To Protestants: Why aren't you Catholic?

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JSmitty2005:
Malachi predicts that there will be an eternal sacrifice offered to the Father from East to West even from the Gentiles!

"For from the rising of the sun even to the going down, my name is great among the Gentiles, and in every place there is sacrifice, and there is offered to my name a clean oblation: for my name is great among the Gentiles, saith the Lord of hosts."

This eternal sacrifice transcends time and is the Precious Body and Blood of Christ in the Eucharistic Sacrifice.
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This also goes hand in hand with the Catholic perspective of suffering. We unite our sufferings with those of Christ even though He is no longer physically on the cross. That’s why you’ll hear a lot of Catholics say things like “offer it up,” meaning offer it up in union with Christ’s suffering. For more, see this.
 
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JSmitty2005:
You really, REALLY need to hear Steve Ray’s conversion story. Would you like the tape? I could send it to you. 😉
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SMitty,

Your offers to Kujo to lend him some good material are very brotherly and generous. However, your offer will bear no fruit due to the fact that Kujo is clearly not secure enough in his faith to accept your offer. He fears that what he now holds dear will be shattered by the truth of the RCC. This is evidenced by the same old tired arguments he keeps bringing to the table even after they have been refuted time after tim. Praying for him will be the best thing we can do.
 
The eucharist.
Is it a “real,” bodily presence, or is it a sacramental presence?
 
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St.Eric:
SMitty,

Your offers to Kujo to lend him some good material are very brotherly and generous. However, your offer will bear no fruit due to the fact that Kujo is clearly not secure enough in his faith to accept your offer. He fears that what he now holds dear will be shattered by the truth of the RCC. This is evidenced by the same old tired arguments he keeps bringing to the table even after they have been refuted time after tim. Praying for him will be the best thing we can do.
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You’re probably right. I just wanted to throw it out there if he or anyone else is interested.
 
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myfavoritmartin:
The eucharist.
Is it a “real,” bodily presence, or is it a sacramental presence?
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I think that the Church uses the words “real” and “sacramental” interchangeably. Either way, we believe that the Eucharist is substantially the Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity of Jesus Christ.
 
Goodness- I haven’t had time to read all the posts- I am still a Protestant(Lutheran) but my reasons for remaining so are fast dissapearing. I believe there should never have been schism- and there should be one CHurch. Not various denominations.
I still have a little trouble, however, with some Catholic ideas of salvation.
On the one hand- most protestant denominations really do border on antinomianism. I mean- you can’t just say a prayer and be saved (or be baptized as a Lutheran) and then live the way you want and see the face of God at death. The book of James does say “even the demons believe and tremble”
Of course, most evangelicals will say “well we have to obey God in gratitude for what He did for us” I just don’t think it’s that simple.
I don’t think we can just be “declared righteous” at the end- I think the Catholic Church is right in that we must co-operate in some way with our justification/sanctification(be made righteous)
On the other hand- I still have some problems withCatholic Churchs teachings that -well, you could go hell -if you didn’t confess something (a mortal sin) right before you died, ect. But meant to but didn’t have the opportunity to ( you were sorry). I still see some legalism in Catholic teaching- that’s why I’m still yet a Protestant, I guess.
 
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myfavoritmartin:
The eucharist.
Is it a “real,” bodily presence, or is it a sacramental presence?
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It is correct to say that we believe in the “real” presence of Christ in the Eucharist.
 
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Vanny:
Goodness- I haven’t had time to read all the posts- I am still a Protestant(Lutheran) but my reasons for remaining so are fast dissapearing. I believe there should never have been schism- and there should be one CHurch. Not various denominations.
I still have a little trouble, however, with some Catholic ideas of salvation.
On the one hand- most protestant denominations really do border on antinomianism. I mean- you can’t just say a prayer and be saved (or be baptized as a Lutheran) and then live the way you want and see the face of God at death. The book of James does say “even the demons believe and tremble”
Of course, most evangelicals will say “well we have to obey God in gratitude for what He did for us” I just don’t think it’s that simple.
I don’t think we can just be “declared righteous” at the end- I think the Catholic Church is right in that we must co-operate in some way with our justification/sanctification(be made righteous)
On the other hand- I still have some problems withCatholic Churchs teachings that -well, you could go hell -if you didn’t confess something (a mortal sin) right before you died, ect. But meant to but didn’t have the opportunity to ( you were sorry). I still see some legalism in Catholic teaching- that’s why I’m still yet a Protestant, I guess.
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Vanny,

Great post! Keep praying and searching, the HS will bring you home. You are almost their. I was in your shoes a few years ago and finally decided to cross the Tiber and come home. It was the best thing God has ever done for me. Keep the faith!
 
