US Presidential Election Debate #1

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JimR-OCDS said:
Obama Care is based on Romney Care, and the parts that Romney would keep in Obama Care are 98% of it.

Romney would make Obama Care look more like Romney care, but mostly it would be left to the states to run rather than the federal government. What it covers would be essentially the same.

Jim
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What a minute…lost me. Romeny’s new plan would be 98% of Obamacare, which is really just the fed version of Romneycare. So wouldn’t his new plan actually just be 98% Romneycare?
 
Mr. Al Gore on Obama’s failed debate performance – ‘it was the altitude, not the attitude’

Ahhhhh…Mr Gore, weren’t they both in the same building?
 
JimR-OCDS said:
Last evening, Romney said that Obama spent 90 billion in clean energy, which far exceeds the amount of savings if he takes away the tax credits the oil companies get.

Looking at CNN Factcheck on this topic, Mitt was right.
The Department of Energy proudly touts that the 2009 stimulus authorized $90 billion “in government investments and tax incentives to lay the foundation for the clean energy economy of our future.”
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The Space Shuttle program cost over 200 billion dollars - was it worth it? I’m not so sure.

Nevertheless, it demonstrates that investing in new technologies is always extremely expensive. However, in comparison to the space program, clean energy is so much more vital to the long term health of our economy and the planet. If the technological problems associated with making it affordable & efficient were easy to figure out - it would have been done already, but the risks are too high and private investors aren’t going to touch it. That is why we need the government investments to take the lead.

It isn’t about picking winners & losers, its about setting a course with a goal for the future of this country. The GOP doesn’t have any new ideas. They have not put forth a vision for the future that is any different than what we’ve had in the past. They would leave everything to the whims and vagrancies of market forces which focus on short term profits. They have left behind the idea of moving ahead cautiously and have adopted a nostalgia for a time that never existed and policies that failed in the past.

Newt’s “moon colony” idea was a bit corny - but at least it was a vision for the future.
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bellasbane said:
The Space Shuttle program cost over 200 billion dollars - was it worth it? I’m not so sure.

Nevertheless, it demonstrates that investing in new technologies is always extremely expensive. However, in comparison to the space program, clean energy is so much more vital to the long term health of our economy and the planet. If the technological problems associated with making it affordable & efficient were easy to figure out - it would have been done already, but the risks are too high and private investors aren’t going to touch it. That is why we need the government investments to take the lead.

It isn’t about picking winners & losers, its about setting a course with a goal for the future of this country. The GOP doesn’t have any new ideas. They have not put forth a vision for the future that is any different than what we’ve had in the past. They would leave everything to the whims and vagrancies of market forces which focus on short term profits. They have left behind the idea of moving ahead cautiously and have adopted a nostalgia for a time that never existed and policies that failed in the past.

Newt’s “moon colony” idea was a bit corny - but at least it was a vision for the future.
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The thing is, the Space Shuttle didn’t crash and burn every flight. No “green” company that received money was successful :rolleyes:
 
pepipop said:
I genuinely know practically nothing about US politics, however due to the current global economic crisis, I still think Obama will win this. Mostly due to the fact that most people are out of work, and even aside from Romney’s 47% quote, a ‘labour’ type government usually gets voted in, in these global conditions.
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With all due respect, Mr. Obama’s program is exactly why there are so many people out of work. I am speaking of the US only. But I suspect other countries in trouble, as is ours, are spending more money than they take in and are reluctant to make any changes.
 
kimmielittle said:
Mr. Al Gore on Obama’s failed debate performance – ‘it was the altitude, not the attitude’

Ahhhhh…Mr Gore, weren’t they both in the same building?
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Yeah I sure hope Obama takes the advice of Mr. Gore 😃
 
bellasbane said:
You’re right, these are my own observations. I’ve watched many debates and never before have I felt like the moderator was loosing control like I did with this one and it wasn’t Obama who gave me that impression.

Obama spoke more in the first few rounds, but Romney more often insisted on having the last word when he wasn’t entitled to the extra turn. That sort of bully behavior is not a trait I admire in politicians. He deserved a good scolding from Jim Lehrer, who unfortunately fell into the trap of being too polite to tell him off.

Nothing Romney said last night would convince me to vote for him, because all he did was propose the same old Republican policies I’ve rejected in the past: Voodoo trickle-down economics, drastic cuts to entitlements, and huge increases in defense spending.

Tell me one thing that was new.
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Asking Obama to answer questions and defend his record was quite a NEW concept for him. How’d that work out?

Lisa
 
LisaA said:
Asking Obama to answer questions and defend his record was quite a NEW concept for him. How’d that work out?

Lisa
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It worked out well LisaA! You just need to bump up your Obama-Leftist Kool-Aide intake. 👍
 
meltzerboy said:
Which MSNBC were you watching? On the one I was watching, including Rachel Maddow, Ed Schultz, Al Sharpton, Steve Schmidt, etc., all said Romney won the debate, which he did.
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CMatt25 said:
Meltzer, I watched CNN and MSNBC but you and I watched the same MSNBC. No idea which MSNBC the other poster watched.
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The same MCNBC that every one watched.

