Trump Thread

[Peter_J]

LOL No, no possible way. I have voted Republican in a general election, but not often.

Alright, but I’m saying what if he was the Democratic nominee? (Admittedly that’s a hypothetical, but Republicans have been pressed many times with the reverse hypothetical, i.e. what if he were the Republican nominee?)

 

[Al_Moritz]

Washington Post:
Anti-abortion movement unified in swift rebuke of Trump

 

[Lily_Bernans]

Alright, but I’m saying what if he was the Democratic nominee? (Admittedly that’s a hypothetical, but Republicans have been pressed many times with the reverse hypothetical, i.e. what if he were the Republican nominee?)

No, no, not even if he were a beloved Democratic nominee. If Trump were the Democratic nominee, I’d vote Republican, or if I didn’t like the Republican candidate, I’d probably not vote.

 

[Thorolfr]

From today’s Guardian:

Donald Trump was facing the biggest crisis of his bid for the White House on Thursday, after his comment that women should be punished for having an abortion produced a fierce backlash from both left and right.

It was an extraordinary gaffe even by the Republican frontrunner’s standards and, unusually, one he scrambled to retract almost at once. But the damage was done, leading the GOP establishment to suggest that Trump had finally been unmasked as a conservative impostor.

Democrats seized on the remarks as evidence that the brash billionaire was waging “a war on women” that could deliver a landslide to Hillary Clinton in the presidential election. A recent opinion poll found that fewer than one in four American women view Trump favourably.

theguardian.com/us-news/2016/mar/31/donald-trump-abortion-remarks-biggest-campaign-crisis

So is Trump really a “conservative impostor”?

 

[TMC]

I don’t know who looks worse after Trump’s abortion gaffe - Trump, or the pro-life movement.

It makes it obvious that Trump doesn’t know anything about the pro-life movement, likely doesn’t really care about the pro-life movement, and probably isn’t really pro-life.

But it also shows the dissonance within the pro-life movement, which requires its members to affirm that abortion is murder, while simultaneously insisting that procuring murder should not be punished. Seems to me that is an untenable and indefensible position (so its no wonder Trump didn’t expect that he was supposed to hold that inconsistent position.)

 

[Thorolfr]

But it also shows the dissonance within the pro-life movement, which requires its members to affirm that abortion is murder, while simultaneously insisting that procuring murder should not be punished. Seems to me that is an untenable and indefensible position (so its no wonder Trump didn’t expect that he was supposed to hold that inconsistent position.)

 

[Lily_Bernans]

I don’t know who looks worse after Trump’s abortion gaffe - Trump, or the pro-life movement.

It makes it obvious that Trump doesn’t know anything about the pro-life movement, likely doesn’t really care about the pro-life movement, and probably isn’t really pro-life.

But it also shows the dissonance within the pro-life movement, which requires its members to affirm that abortion is murder, while simultaneously insisting that procuring murder should not be punished. Seems to me that is an untenable and indefensible position (so its no wonder Trump didn’t expect that he was supposed to hold that inconsistent position.)

I don’t think he cares if a woman has an abortion or not. That’s just my opinion, of course, and my apologies to Mr. Trump if I’m wrong.

 

[Lily_Bernans]

I don’t know who looks worse after Trump’s abortion gaffe - Trump, or the pro-life movement.

It makes it obvious that Trump doesn’t know anything about the pro-life movement, likely doesn’t really care about the pro-life movement, and probably isn’t really pro-life.

But it also shows the dissonance within the pro-life movement, which requires its members to affirm that abortion is murder, while simultaneously insisting that procuring murder should not be punished. Seems to me that is an untenable and indefensible position (so its no wonder Trump didn’t expect that he was supposed to hold that inconsistent position.)

 

[FollowChrist34]

If Trump arrives at the convention just short of the needed delegates, it doesn’t seem right to deny him the nomination. The voters will have made him their choice. I think Hillary, should she be the nominee, and it looks like she will be, would steamroll over Trump.

Cruz just seems so unlikable. The man has no charisma. Of course, Hillary doesn’t have a lot of natural likability, either.

I don’t think Rubio or Kasich will get behind Cruz. Rubio is adamant about his life going to be private, and Kasich is so stubborn.

I think maybe the Trump supporters might not vote rather than vote for Cruz, but that could be wishful thinking on my part. LOL

Oh, to have been a fly on the wall when Trump met with the RNC today! I wonder what they really talked about? I don’t suppose we’ll ever know.

I think we know what they talked about more or less - the convention and the delegates. Trump is gearing up to fight various rule implementations and maneuvering of delegates (Louisiana, South Carolina), first ballot, second ballot etc. He is coming up to speed on what the deal is, where he stands - too bad he does not do that with the issues. But he is about ‘winning.’

Having said that, I actually think Trump would not be a bad loser, and I believe he would be relieved to get out of this mess. He is in over his head. He might be the first one to sober up if he can find a ego-appeasing way out of this. He is not qualified to be President. I think he knows that.

