Vice Presidential Debate

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Trader said:
Without being too obvious, who the Vice-President is does not matter much, unless something bad happens to the President. Then it matters a lot. That is why the Constitution specifies exactly the same qualifications for both President and Vice President.

Last night, one of the candidates was disrepectful to his opponent and his audience with frequent interruptions and insisted on calling the president of a sovereign nation and ally by his nickname, BeBe. Four years ago, most people thought Sara Palin was not ready to be President. In this debate, only Paul Ryan showed himself to posess the intellect and demeanor to represent me as President of the United States. Biden would be an international embarrassment to all of us as President.

Maybe even more important, since both Presidential candiates are relatively young and healthy, the selection of a Vice President running mate says a lot about the judgement of the Presidential Candidate.
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👍
 
livnlern said:
Really? So it’s okay with you that the Vice President of the US lacks the self-discipline to keep from grinning and chuckling to himself when someone expresses a difference of opinion? I have to wonder if he does this with foreign dignitaries. Does he do this when he and (his best bud) “Be Be” get together?
He didn’t seem able to control himself.
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Unstatesmanship. (If it were German, it would be a word:))
 
estesbob said:
Bidens performance last night was the result of Obama dismal performance last week. He was tasked with making the retorts the Left has been saying Obama should have made last week. He did a great job of throwing red meat to the Democrat base. However when you are a month out of the election it is a sign of trouble when you are still concerned about shoring up your base.
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I think it was a terrible tactic. Democrats are not going to decide this election, independents are and hearing of the various focus groups people seemed turned off by Biden’s condescending manner and grinning
 
Trader said:
Last night, one of the candidates was disrepectful to his opponent and his audience with frequent interruptions and insisted on calling the president of a sovereign nation and ally by his nickname, BeBe. Four years ago, most people thought Sara Palin was not ready to be President. In this debate, only Paul Ryan showed himself to posess the intellect and demeanor to represent me as President of the United States. Biden would be an international embarrassment to all of us as President.
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You are welcome to express your opinions on all those points, all of which I disagree with. How horrible - referring to Netanyahi by his nickname! Like millions of Israeis do. 🤷
 
ishii said:
Let me guess… you are an Obama/Biden partisan. I understand that’s your job. I wonder what the independents and less partisan think about this.

Ishii
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Well, if people were turning off their TV, it’s a bad sign for the dems.

Biden had good non-verbal for most the night, aside from the smirks which are now hurting him in the buzz and in the end people want something substantive, and with Biden it was the same old class warfare and he even mentioned Bush and Palin by name, which at this point is** only free advertising from them.**

Democrats will of course say Biden won, which I can see from his aggressive stance and he fired right out of the gate and the GOP underestimated him at their own loss.

Ryan also missed some chances to ice Biden, but eventually got it going and closed with a massive, uncontested bang.

Biden gave the base a good dose of entertainment and Ryan missed a chance to put some more nails in the coffin, but that’s about it from this vantage point.
 
qui_est_ce said:
I agree Ryan was timid. To use Obama’s excuse, maybe Ryan was thinking “I think it’s fair to say I was just too polite, because, you know, it’s hard to sometimes just keep on saying, ‘And what you’re saying isn’t true,’” . “It gets repetitive."

What bothers me is that many Americans think it is acceptable to behave the way Biden did.
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qui, the left is going to adore Biden for his performance, but all that matters is what those swing-voters and independents think.

Romney, Ryan and the President get that.

Not sure Biden did or how much if he did…he really looked like he was restraining himself.

Those are the people who want substance and real solutions and Biden mentioning Palin and Bush by name….

not good.
 
qui_est_ce said:
What bothers me is that many Americans think it is acceptable to behave the way Biden did.
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I’m not bothered by Biden, but what is important to me, unlike to other Catholics apparently, is the substance of their talk, not who is smiling and grinning. Do you think for even a second that Biden’s laughter is going to make people say,“Well that does it for me. Biden was :eek: disrespectful to Paul Ryan. Now I MUST vote for Romney.” I think not, especially because Joe is Joe and we know his style.

BTW, this morning’s news is all about Biden, not about, what’s his name, oh, yes Ryan.

Ryan did pretty well though. I’ll give him that for sure. 👍
 
He_Man said:
  1. Cap gains is not a loop hole. Unless you consider income tax a loop hole too. And sales tax.
  2. There is evidence all over this country’shistory, as well as Europe’s, that lowering cap gains taxes INCREASES revenue, dramatically. There has to be a floor of course (since zero is the theoretical threshold), but raising the cap gains tax generally stifles revenue flow.
It comes down to which is more important to people -
  1. Raising as much revenue as possible?
or
  1. Feeling like everyone is paying their “fair share.”
If the goal of the tax system is to make you feel better about fairness, but all means. go for two. Just don’t cry when you’re still poor.
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Wow…that was solid.
 
 
During the debate I was complaining that Ryan was not forceful enough. Reflecting on the event I cannot imagine a more aggressive Ryan would have worked w/ Biden’s strategy of talking-over & out of turn. Add the weak moderator into the mix and it’s a yelling match. Did you notice how often Ryan took a gulp of water? Ryan to self: drink some water & stay calm.
 
scipio337 said:
My brother on the debate (hard-core Democrat):

“Biden wasn’t grinning, his dentures were loose!” He thougth Ryan came across as “pompous”, but I’m sure he would have thought that, regardless. 😃
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Timid, yes.

Pompous, no.
 
