Transitional Fossils and the Theory of Evolution in relation to Genesis Accounts

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rossum said:
Not always. They are very careful to allow the possibility of intelligent aliens as the designers just to show that they are not following a religious agenda. They do seem to be doing less of that recently as the mask has slipped rather too many times.
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Dawkins is the one that posits alien design.
 
I do not deny that God designed this universe, meticulously tailoring all its physical laws to give rise to man at the end of a very long period of growth. God wound up the watch, and let things proceed. Then, at a certain time God determined correct, He ensouled a human couple and the rest is history.
 
buffalo said:
Dawkins is the one that posits alien design
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Yes. What he said was that even if life on earth had been designed by aliens, the aliens would have had to have evolved. If you want to take that as positing alien design then you are satisfied with, shall we say, less than the full truth.
 
PickyPicky said:
Yes. What he said was that even if life on earth had been designed by aliens, the aliens would have had to have evolved. If you want to take that as positing alien design then you are satisfied with, shall we say, less than the full truth.
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Of course he did. But we are speaking of what he refers to as “the illusion of design in biology”. (on earth)
 
buffalo said:
Do you deny design is detectable?
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In general, no it is not. It may be detectable in specific instances. In other instances it is not detectable.

For example the output of a well designed random number generator will detect as random, not designed.

Similarly, the output of a non-design process can appear to be designed, such as the arrangement of the pebbles on Chesil Beach:
The pebbles on Chesil Beach are graded in size from potato-sized near Portland to pea-sized at Bridport and are made up of mainly flint and chert from the Cretaceous and Jurassic rocks, along with Bunter pebbles from Budleigh Salterton. It is believed that smugglers landing on the beach at night could could judge their position along the coast simply by picking up a handful of shingle.
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rossum said:
In general, no it is not. It may be detectable in specific instances. In other instances it is not detectable.
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Just look around you. Presumably you are in a room somewhere on your computer. How many things around you are designed and how do you know?
 
buffalo said:
Dawkins is the one that posits alien design.
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Are you saying that ID denies the possibility of alien design? Does that mean you think that SETI is useless, since there is no alien design out there to detect?
 
rossum said:
Are you saying that ID denies the possibility of alien design? Does that mean you think that SETI is useless, since there is no alien design out there to detect?
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How did you get that? Dawkins wanted to make sure we all knew we could accept life on earth was designed as long as we understand that the aliens who designed it evolved. This is to preserve his atheism. Geesh…
 
buffalo said:
How many things around you are designed and how do you know?
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The grain in the wood of my desk is not designed. The metal fitments of the desk are designed. My room contains a mix of the designed and the undesigned.
 
Can you tell me first why it’s relevant? I’ll answer afterwards.
 
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buffalo said:
Should I conclude you do not think design is detectable?
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We are not too bad at classifying things as man-made and non-man-made, if that’s what you mean. That’s because experience gives us knowledge of what kinds of thing humans make.

That enables me to detect that this iPad is man-made, but that cat isn’t.
 
buffalo said:
How do you know which of these are designed?
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How do you know? How can you check my answers if you do not have a validated design detector? Do you have a paper showing the results of a double blind test of various design detection methods? If ID is science then it needs scientific research and evidence to support its claims.
 
rossum said:
How do you know? How can you check my answers if you do not have a validated design detector? Do you have a paper showing the results of a double blind test of various design detection methods? If ID is science then it needs scientific research and evidence to support its claims.
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The reality is you can look around and tell me what is designed. I asked - how you knew.
 
We have knowledge of what humans make and what’s natural because of what we’re taught. We are not innately able to sense what is designed or not.
 
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