture on your religious blackground and the present day position of the church.
 
planten said:
I have no fear about Islam. But now I do have many doubts about christianity which is working to take support from an atheist and directly supporting the faithless atheist. Is it not a miracle for Jesus that his followers are very close to an atheist against a muslim??
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Doubts about Christianity? If an Atheist says that Jesus in not God, you would agree, correct? And if I said he was and gave my argument, you would support the atheist by giving me reasons why you believe Jesus is not God. You see how silly your position is?
You ask me a question. You ask me your own question in your own words. Do not borrow from an atheist.
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Wow, here you go again, dodging the question. Why don’t you just admit it? The Sharia laws permit murder and that’s that.
I do not hate any one. I believe in love for all and hatred for none. Remember that Jesus had come to spread decency. You follow Jesus please.
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You seem to think you have the ability to condemn him (or her) to hell, why is that?
 
dzheremi said:
Are Wahhabis now something other than Muslims just because they make Islam look bad? I am aware that they are a somewhat new philosophy (not sure if it is right to call them a “sect”), but they seem more akin to Puritans than say…Gnostics, if I may make an extremely poor analogy to prove a point.

:confused:

Edit:

Mormons are not Christians. They loathe the cross, seeing the veneration of it as worship of a “dead Messiah” or “dead God”. Mormons on this very board have said such things. They are, additionally, non-Trinitarians, believers in modalism which has been explicitly condemned since the times of the early Church. The only definition by which they could be called “Christian” is by their recognition of someone they call Jesus Christ, although He upholds a substantially different doctrine within Mormonism than is what affirmed by the rest of Christianity. In that way, they are really no different than Muslims, in that they believe that Jesus substantiates their utterly false, heretically-based pseudo-“Christian” religion, with its late-comer prophet and his ridiculous book full of nonsense.
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All right, but I was not saying that they were tridinitarians. Being a non-triditarian does not necessarily mean that one denies Christ’s divinity, but I apologize if I have been a little ignorant about the Latter-Day Saints.
 
Young_Thinker said:
Yes, but according to their core doctrines, they are still “true” Christians as far as I am concerned.
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No valid baptism = not a true Christian

You allow the title “Christian” to people who deny the essential doctrine of the Trinity?
 
Young Thinker: My only point is that whether or not they “believe in the cross” (in whichever way they would define that, as it is certainly not the same way that Christianity as a whole believes in it, and especially not apostolic Christianity), the doctrines that they advance are not just strange and obscure, they are actually specifically anti-Christian, particularly if we are to believe in the correctness of the early Church councils (which we are, whether we are Catholics or Orthodox) which condemned the heresies that the Mormon church upholds. You can’t be Christian and knowingly embrace modalism, for instance. It’s just not possible.
 
dzheremi said:
Young Thinker: My only point is that whether or not they “believe in the cross” (in whichever way they would define that, as it is certainly not the same way that Christianity as a whole believes in it, and especially not apostolic Christianity), the doctrines that they advance are not just strange and obscure, they are actually specifically anti-Christian, particularly if we are to believe in the correctness of the early Church councils (which we are, whether we are Catholics or Orthodox) which condemned the heresies that the Mormon church upholds. You can’t be Christian and knowingly embrace modalism, for instance. It’s just not possible.
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All right, but I am not going to go as far as calling Nestorians heathens.
 
planten said:
Jay, you are not stopping at any one thing.You are running from pillar to post. That is what comes out of being a Yankee doodle !

I simply told you a truth that BibleOT and Quran both tell us that false prophet will be killed. You made a joke of it… That is what comes out of being a yankee doodle !!
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:hypno: What?!?

You are the one that has asserted that it is your duty to follow all of the messengers and that the false ones would be killed. Wasn’t Muhammad killed - poisoned by someone? :hmmm:
 
Young_Thinker said:
Now that is really abuse! On both sides, would you all please behave? Besides, pseudo-gender changes are utterly immoral, being in direct contradiction to God’s Will.
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I’m sorry you feel that way. I was referring to plantens staunch defense for sharia as being good for the world. He has said that. I earlier asked him how he would feel if he were a woman under sharia. That’s all I was doing.
 
planten said:
spn, Thanks for teaching me. What about your own religion which was active into politics of the state until King Henry the 8th revolted against the rule of the Roman Pope?? Perhaps that was a famous case of Bigamy, well against the church belief of one man one wife.

