Ukraine (cont.)

[josie_L]

And with good reason,eh.

As for Mihailovich, I have no idea why he is on Sun News discussing Ukraine. From what I saw of him on Michael Coren, he really is ignorant of the struggle in Ukraine and his reporting really got the fury of many Ukrainian-Canadians. I remember him stating something to the effect of “well, listen, I’m from High Park in Toronto so I grew up with many of them” as if this qualified him on Ukraine. I’m not impressed by him.

I knew I was saying his name wrong, but I was too lazy to look it up, but yes, I did not agree with his perspective either, which was why Faith Goldy was pretty angry with him during their debates.

 

[KyivAndrew]

I knew I was saying his name wrong, but I was too lazy to look it up, but yes, I did not agree with his perspective either, which was why Faith Goldy was pretty angry with him during their debates.

 

[josie_L]

Sorry non-Canucks, just talk about Sun News.

The non-Canucks should watch Sun News too.

 

[KyivAndrew]

The non-Canucks should watch it too.

Oh, yeah, that’s right.

 

[KyivAndrew]

Now, European observers in Ukraine under the auspices of the OSCE have been kidnapped by the pro-Russian Donetsk militia:

An alleged Russian colonel commanding the separatist uprising in Ukraine broke cover yesterday, and said his militia in the eastern town of Slavyansk would not release a group of EU military observers kidnapped on Friday.

Igor Strelkov – whom Ukraine’s intelligence service describes as a wanted terrorist – made his first public appearance in the rebels’ de facto capital. In an interview with Russian channels, he described the captured military representatives as “Nato spies”. Strelkov said there was little prospect of them being freed unless Kiev’s pro-western government traded them for jailed pro-Russian activists.

theguardian.com/world/2014/apr/26/ukraine-separatist-leader-defends-capture-nato-spies

This comes just after Simon Ostrovsky, the journalist I mentioned earlier, has been released. If his conditions are anything to go by.

Simon Ostrovsky, an American journalist from Vice News who was detained for four days in the same building as the monitors, gave a grim account of conditions.

“On Monday night I was pulled out of a car at a checkpoint, then blindfolded, beaten, and tied up with tape. After spending hours alone on the floor of a damp cell with my hands tied behind my back and a hat pulled over my eyes, I was led into a room where I was accused of working for the CIA, FBI and Right Sector, the Ukrainian ultranationalist group,” he wrote.

“When I refused to give the password to my laptop, I was smacked in the arm with a truncheon. When I was asleep on the floor, masked men came to wake me up and tell me how no one would miss me if I died, and then kicked me in the ribs as they left.”

He said he saw a dozen other detainees in the cellar, including Artyom Deyneha, a local computer programmer, Serhiy Lefter, a freelance journalist, and Vadim Sukhonos, a deputy in the city council.

theguardian.com/world/2014/apr/24/us-journalist-simon-ostrovsky-released-ukraine

No wonder so many people in Donetsk are terrified now at what is happening. These thugs don’t represent the legitimate authority in Donetsk.

 

[Peter_Plato]

And with good reason,eh.

As for Mihailovich, I have no idea why he is on Sun News discussing Ukraine. From what I saw of him on Michael Coren, he really is ignorant of the struggle in Ukraine and his opinions seemed without foundation and really got the fury of many Ukrainian-Canadians. I remember him stating something to the effect of “well, listen, I’m from High Park in Toronto so I grew up with many Ukrainians” as if this qualified him on Ukraine. I’m not impressed by him, but am with Coren, Levant, etc.

Sorry non-Canucks, just talk about Sun News.

So, you are NOT impressed with Michael Coren, but you ARE with Coren? I presume a misspeak.

 

[Peter_Plato]

Up until now the West has been practicing a reactive foreign policy to Putin’s active policy. It’s high time the West stopped acting reactively, but take the initiative and throw Putin on the back heel, in my opinion.

On the contrary, the West appears to have had a very proactive foreign policy in Ukraine by fomenting what occurred in Kyiv. The problem, it appears to me, is that the assumption, made by the West, was that Ukraine would align easily with the West and Russia would not involve itself. The escalation was not anticipated and has left the West fumbling for what to do next. Putin has realized that the bungling has left him an opportunity to consolidate. He has also realized that the West is not as friendly to Russia as he had been led to believe over the past ten years, which is why he has pursued a proactive strategy. Much of this can be squarely blamed on the covert means used by the US and western political propaganda agencies that have involved themselves in foreign states. Putin is no fool, he knows that if Ukraine falls to the western political agenda, his own country is in jeopardy.

