We are rational because of our brains, not our souls

[Sacred_Heart_1]

Rationality is the quality or state of being reasonable, based on facts or reason. This requires knowledge. Knowledge is structured information and information requires form. Form occupies space. Hence those are our brains which produce reason since soul doesn’t occupy any space.

Our souls manifest through our reason. Who I am is not because of reason, but who I truly am is because of my soul.

You’re right our minds and our souls are not the same thing, however, the animating force–the spirit of our souls come to occupy our bodies. They become inseparable through knowledge.

An example of this is wisdom. Wisdom is the knowledge that a person attains through experience about good and evil. This knowledge comes directly from the soul. Its rationalized through reason, however, you are not recognizing this knowledge. Our soul is in communion with our body. Knowledge of the soul is poured into our minds through this communion directing ourselves about who we truly are. We may or may not see this. But evidence of my soul is in my reason and any knowledge transmitted from my soul is rationalized by my mind. It gives me a glimpse into who I truly am.

If you say that knowledge cannot be transmitted from your soul into your mind then you probably don’t have a clue of who you really are. If you know yourself then you will be known. If you don’t know yourself then you exist in a poverty and you are that poverty.

 

[Bahman]

Our souls manifest through our reason. Who I am is not because of reason, but who I truly am is because of my soul.

You’re right our minds and our souls are not the same thing, however, the animating force–the spirit of our souls come to occupy our bodies. They become inseparable through knowledge.

To me mind, what you call soul, is the essence of any being the ability to experience and create. Mind being as spiritual can be present everywhere but it is bounded to what we call body in human being for example. We can experience what our bodies provide to us including knowledge So knowledge exist in our body as it was described in OP.

An example of this is wisdom. Wisdom is the knowledge that a person attains through experience about good and evil. This knowledge comes directly from the soul. Its rationalized through reason, however, you are not recognizing this knowledge. Our soul is in communion with our body. Knowledge of the soul is poured into our minds through this communion directing ourselves about who we truly are. We may or may not see this. But evidence of my soul is in my reason and any knowledge transmitted from my soul is rationalized by my mind. It gives me a glimpse into who I truly am.

As it was mention, mind can only experience and create. Mind only has these attribute, so all other attribute of any being are granted by body.

If you say that knowledge cannot be transmitted from your soul into your mind then you probably don’t have a clue of who you really are. If you know yourself then you will be known. If you don’t know yourself then you exist in a poverty and you are that poverty.

Mind to me is what you call soul. We in addition have body and knowledge as it was illustrated can only reside in body and can be transmitted to our mind.

 

[Vico]

I believe that we are in state of vegetation in early stage our lives. We later become gradually conscious of our environment in later state of our lives. I have no idea when and how this transformation happen?

St. Thomas Aquinas system is that living things require some principle over and above the material constituents in order to explain their existence and behavior. (This cannot be proved or disproved.)

The body itself lives by the soul with vegetative soul operations, such as for a plant (nutrition, growth, generation, etc.) are intrinsically dependent upon matter.
The operations of animals, i.e., knowledge and appetite, are irreducible to those of vegetative life forms so these are called the sensitive soul, which depends upon the body for all its operations.

Both of these cease when the organic body is of an animal is corrupted. The human has a rational soul in addition, which does not cease when the organic body of the human is corrupted. The rational soul has knowledge (intellect) and rational appetite (will).

 

[Bahman]

St. Thomas Aquinas system is that living things require some principle over and above the material constituents in order to explain their existence and behavior. (This cannot be proved or disproved.)

There is need for any proof since by fact we know that beings exist and behave. We also know by fact that matter does not behave. Hence the root of difference is mind, what you call it soul.

The body itself lives by the soul with vegetative soul operations, such as for a plant (nutrition, growth, generation, etc.) are intrinsically dependent upon matter.
The operations of animals, i.e., knowledge and appetite, are irreducible to those of vegetative life forms so these are called the sensitive soul, which depends upon the body for all its operations.

Both of these cease when the organic body is of an animal is corrupted. The human has a rational soul in addition, which does not cease when the organic body of the human is corrupted. The rational soul has knowledge (intellect) and rational appetite (will).