Matthews was whining about the debate not being an MSNBC debate. And that Romney dominated the time. :confused: (Obama got more time.) And that Romney lied about just about everything.

I guess instead of saying that MSNBC is saying Obama won, I should have said they are trying to spin what happened. Romney didn’t win. He cheated; by lying, by overriding the moderator or some such thing. I bet by today, they will be explaining that Obama was too busy running the country to prepare for the debate. Which would make sense if Obama was actually running the country instead of being on the View.
 
austenbosten said:
Trickle-down government: is the government thinking it can do a better job than free people pursuing their dreams.
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That was a great line and I think something we understand. The top down government focused in Washington where we send them boatloads of money that they distribute to their favorite projects, supporters and states is rather reminiscent of the old Soviet system that was a complete failure. Central control of economies has never worked and while some posters are claiming the Republicans have no new ideas…I have to wonder what do they think about the current trend toward Statism? Not exactly new and if history is any indicator, not very effective.

The other line by Romney I liked was the idea of a program had to be so important it was worth borrowing from China to maintain. I think that is something we can all relate to in our lives as we make decisions. IOW is that new car important enough to take out a loan? Is that Ivy League education so important that we take out a loan. Maybe or maybe not but bringing up something like PBS which in times of prosperity is “nice” to have is something that can be on the chopping block when compared to national defense or Social Security or another essential program.

I was honestly amazed that Obama kept repeating his usual talking points even if they didn’t relate to the question. He would meander down some rabbit trail then seem to realize it wasn’t going anywhere and shift to yet another rabbit trail. Eventually he’d run out of time leaving the audience wondering what happened.

Lisa
 
bellasbane said:
What’s that? Please explain.
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The same tax and spend policies you probably supported in the past. Just what non-entilements would you like to see cut (outside of the military, of course, the world is an entirely safe place!)?

NEA? PBS? Planned Parenthood? What???

I’ve yet to have seen an administration tax themselves out of a recession. And the cuts are coming somewhere, whether Obama supporters are willing to admit it or not.
 
bellasbane said:
You’re right, these are my own observations. I’ve watched many debates and never before have I felt like the moderator was loosing control like I did with this one and it wasn’t Obama who gave me that impression.

Obama spoke more in the first few rounds, but Romney more often insisted on having the last word when he wasn’t entitled to the extra turn. That sort of bully behavior is not a trait I admire in politicians. He deserved a good scolding from Jim Lehrer, who unfortunately fell into the trap of being too polite to tell him off.

Nothing Romney said last night would convince me to vote for him, because all he did was propose the same old Republican policies I’ve rejected in the past: Voodoo trickle-down economics, drastic cuts to entitlements, and huge increases in defense spending.

Tell me one thing that was new.
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Why would I waste my time doing that? I could care less about trying to convince you. If you are willing to vote for Obama, given his track record on life issues, and his All-Star level of suckiness on this economic “recovery”, I harbor no illusions that some message board is going to convince you.
 
JimR-OCDS said:
After thinking about the debate last evening, and having seen Obama debate back in the last election against Hillary and then McCain, and knowing that he has debate skills far surpassing last evening’s performance, I have to wonder?

Is Obama playing a “rope a dope,” strategy, holding back until the last debate? The last debate is the one the voters will remember before going to vote. Perhaps it’s there that Obama will come out swinging and land a knockout punch.

Not saying this is the case, but last night’s performance was not Obama’s best for sure.

So Romney supporters, don’t get over confident.

Jim
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No one is overconfident by any means, but I don’t buy that for a second. Obama has a huge ego by all accounts, is not up by very much, and early voting is going on now. Not to mention, what if voters don’t tune back in and miss his grand finale?

No one does that in these races - “I’ll sandbag it then nail 'em when they don;t see it coming!”.
 
CMatt25 said:
Meltzer, I watched CNN and MSNBC but you and I watched the same MSNBC. No idea which MSNBC the other poster watched. I have nothing much to add to what you said here. You pretty much got it right. Other than I wonder since Obama knew he has been leading in the polls, especially in crucial places like Ohio and other swing states, and in many Electoral College predictions if maybe he was just playing defense to hold the lead. Great to know the last incumbant went on to win after losing to Kerry. Do you know who won the 2nd debate between Kerry/Bush? On your questions I can’t help. I long ago gave up trying to keep track of Romney’s positions. And it’s on to the next…
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Ed Schultz “disappointed” in Obama debate performance

Chris Matthews’ Loses His Mind Epic Meltdown Over Obama Debate Loss - ‘What Was He Doing Tonight?’
 
ringil said:
Romney did pretty well in this first debate. CNN states that %67 believe he won this time around. Hopefully Obama will rise to the occasion a bit more on the next two.

It looks like the various debates in the primaries really gave Romney some valuable experience.
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That’s how you post an honest assessment, while still standing by your candidate. Bellasbane, take notes.
 
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