Trump v GOP

[GaryTaylor]

thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/271875-cruz-brokered-convention-would-lead-to-voter-revolt

“Any time you hear someone talking about a brokered convention, it is the Washington establishment in a fevered frenzy, they are really frustrated because all their chosen candidates, their golden children, the voters keep rejecting,” Cruz said Friday at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC).

“So they seize on this plan of a brokered convention, and the D.C. power brokers will drop someone in who is exactly to the liking of the Washington establishment. If that would happen, we would have a manifest revolt on our hands all across this country.”

Ted Cruz is a conservative the hypocrites won’t back as of yet like Trump.

 

[GaryTaylor]

The “Never Trump Movement” is led by MIller a former Jed Bush spokesman of the establishment!

They are shooting at stopping Trump from winning the big states like Fla and Ohio. And spending millions in the process!

 

[_Abyssinia]

The “Never Trump Movement” is led by MIller a former Jed Bush spokesman of the establishment!

They are shooting at stopping Trump from winning the big states like Fla and Ohio. And spending millions in the process!

There are grassroots conservatives who don’t want too see Donald Trump as the nominee. It’s not just millionaire donors and campaign insiders who oppose Donald Trump!

 

[GaryTaylor]

There are grassroots conservatives who don’t want too see Donald Trump as the nominee. It’s not just millionaire donors and campaign insiders who oppose Donald Trump!

At the core is much of the same establishment who are satisfied with the way the Republican party has been ran and believe its fundamentally sound which is verified as simply not true by the Trump and Cruz following. They are in essence saying anyone but Trump and Cruz not just the first leading candidate but the first and second leading candidates. So what principles do they promote different than the two leading candidates?

 

[10gr8kids]

Wouldn’t it be nice to have a president with a good value system and good morals. One that hates abortion as much as we Catholics should, one that has loved and values his/her spouse of his/her youth. Someone who truly cares for those who struggle and want to help them make a better life for them and their families. A person who knows how important the family is to our society. One who would not stoke racial divisions, but try to bring about understanding and unity. A man God has blessed with intelligence, commonsense, a steady hand, and a core moral center; who knows that it is God who has blessed him and gives the glory to God.
Yes, no one is perfect, but some try a lot harder than others!

I believe we have had presidential candidates with these qualities, but the majority of voters, both republicans and democrats, reject them for someone less principled because we believe their policies will improve our economy. Then we wonder why our society is falling apart. Until our society relearns that all blessings come from God, we have no where to go but down.

As Catholics and Christians, we should know this to be true, yet it seems we don’t believe God when he tells us

But seek first His kingdom and His righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well.
Matthew 6:33

 

[_Abyssinia]

At the core is much of the same establishment who are satisfied with the way the Republican party has been ran and believe its fundamentally sound which is verified as simply not true by the Trump and Cruz following. They are in essence saying anyone but Trump and Cruz not just the first leading candidate but the first and second leading candidates. So what principles do they promote different than the two leading candidates?

I don’t quite understand your post. Who is part of the so called “establishment” ? There are so called “establishment” figures that have arguably done far more to advance conservatism that Donald Trump has done so being part of the “estavlushment” is not necessarily a bad thing. Marco Rubio is seen as “establishment” but would you agree that he appears to be more of a conservative than Donald Trump, who is not seen as “establishment” - so not being part of the “establishment” doesn’t necessarily mean you are more conservative than a so called “establishment” figure.

 

[GaryTaylor]

I don’t quite understand your post. Who is part of the so called “establishment” ? Is it Governors like Scott Walker, Rick Scott? Is it Jeb Bush and John Kasich? And why is being part of this so called “establishment” seen as a negative thing? All four of those, as well as say Marco Rubio, have arguably done far more to advance conservatism that Donald Trump has done.

No one has done more for religious liberty nor the constitution and second amendment than Cruz. Are you saying all people are delusional and the career politicians of the Rep party have served their party well? Where as abortion is still on-going 50 years and the 2nd amendment rights are dwindling year after after year and its been nothing but business as usual.

“Any time you hear someone talking about a brokered convention, it is the Washington establishment in a fevered frenzy, they are really frustrated because all their chosen candidates, their golden children, the voters keep rejecting,” Cruz said Friday at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC).

“So they seize on this plan of a brokered convention, and the D.C. power brokers will drop someone in who is exactly to the liking of the Washington establishment. If that would happen, we would have a manifest revolt on our hands all across this country.”

So the two leading candidates and all their followers must be wrong? Oh I don’t think so.

