Was Pope JP II a mystic?

[redrosetea]

Muslims believe in the Torah which is also the first 5 books of the Bible

Muslims are also the children of Abraham…It is not up to us to decide how God reveals himself to others

Muslims ,Christians a,nd Jews are all called people of the book

I doubt you are going to find may allies on this thread

 

[louey]

Muslims believe in the Torah which is also the first 5 books of the Bible

Muslims are also the children of Abraham…It is not up to us to decide how God reveals himself to others

Muslims ,Christians a,nd Jews are all called people of the book

I doubt you are going to find may allies on this thread

Muslim’s are NOT children of Abraham, nor are the unbelieving Jew’s. What does Jesus say about those who do not believe in Him…He who denies the Son does not have the Father.” (1Jn. 2:22-23)
For as many as are of the works of the Law [Old Covenant and its Rituals], are under a curse.” (Gal. 3:10) “He that believeth in the Son hath life everlasting: but he that believeth not the Son shall not see life: but the wrath of God abideth on him.” (Jn. 3:36) Christ-denying Jews are unfaithful apostates and under the wrath of God.

“Neither me do you know, nor my Father. If you did know me, perhaps you would know my Father also.” (Jn. 8:19) Jesus clearly teaches that no one can believe in and worship the Father unless he first believes in and worships the Son. “Jesus saith to him: I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No man cometh to the Father, but by me.” (Jn. 14:6) St. John echoing this sublime truth teaches the unbelieving Jews are liars and God is not their Father. “Who is the liar, but he who denieth that Jesus is the Christ, this is antichrist, who denieth the Father and the Son. He who denies the Son does not have the father.” (1Jn. 2:22-23) This does not just apply to the unbelieving Jews, but to all men who do not believe Jesus Christ is God.

 

[DonaNobis_Pacem]

I grew up during his pontificate, and I loved him as my spiritual father. I was crushed when I learned of his death. To say that I am wrong for calling him good and holy, when you believe he is evil, you are essentially crushing my hope to see him join the company of saints in Heaven. It seems that you would rather pray for him to be in Hell; you wish that God has condemned him to everlasting fire, rather than give John Paul II a share in the eternal banquet of Heaven.

No person can claim to be a faithful Catholic and yet commit the sin against the Holy Spirit, which is believing that you can influence God to withold His mercy towards anyone, living or deceased. That is the unforgivable sin of which Jesus spoke.

Condemn me all you want, but I will say all the louder:

IOANNES PAULUS II, ORA PRO NOBIS!

 

[redrosetea]

You can’t take one scripture and apply it to anything …You must take the Bible as a whole and what the entire scripture tells us

I don’t believe you, and I am sorry that you are allowing vindictiveness toward others, rule your life, instead of the peace of Christ and the love of neighbor

 

[louey]

I grew up during his pontificate, and I loved him as my spiritual father. I was crushed when I learned of his death. To say that I am wrong for calling him good and holy, when you believe he is evil, you are essentially crushing my hope to see him join the company of saints in Heaven. It seems that you would rather pray for him to be in Hell; you wish that God has condemned him to everlasting fire, rather than give John Paul II a share in the eternal banquet of Heaven.

No person can claim to be a faithful Catholic and yet commit the sin against the Holy Spirit, which is believing that you can influence God to withold His mercy towards anyone, living or deceased. That is the unforgivable sin of which Jesus spoke.

Condemn me all you want, but I will say all the louder:

IOANNES PAULUS II, ORA PRO NOBIS!

I do not condemn you, you have already condemned yourself if you believe one can pray with false religions, respect false religions, and deny the faith, the Catholic faith. There is hope for you as long as you live, that you will come to the one true faith, the Catholic faith.

 

[louey]

You can’t take one scripture and apply it to anything …You must take the Bible as a whole and what the entire scripture tells us

I don’t believe you, and I am sorry that you are allowing vindictiveness toward others, rule your life, instead of the peace of Christ and the love of neighbor

What does the entire scripture tell us?? You do not seem to know. What is the first commandment? I am sorry that you do not love the Truth when it is presented to you.

