Ukraine

[esieffe]

Which is a source of comfort for the vast majority of those living in and near those parking spots. I should also mention how grateful we are to her Majesty, for the placement of Britain’s ships as well.

 

[josie_L]

Context? You left out my last sentence when you quoted me.

**
"I can cite other sources, with the same order, but really, google will work just as well for you.

Of these countries, secular or otherwise, who do you think has the most Catholic / Christian ministries world wide? **Please bear this in mind before bashing US citizenry in this debate.****"

Thank you Essiefe! God bless! Oh, and I’m a Canadian who loves my American neighbours, and I wouldn’t trade being next to you for the world.

 

[esieffe]

Well, since it was pro-Putin posters that brought up abortion and the anti-homosexual propaganda first (not sure if you noticed that or not), it’s only fair that Esieffe does the same, and although abortions have dropped somewhat, I believe abortions still outnumber live births.

Thanks, that IS exactly why I mentioned it. Given the direction of events and the tone of this thread in its entirety, it is pretty ironic how things have turned out in the real world.

Someone mentioned the treaty that the US and the UK have with the Ukraine. I don’t know if that included NATO or not, but it is a pretty scary situation when you add that element to this as well.

 

[josie_L]

That’s nice.

My point wasn’t just the the timing, but the sneaky way they landed – not in uniform, without being announced, and stopping all airport traffic for their troop movements.

Those are three uncompromising elements that do not say, “Hey, we’re just here to do an exercise!” And frankly, combined with your smug finger pointing at everyone else’s ignorance, I’m shocked that you wouldn’t see it and again insulted that you would dare defend it as if you really do think others aren’t half as astute, traveled, or cultured as you.

The three elements I gave demonstrate terrorist tactics, not soldier’s tactics.

I’ll be praying for your family in the Ukraine (there’s a thread in the prayer intentions forum on the Ukraine).

 

[esieffe]

Thank you Essiefe! God bless! Oh, and I’m a Canadian who loves my American neighbours, and I wouldn’t trade being next to you for the world.

You are SO welcome, and I feel the EXACT same way about our Canadian brothers and sisters! My Dad’s side of the family is Canadian! I would LOVE to move there in fact, but … I don’t know if I could take the cold… and it is a bit pricey up there!!

One day I want to spend a summer there at the retreat they have… a Catholic community which also trains people for the priesthood and other vocations.

 

[josie_L]

You are SO welcome, and I feel the EXACT same way about our Canadian brothers and sisters! My Dad’s side of the family is Canadian! I would LOVE to move there in fact, but … I don’t know if I could take the cold… and it is a bit pricey up there!!

Depends where in Canada, Vancouver and Toronto are pretty expensive cities to live in, but Montreal is not all that bad (it’s where I live), there are also other cities you could move to that have a lower cost of living. Sorry, I never quite caught your name even though I’ve seen you post, my names is Josie, i.e., like my handle. Nice to “meet” you! :curtsey:

 

[esieffe]

They think if they can return things to the Cold War with Russia as the enemy, some of Americas respect in the world might return as well, and they might not feel so bad about themselves.

:banghead:
I think that is a bit of a stretch.

 

[TK421]

It won’t be hard at all. They’ll just ignore the treaty. A US-Russian war would be madness, and everybody knows it.

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

It won’t be hard at all. They’ll just ignore the treaty. A US-Russian war would be madness, and everybody knows it.

Our current President is mad himself (sorry to be so blunt, but that is the way I feel)------to be honest, I would not be surprised if he decides to go ahead and listen to Neuland (who’s basically a neo-conservative) and others and goes ahead and goes to war with Russia.

You are expecting an immoral, socialist, purveyor of death-on-demand and gay marriage to act rationally on this?

Yeah, right…

 

[Seamus_L]

America has lost all credibility. In the event of a war between Christian majority Armenia and Muslim majority Azerbaijan, it would be Russia with the Christians and America with the Muslims.

 

[RPRPsych]

You’re a guitar player? That’s awesome.

That said, I agree with the Praying Raccoon: the US and UK will probably just pretend this didn’t happen. Neither of them can afford a war, and this one would be suicidal.

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

America has lost all credibility. In the event of a war between Christian majority Armenia and Muslim majority Azerbaijan, it would be Russia with the Christians and America with the Muslims.

Oh, the irony…

 

[josie_L]

Our current President is mad------to be honest, I would not be surprised if he decides to go ahead and listen to Neuland (who’s basically a neo-conservative) and others and goes ahead and goes to war with Russia.

You are expecting an immoral, socialist, purveyor of death-on-demand and gay marriage to act rationally on this?

Yeah, right…

Although, I don’t like your president whatsoever, I think Putin is tyrannical. And rationality needs to go both ways.

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

Although, I don’t like your president whatsoever, I think Putin is tyrannical. And rationality needs to go both ways.