Church was very active in all politics (take the case of the Roman Empire) until the educated people knocked the church out of important affairs. After that church stopped interfering in the communal affairs and so the state was safely away from christianity.

You started the lecture to teach me. I thought I should also give you a lecture on your religious blackground and the present day position of the church.
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I don’t recall saying that the CC was not into affecting politics. Did I? You are the one that said islam is not into politics…and that is a blatant lie! You are instructed by the koran to be involved in politics. You’ve confused yourself.
 
spn82756 said:
I’m sorry you feel that way. I was referring to plantens staunch defense for sharia as being good for the world. He has said that. I earlier asked him how he would feel if he were a woman under sharia. That’s all I was doing.
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I know, but everyone needs to “cool down.”
 
I C, are you all planning to have my future posts killed at the count of TEN(10)?? Am I a knocked out boxer in the ring???
 
Aw, this was a really quality post. In theory I’d like to write like this too - taking time and real effort to make a good article… but what can I say… I procrastinate alot and never seem to get something done:shrug:
 
planten said:
… I do not know who told you that he was God. Did his mother tell you?? Was an angel walking with Jesus who told every one that he was God Almighty??
…
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Even though your post is too long to respond to all of it, I will respond to this part.

First of all, we should be discussing “The truth of Islam”, not addressing questions about Christianity.

Second, who told you that Mohammad was a messenger/prophet of Allah? Was it one of Allah’s angels? Or perhaps your parents? If so, who told them? Their parents? Did someone come down from heaven and tell every Muslim who ever lived that Mohammad was a messenger/prophet of Allah? Or was this passed down from one generation of humans to the next? Since only a few have claimed the former, it must have been the latter. So, we go back through each generation until we get to Mohammed himself. Who told his first followers that he was a messenger/prophet of Allah? Mohammed did, and who told him? Muslims say it was the Angel Gabriel, but who said this first? Mohammed. So Mohammed said the Angel Gabriel told him, making him a self-proclaimed messenger/prophet of Allah.

Any person, man or woman, can stand up and claim to have a message from God. But the question is, how are the rest of us to know whether or not that individual is actually God’s messenger of truth or if he is just pretending or delusional? What objective evidence or proofs are available to demonstrate that an individual is speaking as God’s appointed messenger? What proofs does that individual messenger point to as evidence to substantiate his claims?

In Mohammed’s case, again it is his own statement of words to the effect, “What? You don’t believe Allah’s messenger?"

So the question remains, how do you know he was not delusional, pretending, or both?
 
Byzantine_Wolf said:
With all due respect, you do realize that argumentation, which you’ve used ad nauseum all throughout this page, amounts to, “I know you are, but what am I?”, which doesn’t really answer anything.
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Hi, I just said that claims don’t confirm anything.
 
staffsgt7 said:
No it doesn’t. It isn’t even close to what the Bible says. I don’t even know how you can write this and actually think it is close to the truth.
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It do. It is close what Bible says. You don’t know? I don’t think it is my problem.
 
Young_Thinker said:
Abraham went to Egypt many years before Issac was born(I do not remember if He met King Abimilech before or after Isaac’s birth), but anyway the Pharaoh’s desire for her may have been based more upon symbolism(e.g. saying Abraham was subject to him) than on physical attraction. In any case, she looked very youthful for her age(which is not unheard of- think of the actresses Jaclyn Smith or Sophia Loren, neither of whom seem to have underwent plastic surgery). I have all of the Book of Genesis, and I never remember Abraham stating that Sarah was literally his sister(to which chapter are you referring); was not her father Abraham’s brother Haran(thus making her his niece.)? Also, being a prophet certainly does not make you sinless.
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Before meeting the king Abimilech he said that Sarah is 90 years old.

Yes some women may in old ages be like young women but they can’t be realy a 20 years old girl. Absolutly a young girl is more artractive.

And we didn’t talk about sotries. I just tries to show how are prophet of Bible and how is Muhammad.

About being sinless, I think we must talk in another place or in private messages, But a prophet doesn’t must be a liar. How can people believe what a liar says?
 
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