Trump v GOP

[Crossbones]

The largest reason for Trump’s current success is his ability to play into people’s fears and incite voters with meaningless (but still dangerous) rhetoric.

I would disagree. The largest reason for Mr. Trump’s success is the complete failure of the Republican establishment in the last two Presidential elections and the complete failure of other candidates to put forth a compelling vision of conservatism.

On the first point, look at 2012. They had to select Governor Romney because he was the most electable and then he goes and loses to a sitting President overseeing the worst economy in 70 years. I think 1/2 of Republicans no longer see the establishment (and Fox News) as something to be trusted.

On the second point, there is no thoughtful conservative vision from anyone. Sure, Mr. Trump doesn’t have one, but no one in that field has one or ever did.

 

[gracepoole]

In other words, the reason for Trump’s success is people are fools.

Sorry but I’ll disagree.

If we’re familiar with history, we know where his rhetoric leads. Many intelligent people fall for this garbage generation after generation.

 

[queenofheartscv]

If we’re familiar with history, we know where his rhetoric leads. Many intelligent people fall for this garbage generation after generation.

If you prefer Obama’s weak america, it’s your right.

 

[queenofheartscv]

And you are helping it how? I have reconsidered before, Romney, McCain, and George W.

As you trump supporters keep telling us, where has it gotten us?

Another aspect to consider is, unless we stop illegal immigration, the demographics change in the coming years will ensure no republican president ever gets in office, no matter how conservative.

 

[Peter_J]

In other words, the reason for Trump’s success is people are fools.

This twisting of someone else’s words is just one more example of why I’m so incredibly tired of your tactics here.

Fortunately, there are other posters I can discourse with.

 

[queenofheartscv]

This twisting of someone else’s words is just one more example of why I’m so incredibly tired of your tactics here.

Fortunately, there are other posters I can discourse with.

I’m sorry for having offended you. I meant no offense.

 

[Thorolfr]

From Michigan to Louisiana to California on Friday, rank-and-file Republicans expressed mystification, dismissal and contempt regarding the instructions that their party’s most high-profile leaders were urgently handing down to them: Reject and defeat Donald J. Trump.

“There’s nothing short of Trump shooting my daughter in the street and my grandchildren — there is nothing and nobody that’s going to dissuade me from voting for Trump,” Ms. Butler said.

nytimes.com/2016/03/05/us/politics/donald-trump-republican-party.html?_r=1

That’s one very very committed Trump voter!

 

[gracepoole]

If you prefer Obama’s weak america, it’s your right.

That’s a false dilemma. The decision isn’t Trump or more Obama, Trump or a “weak America.” That’s undoubtedly what Trump would like voters to believe but it’s wholly inaccurate.

 

[queenofheartscv]

That’s a false dilemma. The decision isn’t Trump or more Obama, Trump or a “weak America.” That’s undoubtedly what Trump would like voters to believe but it’s wholly inaccurate.

It’s precisely because of what Obama has allowed America to suffer that people are gravitating toward Trump’s vision. We don’t want to make bad deals like Obama has any more. We don’t want to lead from behind like Obama has any more. We don’t want to have politicians with precious little real world experience leading the country any more. We want to see what Trump can do.

If all Trump has is his words, I’d agree with you, he’s a no good blowhard. But he has been a hugely successful do-er in his business ventures, that people want to believe he will take actions. We’re tired of all talk no action.

 

[Path_Finder]

If you prefer Obama’s weak america, it’s your right.

Yes, porous borders, an administration that cares more about foreigners than Americans. Very true. And if people are happy with the current inner cities? Those can get much better too.

 

[Peter_J]

I’m sorry for having offended you. I meant no offense.

I know they say not to look a gift horse in the mouth, but I’m having trouble getting my head around this sudden change of tone. Aren’t you going to ask me to explain why I “need” to say what I say?

 

[queenofheartscv]

I know they say not to look a gift horse in the mouth, but I’m having trouble getting my head around this sudden change of tone. Aren’t you going to make me explain why I “need” to say what I say?

I’m blunt by nature but I mean no offense.

 

[10gr8kids]

If things are bad on the pro-life front, it’s not just because of the politicians. It’s largely because of the culture and the lack of preaching in our churches. It’s unfair to lump all the responsibility on the president.

I’ll never vote for someone pro-abortion, and hillary is that and worse. She represents so much that’s bad that no matter who is running against her, I’ll vote for that person.