Yes, it does. Absolutely.

A plague on both houses.

Just was concentrating on the President of my country first.

 

[KyivAndrew]

Andrey Illarionov knows Vladimir Putin better than anybody here. He was Vladimir Putin’s senior economic adviser from 2000 and Putin’s personal representative to the G8 from 2000 to 2005. He wrote on his blog today, that:

“Putin is doing everything to start a full-scale civil war in Ukraine… to provoke one. The goal is to force and provoke the Ukrainian authorities to react, use force, shoot… for there to be losses. Corpses are required. Lots of corpses. The more the ‘better.’ The more glaring the deaths of this or that social group, the more effective [Putin’s] progaganda”

pravda.com.ua/news/2014/02/28/7016700/ (translation mine: sorry I can’t find it in English)

Ukraine’s Ministry of Defense is sorely worried about some provocation by ‘radicals’ tonight.
pravda.com.ua/news/2014/03/1/7016715/
The Russians have blockaded Ukraine’s coastguard and Ukraine’s armed formations in Crimea. The Ukrainians have not responded.

The Russians have apparently closed the airspace over Crimea
twitter.com/flightradar24/status/439472051850461184/photo/1

and I believe they took a main communications tower, as well as the two airports.

David Remnick from the New Yorker on CNN said Putin is “playing with fire” while General Spider Marks called it a Russian invasion of Ukraine.

 

[TK421]

Our current President is mad himself (sorry to be so blunt, but that is the way I feel)------to be honest, I would not be surprised if he decides to go ahead and listen to Neuland (who’s basically a neo-conservative) and others and goes ahead and goes to war with Russia.

You are expecting an immoral, socialist, purveyor of death-on-demand and gay marriage to act rationally on this?

Yeah, right…

Obama isn’t going to listen to a neoconservative. He hasn’t in the past. For all the faults of the man I really see no reason to expect him to be anything but conservative when dealing with this. There’s been rumors about a US-Russian war for over 70 years and it’s never happened. That doesn’t mean it isn’t possible (rule of the game is: it doesn’t matter if you’re wrong a thousand times. You only need to be right once), but it’s not going to be over something like Ukraine. You’d pretty much need to have a crew of Spetsnaz officers amphibiously assaulting Los Angeles, with Putin jumping out of a landing craft wearing a beret and firing an AK-47 into a crowd of retired veterans. And you know what? If something like that happened, there still wouldn’t be a war.

 

[Dtmccameron]

You’d pretty much need to have a crew of Spetsnaz officers amphibiously assaulting Los Angeles, with Putin jumping out of a landing craft wearing a beret and firing an AK-47 into a crowd of retired veterans. And you know what? If something like that happened, there still wouldn’t be a war.

Hopefully there’d be a movie. Something along the lines of Hot Shots.

 

[livingwordunity]

If the UN does go to war with Russia the real reason is because Putin rejected the gay agenda, and Russia is becoming more Christian. The leftist UN would rather that Russia return to communism.

 

[TigerKitty]

What if a group from the Ukraine infiltrates a Russian military base and launches a nuke at the US to provoke the US to get involved against Russia? (Kind of like what happened in Star Trek VI: the undiscovered country.)

I think if something like this ever happened, I would end up being glad that O is in office. I think that he would just pretend the whole thing never happened, and he would not retaliate.

Read a news report earlier about a WH press briefing he gave, and the report of his comments and behavior when fielding a question regarding possible nuclear war with Russia was scary. I couldn’t tell if he was being overly cavalier or just plain clueless to the possible severity of the situation.

 

[OrdinaryMelkite]

Obama isn’t going to listen to a neoconservative. He hasn’t in the past. For all the faults of the man I really see no reason to expect him to be anything but conservative when dealing with this. There’s been rumors about a US-Russian war for over 70 years and it’s never happened. That doesn’t mean it isn’t possible (rule of the game is: it doesn’t matter if you’re wrong a thousand times. You only need to be right once), but it’s not going to be over something like Ukraine. You’d pretty much need to have a crew of Spetsnaz officers amphibiously assaulting Los Angeles, with Putin jumping out of a landing craft wearing a beret and firing an AK-47 into a crowd of retired veterans. And you know what? If something like that happened, there still wouldn’t be a war.

I think you also forget-----Putin is of the “old school” of Soviet-style states-craft-------you back down, you are showing weakness--------

Russia is not going to give up Ukraine without a fight. They consider it part of the standard Russian “motherland.” There is also the matter of the millions of ethnic Russians and Russian-leaning Ukrainians in the east and south central part of the country. And Crimea as well. Crimea has a Russian naval base there. An important one, as well. They have a say in this matter as well.

I sincerely hope you are right. But given the situation here-----it is not illogical or irrational to hope for the best but prepare for the worst.