To set the Record straight Catholics do not worship Mary!

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Hmmm…since we know with certainty that Jesus promised to build a single Church on the Rock, that is, on Peter, what other Church do you propose as an alternative?
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Perhaps, the Church that Christ built where all are all are Christians who have faith and believe, why build a church on a fallible man who denied Christ three times and could be swayed as any of us could be and have been. I have no problem with Peter being the first vicar of Christ however as building a church on this man I think not, our Lord and saviour built HIS Church on Himself and not on anyone else. The Rock, there is only one and always will be. He came to save us all and he did if you will allow. His message was very easy to understand, no need for 2000 years of man to embellish his accomplishments—he did it all. John the Baptist did his job and Mary ( the beloved did hers). What a wonderful God we have. As much as we discuss and argue, the fact that Jesus came to save us all is the basis of all christianity whether you give praise to the saints or whoever you ever may has no influence on your salvation. The main point is that our Lord and Savior has blessed us all with HIS blood.
Praise and Worship are His alone no one else
 
Adrift:
I am trying to understand what you mean. I don’t understand what you mean by spiritual. I had to laugh when I looked up the word and that dictionary had a Negro song:rolleyes: :confused: :rotfl:
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As I said before….you are quite good at “word play”. 😉
 
David47 said:
Perhaps, the Church that Christ built where all are all are Christians who have faith and believe, why build a church on a fallible man who denied Christ three times and could be swayed as any of us could be and have been. I have no problem with Peter being the first vicar of Christ however as building a church on this man I think not, our Lord and saviour built HIS Church on Himself and not on anyone else. The Rock, there is only one and always will be. He came to save us all and he did if you will allow. His message was very easy to understand, no need for 2000 years of man to embellish his accomplishments—he did it all. John the Baptist did his job and Mary ( the beloved did hers). What a wonderful God we have. As much as we discuss and argue, the fact that Jesus came to save us all is the basis of all christianity whether you give praise to the saints or whoever you ever may has no influence on your salvation. The main point is that our Lord and Savior has blessed us all with HIS blood.
Praise and Worship are His alone no one else
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This is another thread and not the subject of this one. If you wish to discuss this try this
Which is the Rock
How can people believe Peter is the rock but still not be Catholic?
Or start your own thread.
Our Lord said that He was building His Church on Peter.
BTW welcome to the forums.
 
Adrift:
I am trying to understand what you mean. I don’t understand what you mean by spiritual. I had to laugh when I looked up the word and that dictionary had a Negro song.:rolleyes: :confused: :rotfl:
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I should have said “spiritually”! Does that help! 🙂

Regarding the 1913 and Webster’s definitions, I don’t see where I disagree with any of their definitions…they state plainly what worship/veneration is:

Worship (1913)
  1. To respect; to honor; to treat with civil reverence. [Obsoles.] Chaucer.
    Our grave . . . shall have a tongueless mouth, Not worshiped with a waxen epitaph. Shak.
    This holy image that is man God worshipeth. Foxe.
  2. To pay divine honors to; to reverence with supreme respect and veneration; to perform religious exercises in honor of; to adore; to venerate. But God is to be worshiped. Shak.
    When all our fathers worshiped stocks and stones. Milton.
  3. To honor with extravagant love and extreme submission, as a lover; to adore; to idolize.
    With bended knees I daily worship her. Carew.
    Syn. – To adore; revere; reverence; bow to; honor.
Merriam Webster online

Worship
Function:
verb
Inflected Form(s):
worshipped also worshiped; worship•ping also worship•ing
Date:
13th century
transitive verb 1 : to honor or reverence as a divine being or supernatural power 2 : to regard with great or extravagant respect, honor, or devotion intransitive verb : to perform or take part in worship or an act of worship
 
David47
Perhaps, the Church that Christ built where all are all are Christians who have faith and believe, why build a church on a fallible man who denied Christ three times and could be swayed as any of us could be and have been. I have no problem with Peter being the first vicar of Christ however as building a church on this man I think not, our Lord and saviour built HIS Church on Himself and not on anyone else. The Rock, there is only one and always will be. He came to save us all and he did if you will allow. His message was very easy to understand, no need for 2000 years of man to embellish his accomplishments—he did it all. John the Baptist did his job and Mary ( the beloved did hers). What a wonderful God we have. As much as we discuss and argue, the fact that Jesus came to save us all is the basis of all christianity whether you give praise to the saints or whoever you ever may has no influence on your salvation. The main point is that our Lord and Savior has blessed us all with HIS blood.
Praise and Worship are His alone no one else.
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I don’t think you’ll have any problem with the Catholic posters on here who say that “worship” is His alone….as the thread is about just that……they claim to “worship” Him and claim that they “do not worship” Mary.

