TV: American Idol (general)

[Milliardo]

I think that much of the show is a front. The show pretends to be a competition, at this point, based on judging. But what it really is is a front for making fun of people at any cost.

It might, or might not be; having auditioned for quite a number of plays and musicals, I’d say the judges are pretty much how it feels like in theatre. What I do find funny though is the reaction of some of those who didn’t make it: they do know they don’t have the chance, right? Either they’re not aware of it, or have this dillusion that they’re good. Granted, there have been very good ones who didn’t even get past the screening stage, but many who didn’t get past it over react. It’s a given in the industry that you’ll get turned down more often than you’ll get a role.

 

[KGM06]

American Idol along with the slew of other “reality” shows is total and utter trash.
I cant believe that christians would watch other fellow man be utterly humiliated and ridiculed just for “entertainment”.
“Oh, but I only watch once they get to Hollywood”
part of the problem is right there. give the show the rating so this trash will keep comming back and allows the “judges” to continue their vileness.

Seen it once first season when it was down to the final 3 contestants, and couldn’t watch it again. And this seasons hype on their brutality tells me I made the right choice.

 

[Jeanette_L]

I start watching regularly when they get to Hollywood and the real competition begins. I usually pick a handful of favorites at that time and start routing for them until they are either all eliminated or one of them wins, and then I celebrate for about a minute and then life goes on until next year.

There’s absolutely nothing wrong with talent shows and competition.
There will always be spoil sports, they exist in real life too. Just have to learn to ignore them and keep our eyes on the ones who deserve to win and wish them well, no matter what the outcome for them in this competition.

 

[wjp984]

How can you reconcile that statement with Christ’s teachings?

Alright if someone tries to take the Eucharist as a non Catholic and you tell them in a nice way not to do it and that as a non Catholic they are not allowed. One of two things might happen. The person might respectfully understand and back down or they might try and make a scene. They might try to go up anyways and commit sacrelidge and make a fool of themselves. Would you then not try to stop them therefore causing them to be ridiculed and embarrasssed? With all repect given to the Eucharist I only used this example to illustrate my point. The people who get ridiculed ask for it. Simon says no and they keep singing. Simon continues to tell them that it is a no and they still keep making fools of themselves and then they are riduculed for it. Seems perfectly fair to me. Oh, and please explain to me how telling the truth is sinful? Simon doesn’t lie when he ridicules the contestants.

 

[anngal52]

Hi there, I don’t normally watch American Idol but I heard bad things about the show. I don’t like about American Idol bacuase of the judge, Simon Cromwell. I’m sorry but I don’t like him. He is very cruel in what he says to people on stage about their singings and appearances in front of millions of people who are watching TV.

Now, I understand that this show is meant to be for persons who can sing very well. BUT!!? What I don’t understand is why do American Idol bother putting people on the show who has a certain conditions (for example, autistic, or facial looks) and are not even able to change their conditions, and be just humilated. Are they being paid to be humilated?? What about their self-esteem?? Pretty sad to watch.

Doesn’t Simon have any heart?? I know this is his job to do that. It is just so wrong for him to waste anybody’s time if he can’t accept their conditions. You know, I would have said to him… If I was on stage, how would you feel if you were in my shoes with this kind of condition and really want to sing? There is not a thing I can do to change my disability or what I have. What do you have to say?

This is just my opinion but I would have kicked Simon out of the show.

Thanks.

Ann

 

[aimee]

Hi there, I don’t normally watch American Idol but I heard bad things about the show. I don’t like about American Idol bacuase of the judge, Simon Cromwell. I’m sorry but I don’t like him. He is very cruel in what he says to people on stage about their singings and appearances in front of millions of people who are watching TV.

Now, I understand that this show is meant to be for persons who can sing very well. BUT!!? What I don’t understand is why do American Idol bother putting people on the show who has a certain conditions (for example, autistic, or facial looks) and are not even able to change their conditions, and be just humilated. Are they being paid to be humilated?? What about their self-esteem?? Pretty sad to watch.

Doesn’t Simon have any heart?? I know this is his job to do that. It is just so wrong for him to waste anybody’s time if he can’t accept their conditions. You know, I would have said to him… If I was on stage, how would you feel if you were in my shoes with this kind of condition and really want to sing? There is not a thing I can do to change my disability or what I have. What do you have to say?

