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Lily_Bernans
Guest
I think infatuation stays with you after the speech is over.
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Tomdstone
Guest
Yes, considering her strong and unwavering support for expanding the right to abortions, Hillary’s speeches are so very inspiring to those who want to murder their unborn children. And they are also inspiring to those who demand that religious beliefs be changed to what Hillary thinks they should be.
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Lily_Bernans
Guest
She hasn’t mentioned changing religious beliefs in any of them, and she referred to “women’s rights,” in only one.
Really, there are many, many other issues, most of them just as important as abortion. Christ would have died for one single person. Those who are already born are just as important as those who are not yet born. The great mistake of pro-birthers is overlooking that fact. Who will care for babies, who are helpless, by the way, if their parents can’t afford to feed and clothe them and obtain medical care for them? Who will educate them when they grow? How will they find jobs in a decimated US?
I’m not a proponent of abortion, but the pro-birth movement really turns me off. Get 'em born and then forget 'em! That is their motto.
I’m not speaking of you or anyone in particular, just an anonymous group who seems to focus on birth only. Adults were babies once, too. Newborns will become adults. The pro-birthers should realize that and care what kind of world children are born into. What good is it to even be born if a person can’t live a decent life? What kind of America is it when half of all Americans can’t come up with $400? This isn’t a world I’d want to bring a child into. Not the way it is now.
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josie_L
Guest
And what do you expect the pro-life movement to do, i.e., besides saving babies and supporting moms via pregnancy crisis centers and offering counseling (pre/post abortion), which by the way is already a gargantuan task considering the state of our culture and the more than millions of babies being killed per year?
Moreover, why don’t pro-abortion/choice advocates who are so inclined to criticize the movement help those children pro-lifers save? Do you think it’s a viable/moral solution to simply criticize and condemn pro-lifers, while standing on the sidelines watching these children live “miserable” lives?
What are the pro-abortion/choice advocates doing to help these children or are they too smug to help?
p.s. By the way, the pro-life movement is also involved in deterring the euthanasia movement (and that entails a lot more than you think).
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Lily_Bernans
Guest
Making sure anyone who wants an education and can learn can get that education.
Making sure everyone in the US has affordable health care that covers medical, vision, and dental expenses. Too many people do not think dental health is a part of general health, but it is. And dentists’ fees have now rendered dental care something “only for the rich.” Even dental insurance doesn’t cover much but routine cleanings.
Making sure no one is homeless even if you have to take the homeless into your own home and feed and clothe them.
Making sure no on goes to bed hungry.
Making sure everyone has a bed!
Making sure jobs that pay a living wage are available to all.
I believe the pro-life movement, in advocating that all the unborn be brought into the world, are obligated to ensure all of the above even if they have to pay some of the bills personally.
And, please tell me how you know what I know about euthanasia? I’ve been a hospice volunteer all my grown life - so far. Please don’t make assumptions about what I know and what I don’t know and what I think. Thank you.
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_Abyssinia
Guest
What pro-birth movement?! Who is a pro-birther? Who has the motto “Get 'em born and then forget 'em”? I’m not saying you are pro-choice or pro-abortion, but it’s unfortunate that you are making a similar argument that they make, Do you really know what the pro-life movement does? They help women with adoption advice, getting education, job seeking, help with housing, legal aid, financial help, clothes etc. for their baby.
You comment about a “decimated US” in regards to jobs - who has been president for the last seven years? Democrat Barack Obama. The Democrats have had the power of the presidency for those years, so perhaps you should be holding Barack Obama more responsible, if you aren’t already, for the situation in the job market, because while the job market is not entirely down to one administration, the president is at the top politically, and any administration’s policies are likely to have some effect on the job market. For example, look at the effect of the ACA and the whole thing with part time work and how that has apparently effected job expansion.
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Lily_Bernans
Guest
Democrats need more than eight years to repair what Repubs. wrecked. And Congress refuses to work with Obama, as many on this forum have indicated. Life was stable and good under Bill Clinton.
Obama is president; he’s not a miracle worker. Well, maybe he is! It’s a miracle he’s had so many accomplishments during his eight years as president with the entire Repub. Party against him. (And I’ve posted his accomplishments many times.)
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estesbob
Guest
So people who oppose killing children should be required to pay for the upbringing of other Peoples children but the people who support killing children merely need to demand higher taxes ( on other people of course ) to pay for the upbringing of other people’s children .?
Of course since Catholic Church in the forefront of protecting the unborn I suspect there should be a special levy on each week’s collection to pay the expenses of those children not killed because the Churches efforts
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estesbob
Guest
Do you include our church as a “pro-birther”? Is being pro-birth a bad thing ? It appears that you are coming dangerously close to espousing the better dead than underfed philosophy that so much infuses the modern Left - a primary component of the culture of death.
