Tolerance is satans message

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Other Eric:
Hi kev7!

Ok, so let’s say that the word tolerance is hopelessly lost. Let’s articulate policy. Let’s say a sinner moves in next door. How does your tolerance-free ethic require you to respond to him?
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If for example, that person was a prostitute. I would want to encurage her to change.

Once I was sure that I did not hold any distain for her I would approach her. If I had to pray to God until I did not feel any I’ll emotion toward her I would.

Through a conversation, I would give her a reason to change and I would pray for her. I would also pray that the Holy Spirit would allow me to plant a seed in her heart and give me the wisdom to do so.

I would never approve of anything she does and she would know that I did not agree. I would be kind regarding my intolerance for her behavior, but I would not cast a stone at her. If she needed help with something I would help her, but I would never just tolerate her sin.

I would feel guilty if I just tolerated her and never said anything. In other words, I would not ignore the Holy Spirit.
 
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pnewton:
We are not outside of time. We sin over and over confessing the same sins and committing the same sins and still do not diminish the mercy of God. The perfection of Christian tolerance is found in the phrase, “Forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us.”

Tolerance is not (as Elizabeth out it) the golden standard, but neither should it be dismissed as a way station on the path to perfection. In Eric’s scenario, how do we respond to the homosexual, co-habiting couple or drug addict? Are we so intolerant with the sin that we sacrifice the sinner? Thanks be to God that he has not done that with us.

I am not ready to give in to media abuse of a perfectly good term. How many times must we forgive our brother?

70 X 7

Sounds pretty tolerant to me.
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My point is that it is not tolerance that is the basis for forgivness.

Love is only basis of forgivness

Only love is forgiving and kind. Love never keeps a list of wrongs or rights.

It is love that is found in the phrase, “Forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us.” Not tolerance.

Tolerance implies that you hold a grievance of some kind against that person

Tolerance is based on distain and fear. It is satan who tolerates God. He does not love him he only tolerates him.
 
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kev7:
Tolerance implies that you hold a grievance of some kind against that person

Tolerance is based on distain and fear. It is satan who tolerates God. He does not love him he only tolerates him.
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I’m from the south. We do not always speak the same language as others. (like the word "tolerable) I think I have totally misunderstood your definition.

I am sorry and thanks for your tolerance.
 
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kev7:
If for example, that person was a prostitute. I would want to encurage her to change.

Once I was sure that I did not hold any distain for her I would approach her. If I had to pray to God until I did not feel any I’ll emotion toward her I would.

Through a conversation, I would give her a reason to change and I would pray for her. I would also pray that the Holy Spirit would allow me to plant a seed in her heart and give me the wisdom to do so.

I would never approve of anything she does and she would know that I did not agree. I would be kind regarding my intolerance for her behavior, but I would not cast a stone at her. If she needed help with something I would help her, but I would never just tolerate her sin.

I would feel guilty if I just tolerated her and never said anything. In other words, I would not ignore the Holy Spirit.
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Hi kev7!

So, it seems to me that we are on the same page. We make our objections known, we never approve, but we also allow her the space to make up her own mind and form her own conscience. I would have called this tolerance but perhaps that word now comes laden with too much baggage to be effective any more.

I’m not sure that I would pray to have no feeling towards her. I would rather pray to love her in the manner that Christ does. True indifference is a symptom of the psychotic and by extension, one of Satan’s virtues.
 
Kev7 and Other Eric - I think you guys are on the same page and the right track…it is so difficult to love those we know are doing wrong. BUT I guess if it was easy, everyone would be a Christian and a Catholic!
 
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pnewton:
I’m from the south. We do not always speak the same language as others. (like the word "tolerable) I think I have totally misunderstood your definition.

I am sorry and thanks for your tolerance.
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very funny. I’ll make an exception and be tolerant of you.
🙂

i guess I’ve noticed that the word is being courpted here in canada. I forgot that it may not be in other places.
 
Other Eric:
Hi kev7!

So, it seems to me that we are on the same page. We make our objections known, we never approve, but we also allow her the space to make up her own mind and form her own conscience. I would have called this tolerance but perhaps that word now comes laden with too much baggage to be effective any more.

I’m not sure that I would pray to have no feeling towards her. I would rather pray to love her in the manner that Christ does. True indifference is a symptom of the psychotic and by extension, one of Satan’s virtues.
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I always find that when something is disturbing to me it starts an emotional reaction. I think it is best to pray to God to help you deal with that pain. Then once you have taken the log out of your own eye you can help your brother out.
 
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LSK:
Kev7 and Other Eric - I think you guys are on the same page and the right track…it is so difficult to love those we know are doing wrong. BUT I guess if it was easy, everyone would be a Christian and a Catholic!
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Yes it is very difficult to love those who do us wrong, but that is the point of Christs message.

It is much easier to tolerate them and that is why I think that message is twisted.
 
Luke 9,54: “Lord, do you want us to call down fire from heaven to consume them?” jesus teaching tolerance?
 
So far I got these candidate explanations of this “tolerance” word:
  1. Tolerance means you should not judge somebody when, in fact, you should.
  2. Tolerance means you have a problem with somebody and therefore have judged them, but “put up” with it, perhaps condescendingly.
  3. Tolerance means you agree with a certain political view, or keep silent when you should disagree.
  4. Tolerance means you learn to live with patience in a pluralistic society full of sinners.
  5. How far something may be off from a standard and still be acceptable.
As an engineer, I have routinely been concerned with various types tolerance such as fault tolerance, in a machine. In other words, how well is the machine designed so that if something does go wrong it does not get damaged? Then again, we can be “out of tolerance” meaning something is unacceptably far off the standard.

