Want to get married, but don't want children

[heidi_storage]

I was responding to the OP too, actually. It’s really easy to judge kids’ behavior unjustly; I did it a great deal when I was younger, I’m sorry to say, and I heartily wish I could go and smack my younger self upside the head.

 

[DisorientingSneeze]

The turning point where you go from “that’s terrible” to “I’m just not there yet, respect” or “how can I help this woman…right now!”

 

[1ke]

It’s more uncharitable that these women have kid after kid and don’t discipline them and then allow them to grow into brats in the first place.

“BRAT” is in the eye of the beholder.

No one ever died from being a brat. And most “bratty” kids grow out of it. In fact all kids, and many adults, can be “bratty” in any given circumstance.

You are basically denigrating parents who don’t parent the way you would theoretically parent. Not cool.

 

[Diamond93]

Diamond93:

have this deep-rooted aversion to having children

That is something that probably needs talking through with a therapist.

OK, wow, I am blown away by your judgmentalism. Why is my desire to not have children so abnormal that I need to see a therapist? In the same way that not everyone likes the same food, music, movies, etc. and they’re not judged as needing therapy because it’s “different,” why are you saying I need therapy just because I don’t desire something that most women want? Why is it so wrong that I don’t want children? Why is it so wrong that I don’t want to commit myself to a life where I’m sleep-deprived due to a crying infant needing to be fed at all hours of the night, having to change dirty diapers all the time, being interrupted from doing basic everyday things, not having time to myself, not being able to go to the store without making it a three hour affair just to get out of the house because you’re struggling with your child, not being able to pursue my own hobbies and interests, etc.? How is it abnormal that I don’t want to put myself through any of that?

 

[jlc2k2]

Confession - I still am not a fan of other people’s kids and I’m not good with kids in general. But I’m good enough with my own kids and that’s what counts.

 

[jlc2k2]

I think you have a very skewed view of family life and motherhood. There are phases that may be as you describe but they are a small part of the grand scheme of life/motherhood. Do you have any families with kids that you spend time with regularly?

 

[Diamond93]

Imagine you have found the one and it is everything you ever hoped, you are just doused in seratonin eveytime you look at the man God intended for you. Do you not love him enough to want to see him as a father?

Again, men have no right to tell a woman to get pregnant for them or to try to make them feel guilty if that’s not what they want. They’re not the ones who are forced to put their bodies through such trauma, so I really don’t see how it’s fair at all for a man, who will never understand the pains and trials of pregnancy, to be dictating to a woman that she should put herself through all that for them. They’re not the ones who suffer, and they have no right therefore to push that onto me.

 

[jlc2k2]

I’ve always desired marriage, however, which is how I know that I’m meant to get married. I know that I would make an excellent wife, since the requirements for what makes a good wife are different than that of being a good mother.

I wanted to go back to this. Both motherhood and marriage at their core require sacrifice ants dying to one’s self. At their root, they aren’t that different as it’s no longer just about you and your desires. There is another person’s life and passions tightly entwined with yours.

 

[1ke]

OK, wow, I am blown away by your judgmentalism. Why is my desire to not have children so abnormal that I need to see a therapist?

Yes. The type of “aversion” you describe coupled with your idealized and unrealistic notion of marriage points to something underlying the whole package that could benefit from talking with a counselor or therapist.

Why is it so wrong that I don’t want children? Why is it so wrong that I don’t want to commit myself to a life where I’m sleep-deprived due to a crying infant needing to be fed at all hours of the night, having to change dirty diapers all the time, being interrupted from doing basic everyday things, not having time to myself, not being able to go to the store without making it a three hour affair just to get out of the house because you’re struggling with your child, not being able to pursue my own hobbies and interests, etc.?

This is an extreme level of selfishness and skewed view of family life that there is something underlying it.

This is also a huge red flag that supports the position that whatever this is also drives your idealized version of romance and marriage. You will be very unpleasantly surprised to learn that marriage is a lot like what you’ve described.

 

[Diamond93]

Hey OP, I’m curious: What traits do you possess that you think will make you an excellent wife?

I’m kind-hearted, I’m sincere, I’m loyal, and I’m very good at emphasizing with other people’s feelings, especially when they’re hurting. I always do extra kind deeds for people where I can as well, ie. doing extra chores around the house, taking on extra duties where I can, etc. I’m also very encouraging towards others when they’re feeling down.

And after reading books on how men think, I know how to interact with men very well and they respond well to me for that reason. Honestly, the book by Shaunti Feldman, “For Women Only,” changed my life and how I interact with men. And it’s made all the difference between me understanding and appreciating men and not.

 

[Psalm30]

OK, wow, I am blown away by your judgmentalism.

A big sign of immaturity is to defensively reject constructive advice from a wise, experienced person as “judgmentalism.”