A lot of time and effort has gone into the development of this claim over the years by the Catholic Church…to the point of separating worship into different ……degrees?..in order to clarify the issue for everyone.

Most of the Catholics that have been posting here are sure they know exactly how they “venerate” Mary…some even assert that ALL Catholics are as sure as they are, by the clarity of the definition of the word “worship”….as set out by the Catholic Church.

I’ve been attempting to express that this is not the case, that not all Catholics are clear on the teachings/definitions, whatever….however it’s gotten off onto a lot of bantering about of “word play”. I’m guilty! :rolleyes:
 
Randy_Carson said:
So, you also believe the Church was not protected from the “gates of Hell” as Jesus promised and that it fell into error needing reformation. Does this make Jesus a liar?
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Absolutely not. Reformations I believe have to take place because of man going atray, not Jesus. This is precisely what protects his Church from hell.
 
SIA said:
Absolutely not. Reformations I believe have to take place because of man going atray, not Jesus. This is precisely what protects his Church from hell.
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But the “reformed” eclaisial bodies are not the same Church at all.They are man-made organizations not the one instituted by God Himself,Jesus Christ.If you wish to see the vast chasm between the True Church,the Holy Catholic Church and these thousands and thousands of denominated bodies read the early Church Fathers.The Catholic Church is THAT Church which they describe.

Remermber that Christ prayed for us all to be one in the garden of Gethsemene.Which we were for 1500 years until a secular King and a few heretic Catholic priests decided to create faiths in their own image.

Obviously I exclude the Orthodox as they are merely in schism and are the other lung of the True Church.👍
 
Soutane said:
But the “reformed” eclaisial bodies are not the same Church at all.They are man-made organizations not the one instituted by God Himself,Jesus Christ.If you wish to see the vast chasm between the True Church,the Holy Catholic Church and these thousands and thousands of denominated bodies read the early Church Fathers.The Catholic Church is THAT Church which they describe.

Remermber that Christ prayed for us all to be one in the garden of Gethsemene.Which we were for 1500 years until a secular King and a few heretic Catholic priests decided to create faiths in their own image.

Obviously I exclude the Orthodox as they are merely in schism and are the other lung of the True Church.👍
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We obviously disagree on what exactly is the one true Church that Christ established and also on what the Reformation was and what it accomplished. In no way could I ever be convinced that one church operated by men in a span for over 2,000 years without reformation or recondition could remain the one holy catholic and apostolic Church that Christ established. This is a fallacy that is not supported by Scripture even though Catholics will argue that it does.
 
sid maybe its time to take off the bkinds your works—". In no way could I ever be convinced "
 
SIA said:
We obviously disagree on what exactly is the one true Church that Christ established and also on what the Reformation was and what it accomplished. **In no way could I ever be convinced that one church operated by men in a span for over 2,000 years without reformation or recondition could remain the one holy catholic and apostolic Church that Christ established. **This is a fallacy that is not supported by Scripture even though Catholics will argue that it does.
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Nor I.

However, it is God who has done this, not men…just as Jesus promised.

However, a Church in need of reform is a Church that has gone astray.

A Church that has gone astray has been overcome by the “gates of hell” for it no longer holds to the straight and narrow.

If God uses “reformations” to protect His Church from the “gates of hell”, then what happens to those people who live in that period of, oh, I dunno, 50-100 years just prior to the reformation?

The Church is “off the rails” and reformation is on the way…but it hasn’t occurred just yet.

It would seem that the Church has failed them by its false teachings and so has God by not keeping His Church on track or sending the reformation sooner.

Your thoughts?
 
SIA said:
We obviously disagree on what exactly is the one true Church that Christ established and also on what the Reformation was and what it accomplished. In no way could I ever be convinced that one church operated by men in a span for over 2,000 years without reformation or recondition could remain the one holy catholic and apostolic Church that Christ established. This is a fallacy that is not supported by Scripture even though Catholics will argue that it does.
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is it protesters of the True Church supported by Scriptures? where? where in Scriptures says that protesters should go around preaching against Jesus Church?

is it a matter of fact i think St Paul says that if any man want to leave, let him go, who knows if he ever will be saved. it happened to ML.

i like when father Corapi said “if anyone speaks against the Church and claim to have the HS he is lying, only the spirit of this world would come against the Church.”

**
Pray for the Church of Jesus. she is attacked from all sides.**
 
If we’re right,they’re wrong.Very threatening.Especially to former Catholics.Hence,“In no way could I ever be convinnced”.Read the ECF.Please.And return to your Faith.Please.
 