I don’t even come close to putting all the blame on the president. I put the blame on the voters. I go to church with someone who I know is pro-life. She seems very intelligent and very dedicated to her faith. When she told me she was supporting Trump, I was in disbelief. We discussed it just a little, I told her I had a hard time trusting his pro-life stance. She acknowledged he might not be as strong as others, but she had to think about what was best for the country too.

This line of reasoning boogles me. I can only see it if we think God just stands by and watches us. That He never intervenes in the world. I don’t believe that. I think there is a reason we pray and fast, not just for our everlasting soul, but also for the good of this world.

I also blame myself and others who spend too much time discussing politics and not near enough time praying and fasting.

 

[queenofheartscv]

I don’t even come close to putting all the blame on the president. I put the blame on the voters. I go to church with someone who I know is pro-life. She seems very intelligent and very dedicated to her faith. When she told me she was supporting Trump, I was in disbelief. We discussed it just a little, I told her I had a hard time trusting his pro-life stance. She acknowledged he might not be as strong as others, but she had to think about what was best for the country too.

This line of reasoning boogles me. I can only see it if we think God just stands by and watches us. That He never intervenes in the world. I don’t believe that. I think there is a reason we pray and fast, not just for our everlasting soul, but also for the good of this world.

I also blame myself and others who spend too much time discussing politics and not near enough time praying and fasting.

We can all use more praying and fasting. I do also think the churches don’t preach enough on social issues. The catholic vote did go to Obama, after all.

 

[gracepoole]

It’s precisely because of what Obama has allowed America to suffer that people are gravitating toward Trump’s vision.

It’s precisely because people are frightened and Trump plays to these fears masterfully. He offers exceptionally little in policy specifics and instead relies on jingoism and (again) xenophobia to stir emotion, not logic.

If all Trump has is his words, I’d agree with you, he’s a no good blowhard. But he has been a hugely successful do-er in his business ventures, that people want to believe he will take actions. We’re tired of all talk no action.

The government isn’t simply a business. Its goals are not and should not be the same.

 

[Thorolfr]

It’s precisely because of what Obama has allowed America to suffer that people are gravitating toward Trump’s vision. We don’t want to make bad deals like Obama has any more. We don’t want to lead from behind like Obama has any more. We don’t want to have politicians with precious little real world experience leading the country any more. We want to see what Trump can do.

If all Trump has is his words, I’d agree with you, he’s a no good blowhard. But he has been a hugely successful do-er in his business ventures, that people want to believe he will take actions. We’re tired of all talk no action.

Can you give me examples of how Obama has “led from behind”? And what “bad deals” are you talking about? What kind of action would you have wanted him to take? Just curious?

 

[randomuser]

That’s a false dilemma. The decision isn’t Trump or more Obama, Trump or a “weak America.” That’s undoubtedly what Trump would like voters to believe but it’s wholly inaccurate.

And more to the issue of abortion being a non-negotiable issue for Catholics, it is a sanctity of life issue, which trumps (pun intended) all other issues. I am skeptical that someone who praises the “wonderful work” done by PP understands just how serious an issue abortion is. I cannot think of any other “pro-life” candidate, ever, who has praised PP.

 

[Peter_J]

I don’t even come close to putting all the blame on the president. I put the blame on the voters. I go to church with someone who I know is pro-life. She seems very intelligent and very dedicated to her faith. When she told me she was supporting Trump, I was in disbelief.

You mean supporting him for the nomination, right? (As opposed to only planning to vote for him in the general election if he gets the nomination.) I know a few Catholics like that where I live, but I don’t know what advice to give you because nothing I’ve tried so far seems to get through to them.

 

[irishpatrick]

I would disagree. The largest reason for Mr. Trump’s success is the complete failure of the Republican establishment in the last two Presidential elections and the complete failure of other candidates to put forth a compelling vision of conservatism.

On the first point, look at 2012. They had to select Governor Romney because he was the most electable and then he goes and loses to a sitting President overseeing the worst economy in 70 years. I think 1/2 of Republicans no longer see the establishment (and Fox News) as something to be trusted.

On the second point, there is no thoughtful conservative vision from anyone. Sure, Mr. Trump doesn’t have one, but no one in that field has one or ever did.

People like to take the stance that Romney lost it himself. It was we the people, the very ones that are so angry this time, that caused Romney’s lost. He was a good candidate and a hundred levels better than Obama, but Republicans did not vote in enough numbers for him.

People like to blame Romney for what was THEIR failure–we the people let ourselves down by not electing Romney.

 

[Peter_J]

It’s precisely because people are frightened and Trump plays to these fears masterfully. He offers exceptionally little in policy specifics and instead relies on jingoism and (again) xenophobia to stir emotion, not logic.

Thank you!