The West is not innocent with regard to what is happening in Ukraine and it is time that those who began this misadventure are held responsible, the truth told, Ukraine left to work out its own destiny and sincere diplomatic talks with Russia begin. Putin will not deal with those he knows he cannot trust and as long as the West continues to posture there is no chance of him backing down. He has too much to lose. The ball is in the West’s court and as long as the West plays a duplicitous posturing game, Putin will continue to play aggressively. He has less to lose by taking an offensive stance than he would by assuming a fetal position.

The solution, as always, is the truth and building trust. Clearly, you have a vested interest in the outcome, but pointing fingers and calling for aggression isn’t the answer here.

 

[josie_L]

So, you are NOT impressed with Michael Coren, but you ARE with Coren? I presume a misspeak.

No, there is no misspeak he is referring to Mihailovich who sometimes appears on Michael Coren’s show, do you watch it?

 

[Peter_Plato]

No, there is no misspeak he is referring to Mihailovich who sometimes appears on Michael Coren’s show, do you watch it?

Yup, it was missread on my part. Thanks for the correction.

 

[josie_L]

On the contrary, the West appears to have had a very proactive foreign policy in Ukraine by fomenting what occurred in Kyiv. The problem, it appears to me, is that the assumption, made by the West, was that Ukraine would align easily with the West and Russia would not involve itself. The escalation was not anticipated and has left the West fumbling for what to do next. Putin has realized that the bungling has left him an opportunity to consolidate. He has also realized that the West is not as friendly to Russia as he had been led to believe over the past ten years, which is why he has pursued a proactive strategy. Much of this can be squarely blamed on the covert means used by the US and western political propaganda agencies that have involved themselves in foreign states. Putin is no fool, he knows that if Ukraine falls to the western political agenda, his own country is in jeopardy.

The West is not innocent with regard to what is happening in Ukraine and it is time that those who began this misadventure are held responsible, the truth told, Ukraine left to work out its own destiny and sincere diplomatic talks with Russia begin. Putin will not deal with those he knows he cannot trust and as long as the West continues to posture there is no chance of him backing down. He has too much to lose. The ball is in the West’s court and as long as the West plays a duplicitous posturing game, Putin will continue to play aggressively. He has less to lose by taking an offensive stance than he would by assuming a fetal position.

The solution, as always, is the truth and building trust. Clearly, you have a vested interest in the outcome, but pointing fingers and calling for aggression isn’t the answer here.

Are you forgetting Georgia (same tactics, same rationale . . . etc.), i.e., Putin will not stop unless the West does something pro-active (that doesn’t mean going to war but if they don’t stop him now than we are enabling a tyrant who will continue to invade other countries on false pretexts)??? Moreover, Putin’s grasp on the Ukraine through Yanukovych was the reason that the Euro Maidan protestors wanted to side with the European Union, i.e., Yanukovich was becoming very much like his puppet master, the only difference is that the Ukrainians, especially from the West did not want an autocratic ruler but a democracy, and many risked their lives for it. Democracy isn’t always pretty to implement but I think it is well worth the risks!!

 

[GEddie]

Are you forgetting Georgia (same tactics, same rationale . . . etc.), i.e., Putin will not stop unless the West does something pro-active (that doesn’t mean going to war but if they don’t stop him now than we are enabling a tyrant who will continue to invade other countries on false pretexts)??? Moreover, Putin’s grasp on the Ukraine through Yanukovych was the reason that the Euro Maidan protestors wanted to side with the European Union, i.e., Yanukovich was becoming very much like his puppet master, the only difference is that the Ukrainians, especially from the West did not want an autocratic ruler but a democracy, and many risked their lives for it. Democracy isn’t always pretty to implement but I think it is well worth the risks!!

Nothing the West can do, short of military action, will stop him.

Although the Russian actions resemble Germany in 1939, this is not 1939. Economic pressure on the Germans might have worked at some point; but Russia is the biggest country in the world and can shrug off any penalties the Western world can bring itself to inflict.

ICXC NIKA

 

[pepipop]

On the contrary, the West appears to have had a very proactive foreign policy in Ukraine by fomenting what occurred in Kyiv. The problem, it appears to me, is that the assumption, made by the West, was that Ukraine would align easily with the West and Russia would not involve itself. The escalation was not anticipated and has left the West fumbling for what to do next. Putin has realized that the bungling has left him an opportunity to consolidate. He has also realized that the West is not as friendly to Russia as he had been led to believe over the past ten years, which is why he has pursued a proactive strategy. Much of this can be squarely blamed on the covert means used by the US and western political propaganda agencies that have involved themselves in foreign states. Putin is no fool, he knows that if Ukraine falls to the western political agenda, his own country is in jeopardy.