I think we, plants, animal and human share the same soul. The difference is however arises from the fact that plant does not have brain and nerve system. Animal and human have brain and nerve system. The difference however arises from complexity of brain.

 

[Vico]

There is need for any proof since by fact we know that beings exist and behave. We also know by fact that matter does not behave. Hence the root of difference is mind, what you call it soul.

I think we, plants, animal and human share the same soul. The difference is however arises from the fact that plant does not have brain and nerve system. Animal and human have brain and nerve system. The difference however arises from complexity of brain.

Science assumes that life is based upon the material.

So the difference between your belief and the Christian, is that the rational soul in Christianity is immortal and spiritual, which is different than sensitive and vegetative souls which are not.

 

[Bahman]

Science assumes that life is based upon the material.

Materialism claims that any state of affair is the result of previous state of affair following the laws of nature. They claim that mind is emergent. This however leads to epiphenomenalsim in which mind is a useless thing.

So the difference between your belief and the Christian, is that the rational soul in Christianity is immortal and spiritual, which is different than sensitive and vegetative souls which are not.

There is another difference between my view and your view. The mind has only three abilities namely to, experience, decide and act. We are rational being because we have a complex brain.

 

[Brendan]

That is the duties of our Brain not rational soul.

How so?

An electric current is either random or deterministic. It’s course is either unknown, or follows along a pre-known path. It would follow paths dictated by known physical laws, such as Ohm’s Law

Neither one allows for Rational though.

Either the flow of electrons will be random, in which case every ‘though’ would be a random jumble, or, like a computer chip, it is known ahead of time what the output will be for any given (name removed by moderator)ut, That would allow for a plant type response to stimuli, but not Reason.

So what is the underlying physics principle that allows for Rational though.

 

[Bahman]

An electric current is either random or deterministic. It’s course is either unknown, or follows along a pre-known path. It would follow paths dictated by known physical laws, such as Ohm’s Law.

Electrical current is deterministic.

Neither one allows for Rational though.

Thought is the process of information. Thought however has form. This allows us to experience them by soul. The fact that we can experience thought does not tell us that it is an attribute of soul.

Either the flow of electrons will be random, in which case every ‘though’ would be a random jumble, or, like a computer chip, it is known ahead of time what the output will be for any given (name removed by moderator)ut,

Thought simply is physical and it occurs inside your brain. Have a couple of drink to see how your thought could be disrupted. Drink is chemical and can only affect your brain hence thought is physical.

So what is the underlying physics principle that allows for Rational though.

Simply having a brain which is complex enough to allow rationality.

 

[Brendan]

Electrical current is deterministic.

Actually, it can be random as well, the electron is subject to quantum events. An electron can leap across resistive barriers, creating a random current.

Thought simply is physical and it occurs inside your brain. Have a couple of drink to see how your thought could be disrupted. Drink is chemical and can only affect your brain hence thought is physical.

No, what you have shown is the manifestation of thought can be affected by
physical effects.

Simply having a brain which is complex enough to allow rationality.

pre

If it is deterministic, there is no level of complexity that can achieve Rational thought. All thoughts would be determined as soon as the (name removed by moderator)ut was provided. All identical (name removed by moderator)ut would result in identical output. That is clearly not the case with Rational thought. If it was, there would be no disagreement

 

[Vico]

Materialism claims that any state of affair is the result of previous state of affair following the laws of nature. They claim that mind is emergent. This however leads to epiphenomenalsim in which mind is a useless thing.

There is another difference between my view and your view. The mind has only three abilities namely to, experience, decide and act. We are rational being because we have a complex brain.

Mechanistic materialism denies that immaterial (or apparent) immaterial things exist or are not motions of material things (so this includes minds). But there is also epiphenomenalism, where sensations and thoughts exist in addition to material processes but are dependent on material processes rather then causes of their own. Also there is hylozoism, all matter has vital characteristics, and panpsychism, all material constituents have mindlike character.

Intelligence and will are the primary attributes of the soul, per Christianity. There are other attributes of the soul that make it uniquely suited to the particular body making the person.