Again we are talking sin here, not crime! There are lots of sins that might be made legal; particularly in the form that it takes when the rich commit them. The British made it a crime for Indians to make salt in a country where salt was necessary to survive so that they could tax them. It might have been a crime for Ghandi to make salt, but the sin was with the British for essentially extorting money from the Indians for their survival.
apparently not to some,.,
They may have very little reason to steal if we look at it from a perspective of need, but yet there are many wealthy who in fact do the moral equivalent of stealing all the time.
I don’t have a problem with elevating the economies of the third world, but that is only a happy side effect of what the companies are doing and it comes at the cost of an unjust means (i.e. the taking of jobs from those who need them in another part of the world).
No, the poor are more likely to commit crimes that will impact other individuals. The rich are more likely to commit crimes that will impact thousands.
crimes are sins, more often than not. sins that are not crimes: cursing, lying, cheating, bullying. theres plenty of those in slum areas and the 3rd world.
I will try to remember to tell Him when I see Him.
There is also plenty of cursing, lying, cheating and bullying going on in the boardrooms of Corporate America.
I was just ticked off by the OP which falsely said that being filtyhy rich is considered a mortal sin. And you seem to imply that the rich is more wicked than the rest of us. Even jesus suggests that the wealthy is practically impossible from attaining salvation.
thousands of companies have outsourced and yet the west is still well off. laid off westerners do know how to adapt with the changing workplace. they are not as oppressed as you would like to think.
that is true. thats why i said that the thieving wealthy deserves hell. i was only pointing out that crime among the wealthy has a much lower rate than crime among the poor.
There is sense in those words, just ones that our modern world is finding harder and harder to listen to. We need to remember the story of the Rich Man and Lazarus. As we feast, others in the world starve. Too many of us are ready to believe that because we did not cause their starvation, that we are virtuous. We need to remember that to do nothing to help them (or practically nothing) is itself sinful.
Care to tell that to the people’s whose jobs are actually outsourced? There are many former textile workers in the Carolinas who will never make the same wages they made at the textile mills before their jobs were outsourced. Even if they recover, that is hardly a justification. Most people who are mugged recover and prosper afterwards, that doesn’t make mugging them right.
But again, crime is totally irrelevant. The rich can and do harm the poor and the middle class every day in the name of progress. It is all legal, but it doesn’t make it moral.
its not that simple. wealth serves as incentives for people to work hard. the desire for wealth creates jobs. and the presence of wealth fuels creativity. its wrong to just dismiss wealthy people as like camels trying to enter the eye of a needle. like what you said, wealthy people have their own set of temptations. but there is no reason to believe that the challenges they encounter make them more wicked than the average guy.
Like my wife, and her friends. When their medical tools company went to mexico. They found other jobs rather quickly. Some invested in education and became accountants. My wife became a computer technician. And the west is still wealthy.
are you saying that outsourcing permanently raises the unemployment rate? because if it doesnt, then you have no point.
Contrary to popular impression, the Vatican is a spartan operation. Its annual operating budget is about $277 million. The University of Notre Dame’s annual operating budget, by comparison, is $700 million. The Vatican’s endowment is about $770 million. By contrast, the University of Notre Dame’s endowment is $3.1 billion. The Holy See is indeed in need of financial support from the Catholic world, and American Catholics usually supply about 25 percent of the annual operating budget.
I dont think so.
I know you don’t. That doesn’t make it any less true.
Agnos, I get it, you embrace capitalism and all its promises. The ends justify the means and all of that. But with respect, don’t be surprised if serious Christians find your arguments less than compelling. Believe it or not, there are other sources of motivation in this world. The craftsmen of the Middle Ages created the great Cathedrals with little more incentive than the hope that there work would be pleasing to God.
So I am just curious, if I am right, and God asks you why you supported outsourcing and all of this at the final judgement, are you just going to say “the west is still wealthy”? Let me repeat, I care not the slightest about the total result if the result was achieved by hurting others as the means of achieving that result. The ends do not and cannot justify the means. The fact that your wife and others in your area were able to find new jobs is great. But others in other areas have not been so lucky. And even if they have been, it hardly justifies the suffering that loosing a job brings.
I think you missed my point. Christianity is not about statistics. In this context, it is how we as individuals treat our neighbors. As a Christian, I cannot justify harming a single innocent person, even transiently, by stating that 100 or 1000 or a billion will benefit as a result.
I think you should read the actual statement from the vatican before you start using misquotes from others in this thread concerning “filthy” or “obscenely rich” persons.
my friend, that phrase only applies if the ‘means’ used classifies as atrocities. otherwise its ok, like if you have to make a little white lie to save your own life from murderers. right?
that means arent really that bad. its less than perfect.
oh i do believe it. but man does not live by the word of god alone.
believe me, we both agree here.
I will say “*God, outsourcing helped improve the global economy. Being hurt a little is an integral part of growing up. It makes us wiser & more resilient. No pain, no gain.
*.” And with that, God gives me a pat of reasssurance, and tells me “Thats my boy”.Of course they have been able to find new jobs. Employers are completely justified in moving their business. And it benefitted the mexicans who need more dough than americans. No sin is committed here.
Man had always been materialistic. But the demise of religion today is the due to the failures of your clergies (catholic, muslim, protestants, etc. all failing together) throughout history. Skeletons being spilled from religious closets thanks to the modern dissemination of knowledge. Thats whats really been costing souls. the improving economy has very …verrry little to do with it.
Actually, no. The Church has taught that any lie is morally wrong and can’t be justified. It might be excused, but it can’t be justified.my friend, that phrase only applies if the ‘means’ used classifies as atrocities. otherwise its ok, like if you have to make a little white lie to save your own life from murderers. right?
Why do I think that all evils are justified that way?
No, it also lives by the Body and Blood of Jesus. But I would not want to try to live with out the word of God.
I will say “*God, outsourcing helped improve the global economy. Being hurt a little is an integral part of growing up. It makes us wiser & more resilient. No pain, no gain.
Jesus said. If anyone causes theses little ones to sin it would be better if they had a stone around their neck and tossed into the sea. We are all God’s little ones…his children.