The West is not innocent with regard to what is happening in Ukraine and it is time that those who began this misadventure are held responsible, the truth told, Ukraine left to work out its own destiny and sincere diplomatic talks with Russia begin. Putin will not deal with those he knows he cannot trust and as long as the West continues to posture there is no chance of him backing down. He has too much to lose. The ball is in the West’s court and as long as the West plays a duplicitous posturing game, Putin will continue to play aggressively. He has less to lose by taking an offensive stance than he would by assuming a fetal position.

The solution, as always, is the truth and building trust. Clearly, you have a vested interest in the outcome, but pointing fingers and calling for aggression isn’t the answer here.

 

[KyivAndrew]

What is the word about HH Francis and PM Yatseniuk meeting today?

Ukrainian Prime Minister Arsenii Yatseniuk visits Vatican (updated)

On Saturday 26 April 2014 Pope Francis received Ukrainian Prime Minister Arsenii Yatseniuk, who was subsequently received by Secretary of State, Cardinal Pietro Parolin. The content of their discussions will be published in upcoming days.

From the Vatican, Yatseniuk and his entourage travelled to the Basilica of St. Sophia on the Via Boccea, built by Ukrainian Confessor of the Faith, Cardinal Yosyf Slipyi (+1984), who had been condemned by Joseph Stalin in 1945 to 18 years in the gulag. Slipyi was named a cardinal “in pectore” (in secret) by John XXIII a few years before his release in 1963.

At St. Sophia’s. PM Yatseniuk and entourage will participate in a prayer for Ukraine and meet the local Ukrainian community.

As head of the Ukrainian Government, Yatseniuk has come to represent Ukraine at the Canonizations of Popes John XXIII and John-Paul II,but escalating Ukrainian-Russian tensions prompted him to return home instead of staying for the canonization ceremony on Sunday.

Other members of the official Ukrainian delegation include Foreign Minister Andrii Deschytsya and Andrii Sadovyi, the Mayor of Lviv, a city which JP2 visited during his 2001 trip to Ukraine.

Yatsenyuk spent 18 minutes behind closed doors with the pope on Saturday, who had urged the international community to “prevent violence” in Ukraine in his Easter Sunday message, AP informs.

During the cordial talks, which took place in the context of the good bilateral relations between the Holy See and Ukraine, the current situation was discussed, with the hope that all interested parties would work together constructively for the restoration of political and social stability of the country, within the scope of international law, and that they would promote understanding among the peoples of the Region. The specific role of churches and religious organizations, and of individual believers, in fostering mutual respect and harmony among all sections of society was also noted. Finally, possible further action by the international community was mentioned."

At an exchange of gifts, Yatsenyuk presented Francis with a photograph of Maidan square in Kyiv on New Year’s night.

“This is where Ukrainians fought for their freedom and rights. Millions of people,” he said.

The pope in return gave the Ukraine leader a pen, saying “I hope this pen will sign the peace”, to which Yatsenyuk replied “I hope so.”

PM asked the Pope to pray for Ukraine and do everything within his power to bring peace and stability to Europe.

risu.org.ua/article_print.php?id=56207&name=vatikan&_lang=en&

View attachment 19864

 

[josie_L]

Nothing the West can do, short of military action, will stop him.

Although the Russian actions resemble Germany in 1939, this is not 1939. Economic pressure on the Germans might have worked at some point; but Russia is the biggest country in the world and can shrug off any penalties the Western world can bring itself to inflict.

ICXC NIKA

Hit him where it hurts the hardest, economically, i.e., maybe this is a good opportunity to start fracking oil/gas in Europe, Canada, and U.S., I wonder if he’ll reconsider invading Ukraine, if we were serious about extracting our own oil instead of being dependent on rogue nations like Russia.

 

[josie_L]

On the contrary, the West appears to have had a very proactive foreign policy in Ukraine by fomenting what occurred in Kyiv. The problem, it appears to me, is that the assumption, made by the West, was that Ukraine would align easily with the West and Russia would not involve itself. The escalation was not anticipated and has left the West fumbling for what to do next. Putin has realized that the bungling has left him an opportunity to consolidate. He has also realized that the West is not as friendly to Russia as he had been led to believe over the past ten years, which is why he has pursued a proactive strategy. Much of this can be squarely blamed on the covert means used by the US and western political propaganda agencies that have involved themselves in foreign states. Putin is no fool, he knows that if Ukraine falls to the western political agenda, his own country is in jeopardy.

