# Was Jesus deliberately ambiguous? #

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evangelical_ed said:
**Romans 4:4-5.

Now when a man works, his wages are not credited to him as a gift, but as an obligation. However, to the man who does not work but trusts God who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness. **

Do I get any bonus points for that one?
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No. Let’s just stick to the questions. Chuck, get ready. Joe, you’re welcome to join in, too!
 
Question 2:

What book, chapter and verse to Evangelicals commonly use to show one should not pray to Mary, or to any of the saints?
 
Piece of cake.

**1 Timothy 2:5.

For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.**

Count 'em: One. One mediator. And his name ain’t Mary!

:cool:
 
Randy Carson seems to think this is a more accurate representaiton of the truth though:

**"Praying for the Dead Proved from Scripture

**2 Timothy 1:16-18 (RSV)
May the Lord grant mercy to the household of Onesiph’orus, for he often refreshed me; he was not ashamed of my chains, [17] but when he arrived in Rome he searched for me eagerly and found me – [18] may the Lord grant him to find mercy from the Lord on that Day – and you well know all the service he rendered at Ephesus.

2 Timothy 4:19
Greet Prisca and Aq’uila, and the household of Onesiph’orus.

Onesiphorus was dead, and Paul prayed “May the Lord grant him to find mercy on that day.”

If Paul can pray for the dead, so can we. "
 
Socrates4Jesus said:
You can give me that answer, Chuck, during the commercial break.
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Commercial, shamershal! His wife just sent him to Wendy’s. Hey, Soc. Get a double bacon burger for me. After all, with me as your sock puppet, you’re eating for 2 now!

😃
 
clmowry said:
Ding

How about these?

Deut. 18:9,11; 26:13-14
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mumbles something about it being unfair to expect a Catholic to compete with an Evangelical at bible BINGO

Deut: 18:9-11 “When you come into the land which the LORD, your God, is giving you, you shall not learn to imitate the abominations of the peoples there. 10 1 Let there not be found among you anyone who immolates his son or daughter in the fire, nor a fortune-teller, soothsayer, charmer, diviner, 11 or caster of spells, nor one who consults ghosts and spirits or seeks oracles from the dead.”

Deut: 26:13-14 “you shall declare before the LORD, your God, 'I have purged my house of the sacred portion and I have given it to the Levite, the alien, the orphan and the widow, just as you have commanded me. In this I have not broken or forgotten any of your commandments: 14 I have not eaten any of the tithe as a mourner; I have not brought any of it out as one unclean; I have not offered any of it to the dead. I have thus hearkened to the voice of the LORD, my God, doing just as you have commanded me.”

Neither of which actually preclude prayer to the dead, but it’s the best I’ve got. 😃

Chuck
 
clmowry said:
mumbles something about it being unfair to expect a Catholic to compete with an Evangelical at bible BINGO

Deut: 18:9-11 “When you come into the land which the LORD, your God, is giving you, you shall not learn to imitate the abominations of the peoples there. 10 1 Let there not be found among you anyone who immolates his son or daughter in the fire, nor a fortune-teller, soothsayer, charmer, diviner, 11 or caster of spells, nor one who consults ghosts and spirits or seeks oracles from the dead.”

Deut: 26:13-14 “you shall declare before the LORD, your God, 'I have purged my house of the sacred portion and I have given it to the Levite, the alien, the orphan and the widow, just as you have commanded me. In this I have not broken or forgotten any of your commandments: 14 I have not eaten any of the tithe as a mourner; I have not brought any of it out as one unclean; I have not offered any of it to the dead. I have thus hearkened to the voice of the LORD, my God, doing just as you have commanded me.”

Neither of which actually preclude prayer to the dead, but it’s the best I’ve got. 😃

Chuck
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Hmmm. I thought Catholics have lots of experience playing bingo!

😛
 
clmowry said:
mumbles something about it being unfair to expect a Catholic to compete with an Evangelical at bible BINGO

Deut: 18:9-11 “When you come into the land which the LORD, your God, is giving you, you shall not learn to imitate the abominations of the peoples there. 10 1 Let there not be found among you anyone who immolates his son or daughter in the fire, nor a fortune-teller, soothsayer, charmer, diviner, 11 or caster of spells, nor one who consults ghosts and spirits or seeks oracles from the dead.”

Deut: 26:13-14 “you shall declare before the LORD, your God, 'I have purged my house of the sacred portion and I have given it to the Levite, the alien, the orphan and the widow, just as you have commanded me. In this I have not broken or forgotten any of your commandments: 14 I have not eaten any of the tithe as a mourner; I have not brought any of it out as one unclean; I have not offered any of it to the dead. I have thus hearkened to the voice of the LORD, my God, doing just as you have commanded me.”

Neither of which actually preclude prayer to the dead, but it’s the best I’ve got. 😃

Chuck
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No, i’m sorry, Chuck. That’s not the answer Evangelicals give for not praying to the dead. Looks like Ed has 20 points. But there are plenty of questions still on the board!
 
Yeah, I’ll be ready in a minute. Can’t a guy take a break to eat?
 
clmowry said:
Randy Carson seems to think this is a more accurate representaiton of the truth though:

**"Praying for the Dead Proved from Scripture

**2 Timothy 1:16-18 (RSV)
May the Lord grant mercy to the household of Onesiph’orus, for he often refreshed me; he was not ashamed of my chains, [17] but when he arrived in Rome he searched for me eagerly and found me – [18] may the Lord grant him to find mercy from the Lord on that Day – and you well know all the service he rendered at Ephesus.

2 Timothy 4:19
Greet Prisca and Aq’uila, and the household of Onesiph’orus.

Onesiphorus was dead, and Paul prayed “May the Lord grant him to find mercy on that day.”

If Paul can pray for the dead, so can we. "
Click to expand...
Excellent answer, Chuck!
👍
 
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