 

[_Abyssinia]

No one has done more for religious liberty nor the constitution and second amendment than Cruz. Are you saying all people are delusional and the career politicians of the Rep party have served their party well? Where as abortion is still on-going 50 years and the 2nd amendment rights are dwindling years after after year and its been nothing but business as usual.

So the two leading canidates and all their followers must be wrong? Oh I don’t think so.

I edited some of my above post. I just think terms like “establishment” when there are so called “establishment” figures that have done more for conservatism and/or have done far more over the years to fight for religious liberty etc. than Donald Trump, who is seen as not “establishment” and that’s seen as a good thing by some, even though he’s flip flopped and changed his positions on so many issues, and there are many people who would argue he doesn’t have a conservative positions on various issues even now, and yet there are “establishment” figures who get labelled by people as being “establishment” even though they have a conservative record - it is bizarre.

It’s bizarre when there are people with conservative records being labelled as “establishment” but Donald Trump is seen as “anti establishment” or not part of the “establishment” even though he arguably holds views/positions that are conservative.

Not being part of the “establishment” doesn’t necessarily mean you are more conservative than a so called “establishment” figure.

 

[queenofheartscv]

Has anybody read this: Megan Kelly 2016 is Candy Crowley 2012?

observer.com/2016/03/megyn-kelly-2016-is-candy-crowley-2012/

During Thursday debate on the issue of trump university:

"Megyn Kelly said of the school, which has become a talking point for Mr. Trump’s opponents, “The rating from the Better Business Bureau was a D-minus. That’s the last publicly available rating.”

Mr. Trump replied, “It was elevated to an A.”

Ms. Kelly argued with Mr. Trump, saying,** “That’s never been publicly available.”**

Then she proceeded to shush both Mr. Trump and Mr. Rubio, who was clearly delighted that Ms. Kelly was doing his bidding, as he’s made Trump University the centerpiece of his knocks on Mr. Trump.

she said, “Let me just set the record straight and then you can have at it.”

At this point, Ms. Kelly walked through the substance of the case, noting that there were 5,000 plaintiffs, and all the rest, even comparing Mr. Trump to Bernie Madoff and putting on screen an incendiary quote from the judge that certified the class action case for the Ninth Circuit. All of this is fine, if a bit over the top in its detail, considering that no other candidate was subjected to this kind of produced set piece (Mr. Trump also got the TV-clip mashup treatment that he missed when he skipped the last Fox debate).

But the problem is two-fold. First, Ms. Kelly appointed herself fact-checker here, exactly as Ms. Crowley had done four years ago. By correcting Mr. Trump in saying, “That’s never been publicly available,” she is no longer simply refereeing but awarding points, as well. Second, she’s wrong. And she had to have known it.

Just three days earlier, NBC News ran an extensive exploration of the “ratings” question. It was a fact-check piece based on Mr. Trump making the same “A Rating” claim on Meet the Press. In a story headlined “Better Business Bureau: Trump Right on ‘A’ Rating — Mostly,” NBC concluded that the rating did indeed fluctuate, as he indicated at the debate.

The story reads, “In fact, according to the rating agency, Trump appears to have undersold things—at times in the past, his ‘university’ had an A-plus rating.” It goes on to say, “But it’s not all good news for the Republican front-runner. The BBB’s ratings are ‘dynamic’ and are based on a constantly shifting algorithm, meaning they’re changing all the time. And over the years, the company’s rating had fallen as far as D-minus—an assessment Trump chose not to mention Sunday.”

Yet Ms. Kelly said that the “A Rating” had “never been publicly available.”

 

[Path_Finder]

What drags Rubio down in a lot of voters’ eyes is how he is seen as one who wants amnesty, gang of 8.

But Trump really hit the issue with border security and to say the truth, I think we really need it, drugs come through and so on. He’s spoken up for vets.

I do get the establishment thing people talk about though, in 2008, I don’t think Romney was as much establishment but I guess McCain may have been seen that way.

Per the pro-life cause, it will be interesting to see if the pro-life people, liveaction, national right to life, etc. Susan B. Anthony List will actually give Trump, if nominated, their endorsement.

So, we will see. It appears Trump stands to win big at least in Louisiana today, I don’t know about other places. He does strike a chord with people.

 

[GaryTaylor]

I just think terms like “establishment” when there are so called “establishment” figures that have done more for conservatism and/or have done far more over the years to fight for religious liberty etc. than Donald Trump, who is seen as not “establishment” and that’s seen as a good thing by some, even though he’s flip flopped and changed his positions on so many issues, and there are many people who would argue he doesn’t have a conservative positions on various issues even now, and yet there are “establishment” figures who get derided by people as being “establishment” even though they have a conservative record - it is bizarre.