 

[jlc2k2]

On the flip side, a woman does not have the right to unilaterally decide that the man she married will not get to experience fatherhood. Family planning is a joint decision. Once you marry, you are no longer just your own person.

 

[Psalm30]

Again, men have no right to tell a woman to get pregnant for them or to try to make them feel guilty if that’s not what they want. They’re not the ones who are forced to put their bodies through such trauma, so I really don’t see how it’s fair at all for a man, who will never understand the pains and trials of pregnancy, to be dictating to a woman that she should put herself through all that for them. They’re not the ones who suffer, and they have no right therefore to push that onto me.

Drama much? I have yet to meet a man who “dictates” or “pushes onto his wife” that she must “bear him a son.” Most men I meet simply want to be fathers. And so they look to marry women who want to be mothers. There’s no reason to be so offended by that.

 

[Diamond93]

Diamond93:

Again, men have no right to tell a woman to get pregnant for them or to try to make them feel guilty if that’s not what they want. They’re not the ones who are forced to put their bodies through such trauma, so I really don’t see how it’s fair at all for a man, who will never understand the pains and trials of pregnancy, to be dictating to a woman that she should put herself through all that for them. They’re not the ones who suffer, and they have no right therefore to push that onto me.

Drama much? I have yet to meet a man who “dictates” or “pushes onto his wife” that she must “bear him a son.” Most men I meet simply want to be fathers. And so they look to marry women who want to be mothers. There’s no reason to be so offended by that.

But again, it’s unfair that they want something that puts a woman through so much and causes her to suffer immensely. They’re not the ones going through it, so they shouldn’t expect all women to just comply with it no problem.

 

[jlc2k2]

So he can’t dictate your life but you can dictate his? That’s not how marriage works.

 

[1ke]

Again, men have no right to tell a woman to get pregnant for them or to try to make them feel guilty if that’s not what they want.

Men in general, no.

Your husband absolutely does have the right to children.

I really don’t see how it’s fair at all for a man, who will never understand the pains and trials of pregnancy, to be dictating to a woman that she should put herself through all that for them

You freely exchange that right in marriage. If yo cannot give this consent, you cannot marry.

 

[Psalm30]

On the flip side, a woman does not have the right to unilaterally decide that the man she married will not get to experience fatherhood. Family planning is a joint decision. Once you marry, you are no longer just your own person.

Yes, it goes both ways. You say you have qualities that will make you an excellent wife. But this unwavering stance you have on not having children is not going to fare well in a marriage.

Suppose you marry someone who at the time you get married doesn’t want children. Then as the years go by, he changes his mind, and you’re not willing to budge. Then what?

You talk about the fact that the woman should get to have the ultimate say in whether or not a couple has a child because she’s the one who has to be pregnant and give birth. How would you feel about a husband who is the sole provider for his family having sole stewardship over the family finances, giving his wife absolutely no say in how the money is spent?

 

[1ke]

it’s unfair that they want something that puts a woman through so much and causes her to suffer immensely.

Pregnancy is a natural state. Parenthood is a natural desire.

There is nothing unfair or unnatural about it. It is actually the opposite that is outside the range of normal.

That is why you must not have an intention agaisnt children to marry. Children are the natural result of marital relations, which you exchange exclusive and perpetual right to with your husband.

 

[DisorientingSneeze]

Again, men have no right to tell a woman to get pregnant for them or to try to make them feel guilty if that’s not what they want. They’re not the ones who are forced to put their bodies through such trauma, so I really don’t see how it’s fair at all for a man, who will never understand the pains and trials of pregnancy, to be dictating to a woman that she should put herself through all that for them. They’re not the ones who suffer, and they have no right therefore to push that onto me.

It’s kind of interesting that’s what you read into my post. I didnt even say if he asked you to, I said that looking at this man you love you could love him so much that YOU want to see him as a father.

All unpleasantness aside, in marriage the love between you is such a powerful force it can actually create other human beings!(with Gods help). It sort of blows the mind. If you are called to marriage, some day you will want to participate in that life-generating love. And there is no guarantee you can. The cross of infertility weighs heavily on many.

 

[Psalm30]

But again, it’s unfair that they want something that puts a woman through so much and causes her to suffer immensely. They’re not the ones going through it, so they shouldn’t expect all women to just comply with it no problem.

How exactly do you know that pregnancy and childbirth automatically cause a woman to suffer immensely if you have never been pregnant or given birth?

I’ve been through it twice. I’d say it was uncomfortable, and it made me feel like I had a stomach bug 24/7. But in my book, that’s not “immense suffering.” Yes, some have it worse than others. But some also have it easier than others. Epidurals are a marvelous thing. I felt I bounced back very quickly from both my births. About two hours after the first one, I was up walking around taking pictures of the baby. I don’t think the nurse was very happy with me. I also went back to my pre pregnancy weight almost immediately, no one could believe I had just had a baby.

Like I said, not the case for everyone, but it certainly is for some people, including myself and many people I know.