 

[DonaNobis_Pacem]

FYI, I am a member of the one true Faith. I am not ashamed of my Baptism into Christ’s Mystical Body. But I am deeply horrified that you have pronounced judgment on me in that manner.

I sincerely pray that God will be merciful to you and show you kindness. I do not wish that any person be condemned. No Catholic should wish condemnation on anyone.

 

[redrosetea]

Dona nobis I am ignoring him I looked at his postings and will avoid the near occasion of sin by responding to him again

There is scripture about Charity that fits this situation…I intendt to heed it

 

[blacktiger057]

John Paul II is my favorite pope. He has been a wonderful advocate for peace among all religions and was able to see goodness in all people of religion.

 

[louey]

FYI, I am a member of the one true Faith. I am not ashamed of my Baptism into Christ’s Mystical Body. But I am deeply horrified that you have pronounced judgment on me in that manner.

I sincerely pray that God will be merciful to you and show you kindness. I do not wish that any person be condemned. No Catholic should wish condemnation on anyone.

Why do you keep insisting that I condemn you? It is not I; it is yourself. I do not wish anyone condemned either, but to say evil is good is a sin. Why not address the why, instead of the emotional response you keep espousing? Look at the truth for what it is.

 

[louey]

Dona nobis I am ignoring him I looked at his postings and will avoid the near occasion of sin by responding to him again

There is scripture about Charity that fits this situation…I intendt to heed it

Yes, Redrosetea, Charity is the FIRST commandment of God. To love him first, and then neighbor. You have put your neighbor before God. To truly love your neighbor, one must love God first; with your whole heart, soul, mind and body. Then can you only love your neighbor. If you love your neighbor you do NOT let them just “fall into pit” without warning them. You tell them the truth. You love his soul and pray and fast for his conversion to the one true faith; the CAtholic Faith. That is true Charity.

 

[wcknight]

louey, you forget that Jesus and all His followers where Jews. St. Paul tells us that you need not be actually physically baptized to be considered among Christ’s followers, you only need to do the will of His Father. John Paul recognized that there are many Jews and many folks in other faiths who are also doing the will of the Father.

I think you insult the memory of John Paul by calling him evil. Clearly you are in the very small minority. The vast majority of Catholics and non-Catholics believe he was a great saint, including his successor, Pope Benedict.

To call someone evil who is really good is just as awful as to call someone good who is really evil.

Doesn’t Jesus tell us to love our enemies and do good to those that hate us. That is what John Paul advocated. Sounds like you would like everyone to return the old law of,an eye for an eye. “An eye for an eye” only leads to the whole world becoming blind !

Peace is what Jesus stood for, Peace is what John Paul promoted, sounds pretty consistent to me.

 

[tessi]

John Paul II said that many people do not love Jesus because they don’t know him. That was what JPII was trying to do. Show the face of Christ to people who didn’t know Him. You cannot throw the Truth on the face of a child, you do not talk of adult stuff to a child. Like God began with the Jews with lambs and “milk” because they were not ready to eat solid food, JPII gave “milk” to those who were not ready to understand the whole Truth.

 

[wcknight]

BTW it has been a regular practice for the Knights of Columbus to donate $5 million to the pope each year to give to various charities of his choosing.

 

[Jeanette_L]

Muslim’s are NOT children of Abraham, nor are the unbelieving Jew’s. What does Jesus say about those who do not believe in Him…He who denies the Son does not have the Father.” (1Jn. 2:22-23)
For as many as are of the works of the Law [Old Covenant and its Rituals], are under a curse.” (Gal. 3:10) “He that believeth in the Son hath life everlasting: but he that believeth not the Son shall not see life: but the wrath of God abideth on him.” (Jn. 3:36) Christ-denying Jews are unfaithful apostates and under the wrath of God.

