Top papal aide says Vatican ‘worried’ about Trump’s refugee order

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pnewton said:
I remembers something similar to that, but I do not think he worded that way, if it is the quote I remember. Without a link or time to search for this, I can’t take the last part of that statement as accurate.
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No, it is accurate. The Pope has indicated that too many refugees interfere with human dignity.
 
gracepoole said:
It absolutely is if our government has failed to provide an explanation of why this ban is necessary and just.
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It has provided a reasonable explanation of why the ban is necessary and just. You just don’t agree with it. I do.
I…I’m at a loss. You want to listen to a politician because his views line up with your own instead of being challenged by the Holy Father’s. I think we’re completely through the looking glass here.
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I’ve got kids rioting in my town, setting cars on fire, shooting a Sanders supporter because he ‘may have been a white supremacist.’ (still in critical condition) All in support of a more open, tolerant America. The Holy Father is just icing on the cake.
 
FollowChrist34 said:
I’ve got kids rioting in my town, setting cars on fire, shooting a Sanders supporter because he ‘may have a been a white supremacist.’ (still in critical condition) All in support of a more open, tolerant America. The Holy Father is just icing on the cake.
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What does any of that have to do with Pope Francis’ comments about the ways in which we view refugees? :confused:
 
gracepoole said:
What does any of that have to do with Pope Francis’ comments about the ways in which we view refugees? :confused:
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He is commenting in response to Trump’s actions. Ditto the protestors. In support of a more tolerant America. That is all I meant there. Besides I view refugees the same as the Pope does. I just believe a nation has a right to revise policies on vetting refugees with respect to potential terrorists in specific situations. I feel pretty good about being able to do both.
 
FollowChrist34 said:
I’ve got kids rioting in my town, setting cars on fire, shooting a Sanders supporter because he ‘may have been a white supremacist.’ (still in critical condition) All in support of a more open, tolerant America.
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I have my issues with the tactics demonstrators are using but it seems strange to lump the shooting of an anti-white supremacy protester by a Trump supporter in with the protests as if it’s all coming from one side.
 
FollowChrist34 said:
I just believe a nation has a right to revise policies on refugees with respect to potential terrorists.
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Are the current refugee vetting policies inadequate at keeping terrorists out of the country, and if not how are they not adequate?
 
lmachine said:
I have my issues with the tactics demonstrators are using but it seems strange to lump the shooting of an anti-white supremacy protester by a Trump supporter in with the protests as if it’s all coming from one side.
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The shooter was not a Trump supporter. He was acting in self defense against someone he perceived to be a ‘white supremacist’ but who was actually a Sanders supporter.
 
FollowChrist34 said:
He is commenting in response to Trump’s actions. Ditto the protestors. In support of a more tolerant America. That is all I meant there. Besides I view refugees the same as the Pope does. I just believe a nation has a right to revise policies on vetting refugees with respect to potential terrorists in specific situations. I feel pretty good about being able to do both.
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Refugees have not been shown to be a threat to you re: terrorists. We’re barring refugees without rational justification and while we’re doing it, people are dying.
 
gracepoole said:
Refugees have not been shown to be a threat to you re: terrorists. We’re barring refugees without rational justification and while we’re doing it, people are dying.
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Lets be clear, you don’t think there’s rational justification. Many others do.
 
gracepoole said:
Refugees have not been shown to be a threat to you re: terrorists. We’re barring refugees without rational justification and while we’re doing it, people are dying.
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I am fine with you believing this. I don’t believe it. You don’t seem to be able to handle that.
 
Michael68 said:
Lets be clear, you don’t think there’s rational justification. Many others do.
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FollowChrist34 said:
I am fine with you believing this. I don’t believe it. You don’t seem to be able to handle that.
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Please! I am all ears! Explain how a fear of refugee terrorists is rational. In order to be persuasive, the following will have to happen: 1) Explain the vetting process under the Obama administration, 2) Explain why it was insufficient, and 3) Explain how a 1 in 3.6 billion chance of being killed by a refugee terrorist is a rational fear.
 
FollowChrist34 said:
The shooter was not a Trump supporter. He was acting in self defense against someone he perceived to be a ‘white supremacist’ but who was actually a Sanders supporter.
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None of us have enough information to make a judgment on whether it was self-defense, but the shooter was a Trump supporter. That’s a fact.
 
SuperLuigi said:
I look forward to such discussion on upcoming threads of traditional marriage, gender, and abortion. 👍
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Well, that brings up an interesting point. I disagree with the Church on some issues, as any search of my posting history will show. But in the many years I have been posting here I have never 1) claimed the Pope lacks authority to speak for the Church, 2) claimed the bishops’ teachings were merely “personal opinions” not worthy of respect or weight or 3) suggested the Pope and bishops were taking stances for financial gain. None of those arguments would have been tolerated here, nor should they be. But all are on full display by those that disagree with the Church’s stance on immigration, refugees, care for the poor, health care, and other issues. Disagreeing, and expressing disagreement is everyone’s right. But claiming any of the three above crosses an important line.
 
TMC said:
Well, that brings up an interesting point. I disagree with the Church on some issues, as any search of my posting history will show. But in the many years I have been posting here I have never 1) claimed the Pope lacks authority to speak for the Church, 2) claimed the bishops’ teachings were merely “personal opinions” not worthy of respect or weight or 3) suggested the Pope and bishops were taking stances for financial gain. None of those arguments would have been tolerated here, nor should they be. But all are on full display by those that disagree with the Church’s stance on immigration, refugees, care for the poor, health care, and other issues. Disagreeing, and expressing disagreement is everyone’s right. But claiming any of the three above crosses an important line.
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👍
 
gracepoole said:
Refugees have not been shown to be a threat to you re: terrorists. We’re barring refugees without rational justification and while we’re doing it, people are dying.
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There is rational justification. The risk of terror from those nations is great. Even president Obama implemented a similar policy for six years and none of the people speaking out loudly now I’ve heard said a thing.

As far as dying goes, not even the American federal government can stop that.

If people really are that interested, they need to go and help. Complaining on-line will not help. :nope:

To be frank, I don’t think a lot of people in society really care that much about refugees. This is all about using them to undermine President Trump in the usual manner that republican politicians are attacked.

I’ve seen this same kind of signaling theory at work before and it’s very disturbing.
 
gracepoole said:
Please! I am all ears! Explain how a fear of refugee terrorists is rational. In order to be persuasive, the following will have to happen: 1) Explain the vetting process under the Obama administration, 2) Explain why it was insufficient, and 3) Explain how a 1 in 3.6 billion chance of being killed by a refugee terrorist is a rational fear.
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  1. It was a mix of good and bad, but basically the Administration ignored its own intelligence officials one too many times.
  2. The Boston Marathon bombing showed us we have a failed migration movement policy.
  3. That is debatable and those odds come down anyways if we admit people from high-risk areas.
 
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