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Vouthon
Guest
While I’m not his greatest fan (I think his idealistic foreign policy has been largely disastrous in the Middle East, although I supported him over Cuba and Iran), I must admit that Obama has had a terribly hard time vis-a-vis the Repubs in Congress.
His attempt to enforce gun control after numerous massacres was continually thwarted by the right-wing lobbyists. As a European, guns are one of my main beefs with the GOP and my heart went out to him in that struggle, in which he often seemed to speak with such genuine emotion.
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_Abyssinia
Guest
I commented above about the effect on the job market, regarding the ACA and the issue with part time work and job expansion. That isn’t the fault of Republicans in Congress or President George W. Bush or any other Republican administration, is it!?
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_Abyssinia
Guest
Donald Trump: Transgender People Should Be Allowed to Use Bathroom of Their Choice
mediaite.com/tv/donald-trump-transgender-people-should-be-allowed-to-use-bathroom-of-their-choice/
mediaite.com/tv/donald-trump-transgender-people-should-be-allowed-to-use-bathroom-of-their-choice/
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Lily_Bernans
Guest
Can we stop with the “culture of death” thing? You know as well as I do that St. Pope John Paul II coined the phrase to refer to rampant secularism and degrading morality; it had nothing at all to do with abortion.
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Lily_Bernans
Guest
I’m a European, too, even though I live in the US now. I grew up in Europe and spent most of my 20s there. I have a big problem with the lack of gun laws in the US, too. I, too, believe Obama genuinely wants to restrict access to guns, and I feel for him when the GOP simply refuses to work with him on that issue out of sheer stubbornness.
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zz912
Guest
Ahem…
In a new encyclical issued Thursday, Pope John Paul II condemned a growing and widespread “culture of death” in which moral “crimes” such as abortion and euthanasia are viewed as individual rights.
“Choices once unanimously considered criminal and rejected by the common moral sense are gradually becoming socially acceptable,” the pope declared.
The 188-page “Evangelium Vitae,” translated as “The Gospel of Life,” marks the first time that abortion and euthanasia have been discussed in a papal encyclical and bolstered at such length with theological and philosophical underpinnings.
articles.chicagotribune.com/1995-03-31/news/9503310188_1_encyclical-abortion-and-euthanasia-pope-john-paul-ii
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Lily_Bernans
Guest
Well, of course. Abortion and euthanasia are a part of a decaying morality, but St. Pope JP II used “culture of death” in a wider sense. You know it, I know it, just about everyone knows it.
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zz912
Guest
Textbook case of “moving the goalposts”.
First “culture of death” has “nothing to do” with abortion. Now you’re changing your tune.
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Ridgerunner
Guest
It isn’t sheer stubbornness, though.
It’s what their constituents want them to do and would oust them if they did not do. There are gun laws in the U.S., contrary to what some believe. There are enforcement problems, however. No less a liberal than Rahm Emmanuel has complained about lax enforcement by liberal judges in Chicago that won’t punish gun crimes. Given that Chicago has very tough gun laws and a high gun crime rate even so, he has a point.
Despite the failure of tough gun laws in Chicago, there are huge differences from locality to locality in the U.S. When, for example, some of the western states have almost no gun laws at all and lower gun crime rates than some of the European countries that virtually forbid guns entirely, it should be evident to anyone that local conditions and populations should be able to formulate, within reason, their own regulations as regards guns.
Also, there are big differences between natural hazards in localities in the U.S. Where I live, it’s risky to go into many places without a gun, and I usually don’t. There are feral hogs, feral dogs, coyotes, mountain lions, bears and poisonous snakes. There are also pests like armadillos that dig holes sufficient to wreck a vehicle, causing injury or death. I shoot them on sight.
Why should the state disarm me, then? Why should I get mauled and perhaps eaten by a pack of feral hogs when gun crimes here are exceedingly rare and all the shooting is done in places where strict gun laws exist but are not enforced?
And have tough gun laws in Europe prevented terrorists from having even automatic weapons? Not at all. They only prevent honest citizens from having any defense, tipping the balance always in favor of the “bad guys”.
The Constitution guarantees my right to have guns. Why should liberal non-enforcement of the law deprive me of that right?
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Ridgerunner
Guest
Abortion, of course, is an integral part of it and was the initial slip down the “slippery slope” to a broader culture of death. And it is most definitely the biggest part of the killing.
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Lily_Bernans
Guest
I don’t know how anyone who witnessed Sandy Hook, even on TV, or claims to be “pro-life” can ask that question.
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