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Vanny:
I believe there should never have been schism- and there should be one CHurch.
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There was a time when Luther agreed. It’s too bad he didn’t keep to his word.

“I never approved of a schism, nor will I approve of it for all eternity… It is not by separating from the Church that we can make her better.”
-Martin Luther
On the other hand- I still have some problems withCatholic Churchs teachings that -well, you could go hell -if you didn’t confess something (a mortal sin) right before you died, ect. But meant to but didn’t have the opportunity to ( you were sorry).
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I’m sure you’ve heard this, but in 1 John 5:16-17, it says:

“If anyone sees his brother sinning, if the sin is not deadly, he should pray to God and he will give him life. This is only for those whose sin is not deadly. There is such a thing as deadly sin, about which I do not say that you should pray. All wrongdoing is sin, but there is sin that is not deadly.”

Scripture says that there is sin that is “deadly” (=mortal) in which prayer will not suffice. That is why Our Lord gave the Apostles the authority to forgive sins in John 20:22-23.

“And when he had said this, he breathed on them and said to them, ‘Receive the holy Spirit. Whose sins you forgive are forgiven them, and whose sins you retain are retained.’”

Interestingly, the only other place in the Scriptures that we find God breathing on man is when He breathed life into Adam and Eve, so this is a pretty big deal!

Finally, as long as one has contrition, I believe the Church teaches that God will have mercy on him if he had the intent of going to Confession but is killed in some freak accident.
 
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JSmitty2005:
Finally, as long as one has contrition, I believe the Church teaches that God will have mercy on him if he had the intent of going to Confession but is killed.
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Yes.
 
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myfavoritmartin:
Prostrations
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This is entirely biblical. I got this from a Protestant site:

[Prostration] was but a more intense way of showing one’s regard or of emphasizing a petition. It was the token of abject subjection or the deepest reverence. Abraham, when Yahweh appeared to him and promised him a son, with profoundest gratitude and greatest joy fell prostrate on his face (Genesis 17:3). Moses and Aaron were often found in this posture (Numbers 14:5; 16:4,45; 20:6). Elijah, eccentric in many ways, cast himself upon the earth and placed his face between his knees (compare 1 Kings 18:42). Job fell on the ground and worshipped Yahweh (Job 1:20). Such homage was often shown to our Saviour (Mark 5:22; John 11:32), not because men realized that He was God in the flesh, but simply as a mark of respect for a great teacher and miracle-worker. It is to be noticed th at our Saviour never refused such homage, but accepted it as pertinent and proper. Did He not realize that honor and worship Divine belonged to Him, He would have refused them just as Peter did when Cornelius fell down at his feet and worshipped him (Acts 10:25) or as the angel in Revelation 19:10, who said to John, prostrate at his feet, “See thou do it not: I am a fellow servant.”
 
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myfavoritmartin:
Here is a fun project for Catholics, that may help us protestants understand the sacramental aspect of your church, attach bible passages to each of the following sacramentals.
Altars
Ashes
Bells
Blessed medals
Blessed palms
Blessing of people
Bowing the head
Bows
Candles
Church buildings
Crucifixes
Exorcism
Feet washing
Fire
Folding hands
Genuflection
Holy water
Icons
Incense
Liturgical hours
Liturgical vessels
Liturgical year
Mary gardens
Minor orders
Oil
Prostrations
Religious habits
Rosaries
Salt
Scapulars
Sign of the cross
Statues
Vestments
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Begin individual threads for each of these subjects, and they will be thoroughly explained to you. 😉
 
I split the topic “project for Catholics” from this thread. It is now in Spirituality here:

I advise those who have further questions on aspects of Catholic living, to begin new threads in their appropriate forums.

Those Catholics responding to Protestants, feel free to begin new threads too if you think the topic is swaying too far from the central issue.

“Protestants: Why aren’t you Catholic?”

Thanks and God Bless-

%between%
 
I split the topic from this thread. It is now in Spirituality here:

I advise those who have further questions on aspects of Catholic living, to begin new threads in their appropriate forums.

Those Catholics responding to Protestants, feel free to begin new threads too if you think the topic is swaying too far from the central issue.

“Protestants: Why aren’t you Catholic?”