“Neither me do you know, nor my Father. If you did know me, perhaps you would know my Father also.” (Jn. 8:19) Jesus clearly teaches that no one can believe in and worship the Father unless he first believes in and worships the Son. “Jesus saith to him: I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No man cometh to the Father, but by me.” (Jn. 14:6) St. John echoing this sublime truth teaches the unbelieving Jews are liars and God is not their Father. “Who is the liar, but he who denieth that Jesus is the Christ, this is antichrist, who denieth the Father and the Son. He who denies the Son does not have the father.” (1Jn. 2:22-23) This does not just apply to the unbelieving Jews, but to all men who do not believe Jesus Christ is God.

I do not condemn you, you have already condemned yourself if you believe one can pray with false religions, respect false religions, and deny the faith, the Catholic faith. There is hope for you as long as you live, that you will come to the one true faith, the Catholic faith.

What does the entire scripture tell us?? You do not seem to know. What is the first commandment? I am sorry that you do not love the Truth when it is presented to you.

Why do you keep insisting that I condemn you? It is not I; it is yourself. I do not wish anyone condemned either, but to say evil is good is a sin. Why not address the why, instead of the emotional response you keep espousing? Look at the truth for what it is.

Yes, Redrosetea, Charity is the FIRST commandment of God. To love him first, and then neighbor. You have put your neighbor before God. To truly love your neighbor, one must love God first; with your whole heart, soul, mind and body. Then can you only love your neighbor. If you love your neighbor you do NOT let them just “fall into pit” without warning them. You tell them the truth. You love his soul and pray and fast for his conversion to the one true faith; the CAtholic Faith. That is true Charity.

I’m thinking that you may not even be Catholic, you sound very much like a Fundamentalist.

Of course there are Fundamentalist Protestants, Fundamentalist Muslims and I’m discovering Fundamentalist Catholics as well; the threads they all share in their very dark clothes are paranoia and hatred and a hyper sense of judgement, they being the true discerners of such judgements.

I truly hope you haven’t crossed over into that my friend, it’s hard to pull yourself back out of that mire.

 

[louey]

louey, you forget that Jesus and all His followers where Jews. St. Paul tells us that you need not be actually physically baptized to be considered among Christ’s followers, you only need to do the will of His Father. John Paul recognized that there are many Jews and many folks in other faiths who are also doing the will of the Father.

I think you insult the memory of John Paul by calling him evil. Clearly you are in the very small minority. The vast majority of Catholics and non-Catholics believe he was a great saint, including his successor, Pope Benedict.

To call someone evil who is really good is just as awful as to call someone good who is really evil.

Doesn’t Jesus tell us to love our enemies and do good to those that hate us. That is what John Paul advocated. Sounds like you would like everyone to return the old law of,an eye for an eye. “An eye for an eye” only leads to the whole world becoming blind !

Peace is what Jesus stood for, Peace is what John Paul promoted, sounds pretty consistent to me.

WCKnight, yes Jesus follower’s were the Jew’s who believed in Him. Peter was a faithful Jew, as well as all the other apostles and faithful follower’s of Christ. Peter was also the first Pope of the Catholic Church. The Old Covenant ended with the death of Christ on the cross. A Talmudic Jew will not be saved. One must hold the Catholic Faith, whole and inviolate, persevere in the faith an die in sanctifying grace, which is only found in the Catholic Church. The MAJORITY of Jew’s were not faithful, they rejected Christ. Christ tells them who their father is…41 You do the works of your father. They said therefore to him: We are not born of fornication: we have one Father, even God. 42 Jesus therefore said to them: If God were your Father, you would indeed love me. For from God I proceeded, and came; for I came not of myself, but he sent me: 43 Why do you not know my speech? Because you cannot hear my word. 44 You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and he stood not in the truth; because truth is not in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father thereof. 45 But if I say the truth, you believe me not. (John 8:41-45)

Yes, Jesus tells us to love our enemies. How do you love your enemy? By false charity? By respecting and praying with their false gods? By loving them out of “respect” more than you love God? JPII was an ANTI-CHRIST; he loved the world, not God. " Do not think that I came to send peace upon earth: I came not to send peace, but the sword." (Matt. 10:34

Where does St. Paul state a man does not need to be baptised to be a follower of Christ?