And I think people are hard on Cruz and the GOP just because they don’t want a conservative to win the White House. It is political. I agree Cruz is unpopular but he does have his good points and we don’t have a lot of choice here. There is no such thing as a GOP candidate the Democrats would like. In all fairness the Republicans return the favor - they go on and on about how much they hate Hillary and Bernie. I tell you - speaking as an independent who votes for both parties, it gets very very old.

 

[TCEL]

But it also shows the dissonance within the pro-life movement, which requires its members to affirm that abortion is murder, while simultaneously insisting that procuring murder should not be punished. Seems to me that is an untenable and indefensible position (so its no wonder Trump didn’t expect that he was supposed to hold that inconsistent position.)

Or, the defense is that pro-lifers are more merciful than pro-choicers are able or willing to recognize?

Many women really do have abortions because they feel trapped and like they have no choice.

I’m disgusted that Catholics would attack the pro-life movement on this point. (Not saying you are a Catholic, but some pro-choice Catholics do.)

Would it make people feel more comfortable if we declared that all women be tried for murder? Anyway, I’m not wanting to get too involved with this thread. This specific attack of the pro-life movement angers me. Do people want us to throw stones instead?

 

[Lily_Bernans]

I think we know what they talked about more or less - the convention and the delegates. Trump is gearing up to fight various rule implementations and maneuvering of delegates (Louisiana, South Carolina), first ballot, second ballot etc. He is coming up to speed on what the deal is, where he stands - too bad he does not do that with the issues. But he is about ‘winning.’

Having said that, I actually think Trump would not be a bad loser, and I believe he would be relieved to get out of this mess. He is in over his head. He might be the first one to sober up if he can find a ego-appeasing way out of this. He is not qualified to be President. I think he knows that.

And I think people are hard on Cruz and the GOP just because they don’t want a conservative to win the White House. It is political. I agree Cruz is unpopular but he does have his good points and we don’t have a lot of choice here. There is no such thing as a GOP candidate the Democrats would like. In all fairness the Republicans return the favor - they go on and on about how much they hate Hillary and Bernie. I tell you - speaking as an independent who votes for both parties, it gets very very old.

Thank you for the information.

I am actually a registered Independent, but I usually vote Democratic. I have voted Republican, but not often. I would not vote for Trump, though, no matter what party he chose.

I think Trump might want out, too, but he would never quit. He does not want to be seen as losing. I agree with you, he is about winning. Some of the things he says are downright horrifying like saying he would use nuclear weapons in Europe. So he wants to demolish NATO? It’s not that I don’t find Trump at all likable; I agree with you, he’s not qualified to be president. He doesn’t have the background or the temperament. Republicans don’t like Obama, but he does manage to stay cool and calm no matter what. Trump seems to be an okay person, I have nothing against him personally except like his wife wishes, I, too, wish he’d stop swearing.

I haven’t listened to Cruz as much as Trump, Hillary, and Sanders, but with his growing popularity, I will. It seems almost certain that the Republicans will have a brokered convention. Cruz’s lead in Wisconsin is growing, and I think he’ll beat Trump in other states now.

The summer will be interesting, to say the least.

 

[_Abyssinia]

I don’t know who looks worse after Trump’s abortion gaffe - Trump, or the pro-life movement.

It makes it obvious that Trump doesn’t know anything about the pro-life movement, likely doesn’t really care about the pro-life movement, and probably isn’t really pro-life.

But it also shows the dissonance within the pro-life movement, which requires its members to affirm that abortion is murder, while simultaneously insisting that procuring murder should not be punished. Seems to me that is an untenable and indefensible position (so its no wonder Trump didn’t expect that he was supposed to hold that inconsistent position.)

Here is an excerpt from an article from 2012 (Women Shouldn’t Face Prison Time for Abortion, They’re Victims Too) regarding America and regarding the subject of punishing women for abortion:

it’s important to recognize the legal and cultural context that distinguishes abortion from post-birth homicide, theft, rape, and just about every other crime: only abortion has decades of legal recognition and social celebration as a constitutional right, and pervasive misinformation about what its victim is—a propaganda campaign backed by a powerful industry, influential advocacy groups, forces at every level of government, one of America’s two main political parties, and scores of wide-ranging voices in our media, education establishment, and popular culture. It’s entirely appropriate to consider how pervasively abortion seekers have been misled for so long when deciding whether to punish them.

Like so many dimensions of the abortion debate, illumination can be found by turning to America’s slavery debate. Throughout his career, Abraham Lincoln supported a number of compensated emancipation proposals—freeing slaves, but paying owners for their financial loss. Would pro-choicers say that made his opposition to slavery any less sincere or thoughtful?

“The feeling is against slavery, not against the South,” he said. “Until very recently the North has been of the same opinion. For two hundred years the whole country has admitted it,” and any solution to the crisis had to recognize that context. Compensation, he hoped, would help emancipation go down more peacefully (of course, the Civil War kept that theory from being tested). Today’s context is different—we’d punish rather than pay slavers because slavery’s evil has been universally understood for the past century and a half.