The best way to design communications systems, I always think, is to be a precise speaker and a tolerant listener. That allows for some immunity from a noisy channel.

Many engineers really don’t understand tolerance and fault sensitivity very well, either mathematically or intuitively. It analogous to the sway in skyscrapers. The Standard Oil Building in Chicago, for example, can sway over a foot; it is designed flexible so it will not bend.

There are analogous lessons that can be taken from this and applied to all sort of metaphors. I can construct scenarios which use “tolerance” in good and bad ways. I’d say “tolerance is satan’s message” is perhaps only one of several ways to look at it, without supplied context. “Tolerance is satan’s message” can easily be usurped to state, “God would have us all be intolerant of each other.” So far I didn’t get the memo that it can no longer be used without connotating evil, like the word “gay.”

Alan
 
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barsapp:
Luke 9,54: “Lord, do you want us to call down fire from heaven to consume them?” jesus teaching tolerance?
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Luke 9,55: “Jesus turned and rebuked them”

Yes.
 
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kev7:
There is a lot of talk today about the concept of tolerance.

“We should all learn to tolerate each other”

In my mind this is a counterfeit truth created by Satan.

Jesus said that we should pray for our enemies and love our neighbor.

Tolerance implies that you first despise the other person and force yourself to live with him around.

I think this is an important truth that needs to be made known by the Catholic Church.
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Tolerance is not of Satan nor is it a sin. It is a virtue, in fact. However, what you are seeing is tolerance applied to the exclusion of all other virtues. And whenever people do that, they turn a virtue into a vice, letting the virtue “run wild” as G. K. Chesterton so aptly put it.

Tolerance must be balanced with truth, just as truth has to be balanced with love or it is no longer a virtue. All the virtues have a counterbalance virtue and none of them ought to be practiced to the exclusion of any of the others or they lose their proper meaning to become evils instead of goods.
 
Traditionally speaking, the word “tolerance” has a positive meaning. For example, “religious tolerance” is the traditional position of the Church regarding the existence of different religions. But “religious freedom” leads to relativism (freedom without Truth).
 
Maybe I’ve been looking at this wrong.

I’ve been defending the legitimate use of the word “tolerance.”

Maybe what you guys are saying is that there is a certain sinister usage for it that it trying to take control of the word?

If that’s the case, please give more examples. If this is a modern political trend then I am interested more in what is being said and how it’s being applied and countered, than about the fact we all agree to, that “tolerance” does have positive connotations, but multiple meanings that could be contsrued “good” or “bad.”

Is that why it seems like we are in Violent Agreement? We are arguing two different angles of the issue?

Alan
 
“America, it is said, is suffering from intolerance—it is not. It is suffering from tolerance. Tolerance of right and wrong, truth and error, virtue and evil, Christ and chaos. Our country is not nearly so overrun with the bigoted as it is overrun with the broadminded.
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    “Tolerance is an attitude of reasoned patience toward evil . . . a forbearance that restrains us from showing anger or inflicting punishment.  Tolerance applies only to persons . . . never to truth.  Tolerance applies to the erring, intolerance to the error . . . Architects are as intolerant about sand as foundations for skyscrapers as doctors are intolerant about germs in the laboratory.  Tolerance does not apply to truth or principles.  About these things we must be intolerant, and for this kind of intolerance, so much needed to rouse us from sentimental gush, I make a plea.  Intolerance of this kind is the foundation of all stability.”
–Archbishop Fulton Sheen
 
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Genesis315:
–Archbishop Fulton Sheen
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Thank you for this quote.

It seems he is saying that “tolerance” isn’t necessarily wrong, but that the word gets misapplied to situations where it doesn’t.

Is that what anyone else gets out of this?

If that’s what he’s saying, then I can see that when a word is expanded in meaning then attitudes which apply to it are altered as well?

Alan
 
Tolerance. Are we to be tolerant? Tolerance means to “put up with”.
To allow them to practice a what ever you disagree with. It is insinuated that one not only is to be tolerant but they are to water down their own beliefs and champion the beliefs of the other man.

I am not tolerant. There are a few things that I am not tolerant of on a consistant basis. I am not tolerant of people who hold hands during the “Our Father” nor do I put my palms up and point to the priest during the responce. “And also with you”. I sit as far away from other parishioners as I can, for about half of the people do not follow GIRM. They make up stuff and I am not tolerant of that. It is OK to not to be tolerant of wrong practices.

To push the envelope. Are you tolerant of teachers who teach kids false doctrine, or how about this, are you tolerant of ABORTION?
 
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AlanFromWichita:
Thank you for this quote.

It seems he is saying that “tolerance” isn’t necessarily wrong, but that the word gets misapplied to situations where it doesn’t.

Is that what anyone else gets out of this?

If that’s what he’s saying, then I can see that when a word is expanded in meaning then attitudes which apply to it are altered as well?

Alan
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That’s how I understand it, Alan. The word ‘tolerance’ seems to have been hijacked to mean ‘total agreement with’ or maybe ‘legitimate’. My love and tolerance for all people is a Catholic Christian virtue but it doesn’t mean I agree with the actions of all people - which is why it is such a difficult virtue for me to practice! After all, it is always easy to love those who I agree with, right? The challenge for me is to love, simply love.
For instance, there is someone posting who is calling me a heretic for quoting the Catechism! I have to love him, but I know his opinion means nothing. Still, it would be so much easier if EVERYONE loved me and AGREED with me all the time…lolololol…:rotfl:
 
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