I have heard all the arguments on this thread, not any are great or even good imho, some plausible most just emotional nonsense.

No one spoke as brilliantly on religious freedom nor even cared too over the last 8-years than Cruz and the fact is the establishment chose their own path as they kick both Cruz and Trump to the curb and aside from the two of them by large holding the evangelical vote. In fact Cruz was a lone voice speaking up for Catholics with the little sisters of the poor.

Not one of those pretenders gained the evangelical vote. I guess their core principle of religious freedom isn’t as core as they lead you to believe. I think they simply need to warm up to the idea one of these will be the Rep nominee and it sure looks like Trump. The bottom line is the people are speaking and I agree with Cruz only I think the revolt already started.

I have no idea who I would vote for as I thought Rubio, but I can’t think of a good reason to kick these people to the curb over what different principle of conservative thinking? Religious liberty, the constitution and their core principles? Doesn’t make sense I’m sorry.

 

[_Abyssinia]

What drags Rubio down in a lot of voters’ eyes is how he is seen as one who wants amnesty, gang of 8.

But Trump really hit the issue with border security and to say the truth, I think we really need it, drugs come through and so on. He’s spoken up for vets.

I do get the establishment thing people talk about though, in 2008, I don’t think Romney was as much establishment but I guess McCain may have been seen that way.

Per the pro-life cause, it will be interesting to see if the pro-life people, liveaction, national right to life, etc. Susan B. Anthony List will actually give Trump, if nominated, their endorsement.

So, we will see. It appears Trump stands to win big at least in Louisiana today, I don’t know about other places. He does strike a chord with people.

I’m somewhat skeptical of exit polls but Fox News, CNN etc. still seem to take them seriously. In the exit polls for the states that have voted so far, where has immigration been a top three issue of priority/concern etc?

 

[Path_Finder]

I’m somewhat skeptical of exit polls but Fox News, CNN etc. still seem to take them seriously. In the exit polls for the states that have voted so far, where has immigration been a top three issue of priority/concern etc?

I agree that there was polling that did not show immigration, illegal immigration to be a top concern. I heard about that poll. To me, it doesn’t make sense.

 

[GaryTaylor]

where has immigration been a top three issue of priority/concern

It clearly is THE issue which instigated and jump started the Trump campaign. The fact Trump exploited the issue and ran it into the ground in excess is no secret as he has had to roll back the rhetoric. But the national security, terrorism and yes the border are front and center with the Trump and Cruz followers and in fact links religious freedom and the second amendment very nicely. Its not hard to see where either is coming from the issue is Trump evolves by the day with all this.

 

[Path_Finder]

I think GT is right additionally, we elect these politicians but the budget deal and so on, what exactly are they doing for the people? In that, one might think, they are being GOP establishment. All we’ve had in recent years is the liberal agenda being pushed on us.

GOP controls both Senate and the House, so they should do something to show for it. As said, Cruz has filibustered and done things like that.

 

[GaryTaylor]

Trump evolves by the day with all this.

Ab I think this also IS what gains his popularity and expands his following. Imho these people are not only seeing the process but feel they are part of it as it evolves to a realistic working plan in real time. Obviously they see the rest as old news, stale and all talk and no action, until it came time to lose the nomination then they morphed into hypocrisy as I see it. Just saying.

 

[fmchan52]

The Trump supporters are saying the establishment side of the GOP are actually
helping Trump by continuing to dump on him. Why are they not welcoming more of the same, instead of showing their anger about these attacks?

 

[queenofheartscv]

The Trump supporters are saying the establishment side of the GOP are actually
helping Trump by continuing to dump on him. Why are they not welcoming more of the same, instead of showing their anger about these attacks?

Because we are normal people not convoluted crazies.

 

[GaryTaylor]

The Trump supporters are saying the establishment side of the GOP are actually
helping Trump by continuing to dump on him. Why are they not welcoming more of the same, instead of showing their anger about these attacks?

Where are the Trump supporters saying this? And where are people showing anger? My concern is who is really speaking up for these core principles. You know the small we the peoples? The Christians and religious freedom and constitution?

As a Christian watching this for 8-years, I know of no-one who spoke as brilliantly as Cruz. In fact as far as the rest their silence has been deafening, I see no issue with the fact Trump decided to advocate for much the same of recent.

 

[fmchan52]

Because we are normal people not convoluted crazies.

That doesn’t answer the question.