Julianna said:
Totally understandable. I have also noticed the Christian Right vanished from this political campaign. Something about not being able to stomach an LDS for President (evangels/fundies have been preaching for years how LDS is one big cult) and a Roman Catholic Vice President…? Jerry Falwell must be rolling over in his grave for sure. Keep in mind, the Christian Right/Coalition never opened it’s arms to Catholics…ever. The Republican Party now must rely on big money vs. the big mouths of the CR/C.
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http://ak.imgfarm.com/images/ap/thumbnails//APTOPIX_Romney_2012.sff_NCEV103_20121011163049.jpg Mitt Romney meets with Rev. Billy Graham
 
USCCB Responds To Inaccurate Statement Of Fact On HHS Mandate Made During Vice Presidential Debate
The U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops (USCCB) issued the following statement, October 12. Full text follows:
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Last night, the following statement was made during the Vice Presidential debate regarding the decision of the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) to force virtually all employers to include sterilization and contraception, including drugs that may cause abortion, in the health insurance coverage they provide their employees:
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“With regard to the assault on the Catholic Church, let me make it absolutely clear. No religious institution—Catholic or otherwise, including Catholic social services, Georgetown hospital, Mercy hospital, any hospital—none has to either refer contraception, none has to pay for contraception, none has to be a vehicle to get contraception in any insurance policy they provide. That is a fact. That is a fact.”
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This is not a fact. The HHS mandate contains a narrow, four-part exemption for certain “religious employers.” That exemption was made final in February and does not extend to “Catholic social services, Georgetown hospital, Mercy hospital, any hospital,” or any other religious charity that offers its services to all, regardless of the faith of those served.
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HHS has proposed an additional “accommodation” for religious organizations like these, which HHS itself describes as “non-exempt.” That proposal does not even potentially relieve these organizations from the obligation “to pay for contraception” and “to be a vehicle to get contraception.” They will have to serve as a vehicle, because they will still be forced to provide their employees with health coverage, and that coverage will still have to include sterilization, contraception, and abortifacients. They will have to pay for these things, because the premiums that the organizations (and their employees) are required to pay will still be applied, along with other funds, to cover the cost of these drugs and surgeries.
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USCCB continues to urge HHS, in the strongest possible terms, actually to eliminate the various infringements on religious freedom imposed by the mandate.
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For more details, please see USCCB’s regulatory comments filed on May 15 regarding the proposed “accommodation”: www.usccb.org/about/general-counsel/rulemaking/upload/comments-on-advance-notice-of-proposed-rulemaking-on-preventive-services-12-05-15.pdf
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Joe Biden made statement the USSCB responded too
 
SuperLuigi said:
Rich Olszewski;9886882:
That’s fine, especially since you’re not voting for him, unless he changed your mind with his magical grinning last night.
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No. I long ago decided not to vote in this presidential election.
Gee, the news swinging in favor of the democrats.
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I figured they would since the debate was all over the place last night and Biden got it right out of the gate.
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Just like nearly everyone on this Forum considered Ryan the winner. 😃
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He_Man said:
  1. Cap gains is not a loop hole. Unless you consider income tax a loop hole too. And sales tax.
  2. There is evidence all over this country’shistory, as well as Europe’s, that lowering cap gains taxes INCREASES revenue, dramatically. There has to be a floor of course (since zero is the theoretical threshold), but raising the cap gains tax generally stifles revenue flow.
It comes down to which is more important to people -

***1) Raising as much revenue as possible?

or
  1. Feeling like everyone is paying their “fair share.”***
    If the goal of the tax system is to make you feel better about fairness, but all means. go for two. Just don’t cry when you’re still poor.
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This is the clear contrast between the two sides. When Obama was called out regarding this question he came down on the side of “fairness” over increased revenue. He is an idealogue with respect to the economy, energy, and religious liberty. The lack of logic in his positions doesn’t mean anything to his fellow idealogues but I think most Americans can relate to the concept that we need more revenue and less spending…kitchen table economics is what I think is more understandable to most Americans. We know we can’t spend more than we bring in for the long term.

As some have pointed out people on welfare don’t pay income taxes. Higher energy prices are a tax on the lower and middle class, the groups Obama claims he wants to help. Ethanol subsidies mean less corn production for food, higher food prices and added this year was the drought. It’s becoming a viscious cycle, welfare and food stamps due to lack of jobs, fewer tax dollars to support these programs, higher prices making the poor and middle class poorer, thus more dependence on government programs…which have decreased revenues.

Logic and the Democrat tax position are not even passing acquaintences.

Lisa
 
_Abyssinia said:
Joe Biden said

Hope people understand the importance of the election and abortion and how your vote could determine the future balance of the supreme court and abortion legality
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I’m pro life, but do you think most American women want abortion illegal? I don’t know for sure but Joe Biden with his comments thinks the legality of abortion helps his chances of re- election
 
Rich_Olszewski said:
I’m not bothered by Biden, but what is important to me, unlike to other Catholics apparently, is the substance of their talk, not who is smiling and grinning. Do you think for even a second that Biden’s laughter is going to make people say,“Well that does it for me. Biden was :eek: disrespectful to Paul Ryan. Now I MUST vote for Romney.” I think not, especially because Joe is Joe and we know his style.

BTW, this morning’s news is all about Biden, not about, what’s his name, oh, yes Ryan.

Ryan did pretty well though. I’ll give him that for sure. 👍
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I have heard from the left many times that Ryan did well enough–and if the left can admit that, then Ryan did his job. Biden did well simply because he made no huge mistakes, as so many assumed he would. I do think laughing during foreign policy discussions is a huge mark against Biden’s overall appearance. Most people know that foreign policy today is no laughing matter.

I will put it this way: if Biden had remained cordial and respectful while he was not speaking, he would have been the clear winner. Yet, his personal demeanor and his constant interruptions brought his overall performance down–which allowed the debate to be closer to a tie.
 
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