Similarly, when the indoctrination have been uprooted and a more enlightened consensus on abortion is reached, a future generation might decide abortion-seeking women should be presumed to fully understand what they’re destroying, and they may choose to punish them accordingly. But that’s not where we are today. Pro-lifers recognize how the abortion movement victimizes mother and child alike, so we’re dedicated to saving both.

lifenews.com/2012/07/09/women-shouldnt-face-prison-time-for-abortion-theyre-victims-too/

 

[JimR-OCDS]

So is a person not a person if that’s more convenient for society?

Not sure what you’re implying here?

Jim

 

[FollowChrist34]

Japan and South Korea hit back at Trump’s nuclear comments

Foreign Minister Fumio Kishida added, “It is impossible that Japan will arm itself with nuclear weapons.”

**

South Korea has a small minority who think Trump may have a point and welcome the idea of nuclear weapons.
Academic Cheong Seong-Chang from the non-profit think-tank the Sejong Institute said, “If we have nuclear weapons, we’ll be in a much better position to deal with North Korea.”
But his feeling is not mainstream.
cnn.com/2016/03/31/politics/trump-view-from-south-korea-japan/index.html

John Kasich lists reasons not to vote for Donald Trump

On Thursday, though, Kasich didn’t limit himself to five reasons, hammering Trump on a range of fronts. Here are some of his sharpest jabs.
– “As a commander in chief and leader of the free world, you don’t get do-overs. You need to be able to get it right the first time.”
– “We know about his comments on abortion, which would put women in a very difficult position. And we know that he has since moved to correct those in one way or another.”
– “He actually talked about the use of nuclear weapons both in the Middle East and Europe. You wonder about his hand or his thumb getting any close to the critical button that presidents are in charge of.”
– “He says we should basically abolish the Geneva Convention, which was created to make sure that we had fair treatment for anybody who could be captured in war and that somehow we ought to abolish the Geneva Conventions and engage in, I guess, more torture, which doesn’t sit well with any of the people who have served our country so honorably, like (Arizona senator and former prisoner-of-war) John McCain.”
– “He’s called on NATO to basically be abolished although I can’t figure out what his position is today. I happen to believe that NATO needs to be strengthened and turned from basically solely a military organization into an intelligence and policing organization that can work across borders.”
cnn.com/2016/03/31/politics/john-kasich-donald-trump-new-york/index.html

 

[Lily_Bernans]

Here is an excerpt from an article from 2012 (Women Shouldn’t Face Prison Time for Abortion, They’re Victims Too) regarding America and regarding the subject of punishing women for abortion:

lifenews.com/2012/07/09/women-shouldnt-face-prison-time-for-abortion-theyre-victims-too/

If women who have abortions are victims, why do they have to confess the abortion to their priest?

A woman who is kidnapped doesn’t have to seek absolution for her kidnapping.

 

[Ridgerunner]

For the first time in my life may sit out a Presidential election

As much respect as I have for you, and I truly do, I’ll not join you in this. Never would I give up the opportunity to vote against the party of death, and certainly not against its candidate. If the “we came, we saw, Quaddhaffi died” followed by that cackle didn’t unnerve you, then it sure did me. And say what one will about Trump, he’ll never have the ability or even the desire, to put a lid on free speech. Call me paranoid if you wish, (though sometimes even paranoids can face real threats) but that whole business with blaming the film maker for Benghazi smells to me like an attempt to a) explain away the debacle and b) simultaneously enact “reasonable” measures to prevent people from doing things like making such films in the future, oh, possibly applying those “reasonable” measures to “inflammatory” utterances on other subjects as well.

I like Kasich, but I’ll vote for Trump or Cruz if it comes to it.

 

[Peter_J]

Some of the things he says are downright horrifying like saying he would use nuclear weapons in Europe.

You mean might.

 

[TCEL]

If women who have abortions are victims, why do they have to confess the abortion to their priest?

A woman who is kidnapped doesn’t have to seek absolution for her kidnapping.

A fifteen year old is definitely a victim of our abortive culture. She’s told that it’s liberating to have sex, and liberating to have the choice to have an abortion; moreover, she’s made to feel wrong if she feels guilt about it. Doesn’t mean it isn’t a sin. Many women do carry the penalty of their abortions either through infertility or depression. This is pretty basic from a Catholic standpoint; Jesus and the woman who was going to be stoned. (Where’s the man, anyway?) The article Abyssinia cited sums it up well.

 

[josie_L]

If women who have abortions are victims, why do they have to confess the abortion to their priest?

A woman who is kidnapped doesn’t have to seek absolution for her kidnapping.

I believe that such woman are victims of the culture of death, and the results of that are seen in the aftermath of abortion. You only need to read the countless testimonies of women who have had abortions to know that abortion is a lie, it does not free you of a burden it only increases it.

 

[Lily_Bernans]

You mean might.

Okay, might is fine with me.