 

[louey]

louey, you forget that Jesus and all His followers where Jews. St. Paul tells us that you need not be actually physically baptized to be considered among Christ’s followers, you only need to do the will of His Father. John Paul recognized that there are many Jews and many folks in other faiths who are also doing the will of the Father.

I think you insult the memory of John Paul by calling him evil. Clearly you are in the very small minority. The vast majority of Catholics and non-Catholics believe he was a great saint, including his successor, Pope Benedict.

To call someone evil who is really good is just as awful as to call someone good who is really evil.

Doesn’t Jesus tell us to love our enemies and do good to those that hate us. That is what John Paul advocated. Sounds like you would like everyone to return the old law of,an eye for an eye. “An eye for an eye” only leads to the whole world becoming blind !

Peace is what Jesus stood for, Peace is what John Paul promoted, sounds pretty consistent to me.

I’m thinking that you may not even be Catholic, you sound very much like a Fundamentalist.

Of course there are Fundamentalist Protestants, Fundamentalist Muslims and I’m discovering Fundamentalist Catholics as well; the threads they all share in their very dark clothes are paranoia and hatred and a hyper sense of judgement, they being the true discerners of such judgements.

I truly hope you haven’t crossed over into that my friend, it’s hard to pull yourself back out of that mire.

What exactly does a “fundamentalist” sound like? In any case, what do think one should “sound” like? Have you been in a mire? What kind of mire is hard to pull yourself out of?

 

[Jeanette_L]

What exactly does a “fundamentalist” sound like? In any case, what do think one should “sound” like? Have you been in a mire? What kind of mire is hard to pull yourself out of?

A fundamentalist speaks very much like what you are speaking. That was my point.

What should one sound like, if not like you? One should sound like Christ, who drew all sinners to himself through compassion and mercy, not repelling them with words of harshness and judgment. That tone was saved exclusively for self righteous people who were quick to judge and condemn those that Christ came to save. In those days they were represented by the Pharisees. These days they are everywhere, you can find people casting judgment upon one another in all sectors of Christianity, Islam, Judaism… same error, different time and place.

That predicament my friend, is the mire that one should not find oneself in.

 

[louey]

A fundamentalist speaks very much like what you are speaking. That was my point.

What should one sound like, if not like you? One should sound like Christ, who drew all sinners to himself through compassion and mercy, not repelling them with words of harshness and judgment. That tone was saved exclusively for self righteous people who were quick to judge and condemn those that Christ came to save. In those days they were represented by the Pharisees. These days they are everywhere, you can find people casting judgment upon one another in all sectors of Christianity, Islam, Judaism… same error, different time and place.

That predicament my friend, is the mire that one should not find oneself in.

What word’s did I use that are “of harshness and judgement”? If you read my post’s 75% is the word’s of the Catholic Church, not my word’s. I am a Roman Catholic. Do you reject the dogma’s, infallible truths of the Catholic Church? If you do, then you also reject Jesus, for it is His doctrine a Catholic believe’s. "If the world hate you, know ye, that it hath hated me before you. 19 If you had been of the world, the world would love its own: but because you are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you. 20 Remember my word that I said to you: The servant is not greater than his master. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you: if they have kept my word, they will keep yours also.

21 But all these things they will do to you for my name’s sake: because they know not him who sent me." (John 15: 18-21)

 

[redrosetea]

This thread is being hijacked by bigotry…Please let us get back on topic everyone

Do you think JPII was a mystic?