This is just my opinion but I would have kicked Simon out of the show.

Thanks.

Ann

Hi Ann,

I think Simon may think some folks are doing some things to gain attention and not realize they have disabilities…but I can’t be sure.
I know my son is autistic and there is no way I would let him audition for American Idol because I love him and know that even if he were to sing very well…he couldn’t handle the show.

The show is fun to watch but I don’t like when people are made fun of…

 

[DWPC]

Alright if someone tries to take the Eucharist as a non Catholic and you tell them in a nice way not to do it and that as a non Catholic they are not allowed. One of two things might happen. …

I don’t want to be nasty, but that reply is either ridiculous or a tragedy. A.I. is nothing more than entertainment. You’re comparing the performances those silly self-obsessed contestants with Holy Communion? Elevating A.I. to such importance is in itself almost sacrilegious. I suggest that you ask yourself why you fell compelled to invest so very much emotion in it; to the point of comparing it to an important article faith. Your example is silly, but telling. Apparently you would stand in front of the church and viciously humiliate your misguided non-Catholic friend, like those people on A.I. do to “bad” performers? Sorry WJP, you provide a clear example of why this show is fundamentally a seriously bad influence. You’re rationalizing purely offensive, harmful behavior.

The victims of that nastiness called “American Idol” have been screened several times before they ever get near that vicious Mr. Cowell. They’re simply there to provide him a target for his viciousness so you’ll react. After a few weeks of that, they’ll hook you on a couple contestants with talent, and work you to a fever over “your” favorite. They’ll whipsaw your emotions and you’ll let them. All to sell you products. Wake up, WJP, you’re one the millions offering yourself for manipulation by the media.

And BTW, have you heard that Simon Cowell sing yet?

 

[AlegreFe]

Now, I understand that this show is meant to be for persons who can sing very well. BUT!!? What I don’t understand is why do American Idol bother putting people on the show who has a certain conditions (for example, autistic, or facial looks) and are not even able to change their conditions, and be just humilated. Are they being paid to be humilated?? What about their self-esteem?? Pretty sad to watch.

Doesn’t Simon have any heart?? I know this is his job to do that. It is just so wrong for him to waste anybody’s time if he can’t accept their conditions.

(emphasis added)

Hi Ann. I don’t want to put Simon as the warmest and kindest person but I don’t believe he is heartless. I have seen Simon when someone who is auditioning really does seem to have some kind of “condition.” He is not all heartless. He seems to only tell the truth and he says in a lower tone than usual, ‘I’m sorry but…’ He seems to turn it down a bit when someone really does appear to have a “condition.” I have noticed a better side of Simon.

I put more of the blame on the producers of the show. There is a previous audition that these people go through. It is the producers that allow those people to get through to meet Simon, Paula and Randy. Why bother letting them get through if they can’t sing? But they let them through to meet Simon and to televise these people so we could all see. That right there is the real problem before Simon even comes into the picture.

I’m not condoning Simon’s behavior by any means. I know Simon should do better at critiquing. But I know he is not totally heartless.

 

[Cat]

I can’t describe the circumstances for the sake of privacy, but I am involved with a large theatrical “thing” with young people.

In the past week, I and the other organizers have experienced the WORST stage parent I have ever seen. It was a horrible experience, and I feel for the children involved. I can’t imagine what it’s like for them to live with this parent. They will be so warped. I honestly am afraid for them, living with this parent who has so twisted them.

I wish Simon had been around to deal with this family. I mean that sincerely.

All of us (the organizers) HAD to be nice and polite and suck up what we wanted to say and do. (It’s an amateur, not professional event.)

But we really aren’t doing that family any favors by being “kind.”

That family needs desperately to be told off. They need to be informed once and for all that the kids aren’t as talented as the parent thinks they are, and that even if they were super-talented, they can’t continue to act the way they act if they expect to get anywhere in the business.

They need a psychological flogging, and the parent needs to be there when they get it.

Eventually they will meet a “Simon” who will do them the kind favor of telling them that they are just a dime a dozen.