Thanks and God Bless-

%between%
 
G.K. Chesterton (Catholic convert)

"I had no more idea of becoming a Catholic than of becoming a cannibal. I imagined that I was merely pointing out that justice should be done even to cannibals . . . [but] it is impossible to be just to the Catholic Church. The moment men cease to pull against it they feel a tug towards it. The moment they cease to shout it down they begin to listen to it with pleasure. The moment they try to be fair to it they begin to be fond of it . . . "

{The Catholic Church and Conversion, NY: Macmillan, 1926, 59,62}
 
Obviously, the biblical message is that we must not worship anyone but God McCarthy’s implication that Catholics regard Mary as a goddess because she has the title “Queen of Heaven” doesn’t make any sense.

The Catholic position here may be nicely summarized in one simple sentence: Mary is Queen because Christ is King! We may conclude that the Protestant objections put forth by James McCarthy and others against the notion of Mary as Queen of Heaven are false and based on a superficial reading and shallow interpretation of the Bible and a failure to appreciate the depth and richness of God’s Written Word.

WORSHIP (dictionary.com) -

The reverent love and devotion accorded a deity, an idol, or a sacred object.
The ceremonies, prayers, or other religious forms by which this love is expressed.

To honor and love as a deity.
To regard with ardent or adoring esteem or devotion. See Synonyms at revere.

a feeling of profound love and admiration [syn: adoration] v 1: love unquestioningly and uncritically or to excess; venerate as an idol; “Many teenagers idolized the Beatles” [syn: idolize, idolise, hero-worship, revere]

Are you skirting around the defination like Bill Clinton did for “is”?

What IS your defination of “worship”? (I’ll wait for that answer)

Mary is to be respected for what she did, NOT worshipped for what the Catholic church says.

catholicconcerns.com/MaryWorship.html
remnantofgod.org/godmary.htm
 
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All those years in the church and I never heard that Jesus died for Everything I’d ever done that was wrong. I never knew he was real. I never knew he wanted me to know him in a personal way. I never knew that he could really speak to me from where he is. I never knew Jesus.

Wow dude I guess I’m lucky! My Catholic Church teaches me that every time I walk in the door and see Him hanging on the cross.
My priest also feeds us every Mass! Every Parish Mission, Every tent revival, and so on.
I guess it depends on the Parish as a whole.
 
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tom4JC:
I was Catholic for 34 years, went to Catholic school, attended services on Easter and Christmas, had my firstborn baptized, and later watched her receive first communion.

All those years in the church and I never heard that Jesus died for Everything I’d ever done that was wrong. I never knew he was real. I never knew he wanted me to know him in a personal way. I never knew that he could really speak to me from where he is. I never knew Jesus.

All that has changed. Now that I DO know those things and now that I do know Him ( I know Him only enough to know that I want to know more.) There is no reason for me to go back to a Catholic church. They would not teach me His ways, his thoughts, his heart.
Wow dude I guess I’m lucky! My Catholic Church teaches me that every time I walk in the door and see Him hanging on the cross.
My priest also feeds us every Mass! Every Parish Mission, Every tent revival, and so on.
I guess it depends on the Parish as a whole.

I need that in my life. I need Jesus Christ.
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St.Eric:
G.K. Chesterton (Catholic convert)

"I had no more idea of becoming a Catholic than of becoming a cannibal. I imagined that I was merely pointing out that justice should be done even to cannibals . . . [but] it is impossible to be just to the Catholic Church. The moment men cease to pull against it they feel a tug towards it. The moment they cease to shout it down they begin to listen to it with pleasure. The moment they try to be fair to it they begin to be fond of it . . . "

{The Catholic Church and Conversion, NY: Macmillan, 1926, 59,62}
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Actually, the moment that you want to shout to the Lord in praise, the tell you to be quiet.
I guess you have to show your joy like the cartoon character Droopy or Eeyore.
youtube.com/results?search=Droopy&sort=relevance&page=1

tapijtplaatsing.be/borduren/borduren9/droopy%20i%20am%20so%20happy.jpg
 
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kujo313:
WORSHIP (dictionary.com) -

The reverent love and devotion accorded a deity, an idol, or a sacred object.
The ceremonies, prayers, or other religious forms by which this love is expressed.
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I assume you do not know the Greek words latria and dulia. And you were once Catholic?

I think you believe providing links to Mary Ann Collins site will be useful to your evangelization of Catholics here at catholic.com.

But I just want to point out that her site has no credibility amongst the posters here.

She has already been exposed as a fraud, having converted as a teenager based on a crush on a Catholic boy and having never become a nun (though she claims to be an ex-nun) because she was rejected by a convent.

You really can’t find anyone more credible than a woman who was rejected by a convent?
 
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