**Originally Posted by David47 **
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Perhaps, the Church that Christ built where all are all are Christians who have faith and believe, why build a church on a fallible man who denied Christ three times and could be swayed as any of us could be and have been. I have no problem with Peter being the first vicar of Christ however as building a church on this man I think not, our Lord and saviour built HIS Church on Himself and not on anyone else. The Rock, there is only one and always will be. He came to save us all and he did if you will allow. His message was very easy to understand, no need for 2000 years of man to embellish his accomplishments—he did it all. John the Baptist did his job and Mary ( the beloved did hers). What a wonderful God we have. As much as we discuss and argue, the fact that Jesus came to save us all is the basis of all christianity whether you give praise to the saints or whoever you ever may has no influence on your salvation. The main point is that our Lord and Savior has blessed us all with HIS blood.
Praise and Worship are His alone no one else.
Click to expand...
Response Adrift:
This is another thread and not the subject of this one. If you wish to discuss this try this
*Which is the Rock
How can people believe Peter is the rock but still not be Catholic?*Or start your own thread.
Our Lord said that He was building His Church on Peter.
BTW welcome to the forums.
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Hey David47…looks like your post fits in afterall!!! 🤷
 
wisdomseeker said:
i like when father Corapi said “if anyone speaks against the Church and claim to have the HS he is lying, only the spirit of this world would come against the Church.”
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Fr. Corapi also said that it is far better to be a good Protestant than it is to be a bad Catholic.
 
Randy_Carson said:
Nor I.

However, it is God who has done this, not men…just as Jesus promised.[BI don’t agree.**

However, a Church in need of reform is a Church that has gone astray.This is a sinful world and all have fallen short of the grace of God so it is absolutely conceivable.

A Church that has gone astray has been overcome by the “gates of hell” for it no longer holds to the straight and narrow.**I don’t think so. This is why reformation is needed so that the Church does not become overtaken by the gates of hell. **

If God uses “reformations” to protect His Church from the “gates of hell”, then what happens to those people who live in that period of, oh, I dunno, 50-100 years just prior to the reformation?Everything happens in God’s time. Proverbs tells us not to count on our own understanding but to adhere to our faith.

The Church is “off the rails” and reformation is on the way…but it hasn’t occurred just yet.

It would seem that the Church has failed them by its false teachings and so has God by not keeping His Church on track or sending the reformation sooner.Why does God allow some people to die of cancer but yet miraculously cures others?

Your thoughts?
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Soutane said:
If we’re right,they’re wrong.Very threatening.Especially to former Catholics.Hence,“In no way could I ever be convinnced”.Read the ECF.Please.And return to your Faith.Please.
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Or - If you’re wrong,they’re right.Very threatening. Especially to those, in the Catholic Church who believe that they have the sole responsibility in the “shepherding of His flock” by encouraging them to worship anyone other than God. Hence,“the confusion”. Read and study the scriptures.Please.And place your faith in HIM.Please.

Are we back on topic now?:confused:
 
Leeann said:
Or - If you’re wrong,they’re right.Very threatening. Especially to those, in the Catholic Church who believe that they have the sole responsibility in the “shepherding of His flock” by encouraging them to worship anyone other than God. Hence,“the confusion”. Read and study the scriptures.Please.And place your faith in HIM.Please.

Are we back on topic now?:confused:
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Leeann you are on the border of being disrespectful of the Catholic Religion. Actually you have gone over it. You have a wit that sometimes cuts without charity. The Catholic Church encourages worship to God alone. We were talking about definition of worship. By definition it means to believe that you are giving “any action that is focussed on and gives all honor and glory to God.” This is your definition. Note you say to God. In order for it to be worship, the person must believe that they are giving honor and glory to God. There is no confusion in God’s Church, The Catholic Church. The confusion comes from those who wish to deny Jesus’ words be it divorce or His establishing a Church with Peter as its head. Jesus’ first miracle was one He did not wish to perform but did so at the bequest of His mother. Mary said from now on all ages will call me blessed. We do not worship her for that alone belongs to God.
Most of the Catholics that have been posting here are sure they know exactly how they “venerate” Mary…some even assert that ALL Catholics are as sure as they are, by the clarity of the definition of the word “worship”….as set out by the Catholic Church.
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I’ve been attempting to express that this is not the case, that not all Catholics are clear on the teachings/definitions, whatever….however it’s gotten off onto a lot of bantering about of “word play”. I’m guilty!
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You try to say that not all Catholics are clear on the teachings/definitions. Generalizations will always find an exception. The old saying is the exception proves the rule. It doesn’t matter if there are some who do not understand their religion. Sometimes it is those with simple faith that put you and me to shame. What the Church teaches is what matters. I haven’t ever met a Catholic who says Mary is God. Although I did run into a website:bigyikes: that said this. Catholics do not worship Mary. Have you ever been to a mass? It is all about the worship of Jesus.
 
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