One of the posters said earlier that he has auditioned in for theater parts, and the it feels like American Idol judges. Listen to that poster. He’s telling the truth. Simon isn’t mean, he’s doing the auditioners a favor. He’s seeing if they’re tough enough to make it in a very tough business. If they can’t take Simon, they may as well give up.

An example of someone who took Simon’s jibes and refused to give up is Jennifer Hudson. He raked her, and she didn’t quit. She went to a different venue than American Idol, and now she’s won several awards for acting, and is up for an Oscar. You see, Simon didn’t hurt her at all. In fact, it could be said that he “groomed her” for success.

 

[DWPC]

Interesting choice of words, especially when directed at a youth. Have you taken the parent aside and discussed it? Have you warned the kid about consequences of inappropriate behavior. Are there any? Why do you participate in an activity that attracts and promotes the most self-obsessed and then act surprised when they show it?

That others have experienced humilation in show business auditions only further demonstrates how much abuse people will accept for their chance at fame. Why is humiliation tolerated behavior in show business while its rejected in the rest of society. Or was. Now with “The Apprentice”, Mr. Trump follows Cowell’s nasty lead and demonstrates how public humiliation can work in commerce too.

Pop music gave us a drug culture and wrecked public morality. Now TV attacks civility and basic decency toward others. But we keep cheering public visciousness as entertainment. We keep promoting children to pursue interests where one’s success requires anothers humiliation.

Ah, what wonderful examples for the kids. “See Timmy, its a dog-eat-dog world and you’ve got to be ready to tear their throats out…now get ready for Mass.”

We’re teaching our kids that humilation of others is good. That fame is worth it…and makes them god-like. We’ve already accepted coarse rudeness as normal behavior. And cursing. And toilet humor. And violent games. Just wait another few years to see how programs like A.I., The Apprentice, et al affect social behavior. We’re already circling the drain.

 

[marvi43]

Not a fan of the show. I used to watch it back in the day. I got a kick out of seeing the bad singers. Now days, I don’t. I actually find it kind of sad. I hope the REALLY bad singers are just up there for kicks and are hoping to have Simon ridicule them. What really makes me sad is when they make fun of someone for being fat or ugly. Just makes me sad.

Anyways, that’s just my two cents

 

[Cat]

DWPC, the actitivity I participate in is a wholesome one that is in it’s 46th year. I participated in it as a child, and now that I am an adult, I agreed to chair it this year. It is a wonderful opportunity for children and teenagers to perform and to win scholarships.

This particular stage parent is just one of thousands over the decades.

Please don’t condemn an activity because of one bad egg. (I’m sure there have been others during years that I wasn’t involved, but for the most part, it has been a positive experience throughout the decades.)

 

[tamccrackine]

I watch it with my kids. It gives them a good chance to see how trying for something is ok… to include failing at it. It also gives them a chance to see how NOT to behave if they get told they aren’t good enough at something. I’m totally with Simon 99.99% of the time because he’s spot on with telling people they stink. Humility isn’t a bad thing and most of the people that go in there and he says are rotten, really do have a false sense of self thinking they can sing! It’s all the political correctness and “let’s stroke their ego so we don’t damage their self esteem” passive parenting that has allowed horrid people to develop like this.

BTW… the .01% of things that I don’t agree with that Simon says are the things when it comes to cutting remarks about someone’s looks, weight, or other physical thing… which, honestly, he rarely does.

 

[DWPC]

This particular stage parent is just one of thousands over the decades.
…
Please don’t condemn an activity because of one bad egg.

Can’t you see the contradiction in your words? I’m know out on a limb here, but I deeply believe that our obsession with entertainment and entertainers is the single most corrosive element of modern Western culture. Your organization offers scholarships? To pursue acting? You can look at the role of theater in today’s culture and think that’s a *good * thing to pursue?

The performing arts have gone from occasional and generally positive entertainment to continual stimulation that for many is an obssession. Sitting at a stop light at 6:30 AM, this morning, I was next to an 18-ish guy going nuts on “air guitar” in his car. Innocent enough, but it shows the total immersion of our culture in “entertainment” which has, in truth, become an insidious marketing and political tool that’s successfully redefined values. The voices of moderation are long gone. Grandma and Grandpa today are the 1st Gen products of this cultural obsession and laugh about their parents’ dire warnings to them…while dealing with divorce-ravaged families, and grandkids who think homosexuality is as normal as choosing Pepsi over Coke.