The West is not innocent with regard to what is happening in Ukraine and it is time that those who began this misadventure are held responsible, the truth told, Ukraine left to work out its own destiny and sincere diplomatic talks with Russia begin. Putin will not deal with those he knows he cannot trust and as long as the West continues to posture there is no chance of him backing down. He has too much to lose. The ball is in the West’s court and as long as the West plays a duplicitous posturing game, Putin will continue to play aggressively. He has less to lose by taking an offensive stance than he would by assuming a fetal position.

The solution, as always, is the truth and building trust. Clearly, you have a vested interest in the outcome, but pointing fingers and calling for aggression isn’t the answer here.

I’m going to get down to the basics here, what would YOU do if you were living under autocratic rule or under a nation that was slowly becoming autocratic???

 

[Nelka]

I’m going to get down to the basics here, what would YOU do if you were living under autocratic rule or under a nation that was slowly becoming autocratic???

That’s one reason why I couldn’t live in America.

I wouldn’t start shooting people though.

 

[Seamus_L]

RIA Novosti Obtaines Satellite Photos Showing Ukrainian Military Buildup Near Slaviansk en.ria.ru/world/20140426/189389521/RIA-Novosti-Obtaines-Satellite-Photos-Showing-Ukrainian-Military-Buildup-Near-Slaviansk.html

 

[josie_L]

Ukrainian Prime Minister Arsenii Yatseniuk visits Vatican (updated)

On Saturday 26 April 2014 Pope Francis received Ukrainian Prime Minister Arsenii Yatseniuk, who was subsequently received by Secretary of State, Cardinal Pietro Parolin. The content of their discussions will be published in upcoming days.

From the Vatican, Yatseniuk and his entourage travelled to the Basilica of St. Sophia on the Via Boccea, built by Ukrainian Confessor of the Faith, Cardinal Yosyf Slipyi (+1984), who had been condemned by Joseph Stalin in 1945 to 18 years in the gulag. Slipyi was named a cardinal “in pectore” (in secret) by John XXIII a few years before his release in 1963.

At St. Sophia’s. PM Yatseniuk and entourage will participate in a prayer for Ukraine and meet the local Ukrainian community.

As head of the Ukrainian Government, Yatseniuk has come to represent Ukraine at the Canonizations of Popes John XXIII and John-Paul II, but escalating Ukrainian-Russian tensions prompted him to return home instead of staying for the canonization ceremony on Sunday.

Other members of the official Ukrainian delegation include Foreign Minister Andrii Deschytsya and Andrii Sadovyi, the Mayor of Lviv, a city which JP2 visited during his 2001 trip to Ukraine.

Yatsenyuk spent 18 minutes behind closed doors with the pope on Saturday, who had urged the international community to “prevent violence” in Ukraine in his Easter Sunday message, AP informs.

During the cordial talks, which took place in the context of the good bilateral relations between the Holy See and Ukraine, the current situation was discussed, with the hope that all interested parties would work together constructively for the restoration of political and social stability of the country, within the scope of international law, and that they would promote understanding among the peoples of the Region. The specific role of churches and religious organizations, and of individual believers, in fostering mutual respect and harmony among all sections of society was also noted. Finally, possible further action by the international community was mentioned."

At an exchange of gifts, Yatsenyuk presented Francis with a photograph of Maidan square in Kyiv on New Year’s night.

“This is where Ukrainians fought for their freedom and rights. Millions of people,” he said.

The pope in return gave the Ukraine leader a pen, saying “I hope this pen will sign the peace”, to which Yatsenyuk replied "I hope so."

**PM asked the Pope to pray for Ukraine and do everything within his power to bring peace and stability to Europe. **

Oh, you mean he and the interim Ukrainian government are not fascist bigots out to destroy the Russians, who knew!!!

 

[josie_L]

That’s one reason why I couldn’t live in America.

I wouldn’t start shooting people though.

And that’s why I wouldn’t want to live in England (I’m Canadian)! But more importantly would you want to live in Russia??

P.S. And those participating in the Maidan did not resort to violence until they had no other option, i.e., when you’re faced with a government that has little regard for its people that it can use violence in order to intimidate into submission than you are no longer dealing with a legitimate government.

Have a good Divine Mercy Sunday!!

 

[pepipop]

And that’s why I wouldn’t want to live in England (I’m Canadian)! But more importantly would you want to live in Russia??

P.S. And those participating in the Maidan did not resort to violence until they had no other option, **i.e., when you’re faced with a government that has little regard for its people that it can use violence in order to intimidate into submission than you are no longer dealing with a legitimate government. **

Have a good Divine Mercy Sunday!!

Precisely - got it in one! Particularly so, from Putin’s viewpoint, when the West - for reasons best known to themselves - helped to ‘choose’ the ‘interim’ government.