The collapse of family and morals in hardly more than one generation show how our psyches and our social defenses are unprepared to deal with the real dangers of “entertainment” via mass media. It’s become emotional crack cocaine and we’ve become a society of pop culture crack-heads. We need to stop telling kids its OK to take hit on the crack pipe.

 

[Cat]

DWPC, I apologize. My writing was very bad.

When I said, “one of thousands,” I meant that out of thousands of parents over the years, this ONE stage parent was the ONE pill! EVERYONE else has been super-nice, very understanding, very willing to correct mistakes and make changes, very supportive of the competition.

I hope this is clear. ONE parent out of thousands is a stage parent. The rest are nice.

It’s NOT an acting competition, BTW. I said that I wouldn’t reveal the nature of the competition because of privacy issues. It’s a competition for performers, but not actors.

I disagree entirely with your opinion about acting and theater. I wish I had more time to discuss this. The discussion of this issue belongs in another thread anyway.

Pope John Paul II was an actor. He debated whether to become an actor or a priest. In other words, he considered the stage a worthwhile calling. Eventually he knew that God was calling him to the priesthood. But he didn’t give up acting because he thought it was evil. He gave it up because God called him to a different vocation.

My daughter is a professional production stage manager. She graduated from a Christian college (Calvin), and along with other Christian theater professionals, she is committed to keeping Christ in the entertainment business. It is possible and it is necessary. The profession is noble, even if it does often fall very short.

When she was in college, she was cast in a fantastic production of “Edith Stein.” This play was a great ministry to both Protestants and Catholics. Not all of show business is garbage. Most of it isn’t garbage, it’s good stuff.

I pray to John Paul II for my daughter and for all those who are involved with the entertainment business. It’s working–my daughter is meeting with a priest to look into converting to Catholicism.

 

[aimee]

DWPC, I apologize. My writing was very bad.

When I said, “one of thousands,” I meant that out of thousands of parents over the years, this ONE stage parent was the ONE pill! EVERYONE else has been super-nice, very understanding, very willing to correct mistakes and make changes, very supportive of the competition.

I hope this is clear. ONE parent out of thousands is a stage parent. The rest are nice.

It’s NOT an acting competition, BTW. I said that I wouldn’t reveal the nature of the competition because of privacy issues. It’s a competition for performers, but not actors.

I disagree entirely with your opinion about acting and theater. I wish I had more time to discuss this. The discussion of this issue belongs in another thread anyway.

Pope John Paul II was an actor. He debated whether to become an actor or a priest. In other words, he considered the stage a worthwhile calling. Eventually he knew that God was calling him to the priesthood. But he didn’t give up acting because he thought it was evil. He gave it up because God called him to a different vocation.

My daughter is a professional production stage manager. She graduated from a Christian college (Calvin), and along with other Christian theater professionals, she is committed to keeping Christ in the entertainment business. It is possible and it is necessary. The profession is noble, even if it does often fall very short.

When she was in college, she was cast in a fantastic production of “Edith Stein.” This play was a great ministry to both Protestants and Catholics. Not all of show business is garbage. Most of it isn’t garbage, it’s good stuff.

I pray to John Paul II for my daughter and for all those who are involved with the entertainment business. It’s working–my daughter is meeting with a priest to look into converting to Catholicism.

I think it can turn difficult if the person doesn’t have someone to ‘ground’ them…but I’m thinking your daughter will be fine since she has a good family

 

[DWPC]

DWPC, I apologize. My writing was very bad.

When I said, “one of thousands,” I meant that out of thousands of parents over the years, this ONE stage parent was the ONE pill! EVERYONE else has been super-nice, very understanding, very willing to correct mistakes and make changes, very supportive of the competition.

I understand better now. But I my position is the same. I’m sure Daniel Radcliff’s parents and mentors were supportive of his acting when he won the “Harry Potter” role. But now he’s *matured *into on-stage sex scenes in an upcoming stage production, for the sake of his art, for sure. And then there’s Dakota Fanning’s recent rape scene. The parents are probably quite proud, and that is the tragedy of contemporary slavishness to anything that can lay claim to that universal absolution…that its art.

The entertainment arts “tail” is wagging the dog. Its wrong to promote these things as positive paths for our kids (and attention-craving adults) any longer. Theater will survive without the moral and economic subsidy. It did for thousands of years.

 

[aimee]

I understand better now. But I my position is the same. I’m sure Daniel Radcliff’s parents and mentors were supportive of his acting when he won the “Harry Potter” role. But now he’s *matured *into on-stage sex scenes in an upcoming stage production, for the sake of his art, for sure. And then there’s Dakota Fanning’s recent rape scene. The parents are probably quite proud, and that is the tragedy of contemporary slavishness to anything that can lay claim to that universal absolution…that its art.

The entertainment arts “tail” is wagging the dog. Its wrong to promote these things as positive paths for our kids (and attention-craving adults) any longer. Theater will survive without the moral and economic subsidy. It did for thousands of years.

You have a right to your opinion and I don’t totally disagree with you. However I do like entertainment and would like to think that not all entertainers are imoral or bad or both.

That said …

American Idol is a fun show…I’ll still watch it…well, when it gets to Hollywood

back to the OP

 

[wjp984]

I don’t want to be nasty, but that reply is either ridiculous or a tragedy. A.I. is nothing more than entertainment. You’re comparing the performances those silly self-obsessed contestants with Holy Communion? Elevating A.I. to such importance is in itself almost sacrilegious. I suggest that you ask yourself why you fell compelled to invest so very much emotion in it; to the point of comparing it to an important article faith. Your example is silly, but telling. Apparently you would stand in front of the church and viciously humiliate your misguided non-Catholic friend, like those people on A.I. do to “bad” performers? Sorry WJP, you provide a clear example of why this show is fundamentally a seriously bad influence. You’re rationalizing purely offensive, harmful behavior.

The victims of that nastiness called “American Idol” have been screened several times before they ever get near that vicious Mr. Cowell. They’re simply there to provide him a target for his viciousness so you’ll react. After a few weeks of that, they’ll hook you on a couple contestants with talent, and work you to a fever over “your” favorite. They’ll whipsaw your emotions and you’ll let them. All to sell you products. Wake up, WJP, you’re one the millions offering yourself for manipulation by the media.

And BTW, have you heard that Simon Cowell sing yet?

You attacked me and I really don’t appreciate your accusations. Therefore I think in all fairness I will defend myself. I made an assumption that you might think television is bad and basically anything outside the Catholic church is bad for the soul. If this were the case than the only way I could think of illustrating my point of view would be to provide an analogy with the Catholic Church. If you are this type of person you may not have liked it but you certainly would get the point. There might be some who try to remain as faithful as possible to their faith and may not understand things and isolate themselves from everything. However a person like this would have a lare amount of respect, perhaps more than others, for the Eucharist.

Please show me where I ever said that I think American Idol is equal to the Eucharist. By the way, I also used this analogy since your post gave me the impresion that you might be willing to humiliate someone at mass if necessary in the scenario I gave. I certainly would not be brave enough but I thought you might be. I would think the ushers would be. What if someone was asked to consume the Eucharist and they did not want to and they tried to leave the church with the Eucharist. Do you not think that the ushers would try to stop them therefore humiliating them?

Finally, I think you have more in common with Simon than you might think as he is always quoted with “I am not trying to be rude here” Your opening statement seemed very similar. If you treat other Catholics the way you have treated me on this thread I bet you are exactly like Simon in regards to the Catholic faith. The analogy fit you which is why I used it.

 

[sea_oat]

An article in today’s USA Today talked about why people who cannot sing audition for the show:

usatoday.com/life/music/news/2007-02-05-idol-rejects-cover_x.htm

“The very narcissistic honestly believe they are awesome even when there’s no evidence” of it, says Dave Verhaagen, a Charlotte psychologist and author of Parenting the Millennial Generation. And he says that research suggests people who perform worst at a task often rate themselves best as a means of self-defense.

He also believes a smattering of singers could have Asperger’s syndrome or other high-functioning autism, whose features can include difficulty interpreting social cues. Singers could miss others’ signals about their poor ability. He says unconventional dress or behavior, another result of misread cues, makes them prime candidates for TV time at the auditions (Fox, tonight, 8 ET/PT), which conclude this week.