What are some of the main reasons that people are attracted to the Protestant faith?

[sailor28]

I concur. I believe such an agenda of simply telling Protestants and others over and over and over again how right oneself is, and just over and over posting pictures of people shaking their heads no to anything else, telling others their understanding of God is severely impoverished, can get old and actually result in the opposite of what the goal is. Assuming the goal is to bring them into the RCC. What’s the saying? You can attract more flies with honey than with vinegar? Or something to that effect. Anyways I thank you again Sailor for your serious and kind responses to the thread question.

It is true. We have to think carefully how we engage people. I thought the title of the thread was, “what are some of the reasons people are attracted to the protestant faith?” I’ve been a part of threads like this before where someone asks a question, then people answer honestly and it turns into an interrogation. I thought the point was to humbly and sincerely gather info from others to perhaps consider why 90% of evangelical churches are Catholics and why ex-Catholics are such a large group of people in this country. If we say, “they are all poorly catechized” then we don’t really need to think much about changing ourselves or other deeper issues within the church. The titanic is sinking and we insist on arranging the deck chairs the way we want them. That is the way I see it.

 

[sailor28]

Thanks Steve for your thoughts. As I said, the Eucharist is the source and summit of my faith. The Eucharist does trump everything for me. It is the reason I am still Catholic despite having major issues with many aspects of our faith. However, I need both communities and God is present in all of it. Other Christians have always been a deep part of my life and faith so it is natural for me to connect with them.

If we have such a great gift in the Eucharist then everything else should follow, but it does not. The Pope and authors of “Rebuilt” realized they had some things they could learn from our non-Catholic Christian brothers and sisters. I have not seen anyone here acknowledge that. That comes across as arrogant to me. (I am not saying you are arrogant. I am making a general statement)

The mass is a gift. My most sacred time is daily mass because I don’t need to listen to awful music during it and I can pray. At my current “home” parish there are over 100 kids in confirmation. The vast majority do not go to church. It will be the last generation, I believe. When they grow up and have kids they will not even go through the motions of Baptism, First Communion and Confirmation. We are losing our youth. The parish has no life giving liturgy. This is common. Yet it all looks good on paper. When an old lady sings hymns from the 1700’s and no one is singing it is a major problem. I understand some people are drawn to organ music and I respect that. However, organ music does not engage most people. Especially, poorly done organ music. Poor liturgy does destroy faith.

Please know I am not judging the music ministers. It is my desire that music be played that the congregation can sing to. Isn’t this a basis for the liturgy? That the congregation participate? The choir at the cathedral is clearly putting on a performance and it is grand. (Yet, we belittle the evangelicals for wanting to go and be entertained???) It is odd to me because not many in the congregation are actually singing. We can’t just say, well we have the Eucharist and therefore we can put up with lousy everything else.

Forgive my frustration, but I really don’t think people in the church who have control over these things are listening.

Sailor, I think you are quite correct in why many leave the Catholic Church. I am a music minister at my parish and so take the liturgy very seriously. I believe that it was St. Pope John Paul, II that said “Good liturgy builds faith… poor liturgy destroys faith…” (paraphrasing).

I got involved in the music ministry 24 years ago and we do everything from very contemporary music to Gregorian chant. I love both. I am in the process of moving to another state (unfortunately - I love Colorado). After spending a month there I have tried out three different parishes and have been completely disappointed in the music. We even tried the Newman Center at a large university hoping for something more than a little old lady at the piano. The Newman center was the worst of all. It was a little old lady at the piano who couldn’t carry a tune in a bucket (God bless her soul.)

The bottom line, however, is that it never occurred to me to go to a non-Catholic faith community. While poor music and even a poor homily are not a lot of help in building our faith, the fact that we have the Eucharist trumps everything. There simply is no non-Catholic faith community (EO excluded) that can even come close to the Mass and I don’t care how dynamic the preacher or how fantastic the music. There is no worship that compares to the Mass.

And please, do not judge the hearts of those music ministers that you judge as “performing”. I have been accused of this as well. What the congregation does not see is that our music group, before each and every Mass (I do three a weekend) specifically prays that God will empty us of ourselves so that we might truly be His instruments.

God bless.

 

[sailor28]

Really? What a disappointing suggestion, especially by you, EvangelCatholic. If asking someone to support their position is uncharitable then we’re all in trouble. :nope:

Steve, I made it clear in my posts why I came here and answered this question. I did not come hear to support “positions”. The title of this thread is, “what are some reasons that people are attracted to the protestant faith?” If people did not want to hear the answers then why did they bother to come here? They should make their own thread entitled, “Everyone who leaves the Catholic Church is poorly catechized:thumbsup::. What do you think we can do to change that”

If people engage people in real life like they do here, it is not going to be helpful.

 

[EvangelCatholic]

The negative dialogue here is quite evident in many threads. Some make strong arguments of why the other person isn’t correct about the Church; that is how they start off the discussion. There are several Lutherans on this forum who regularly proclaim that most Lutherans are not really Christians because of whatever reason they can cite.

We may talk about the Christian faith but applying it to others is a weakness on CAF. To emphasize how much we share in Christ is difficult for some posters who prefer to criticize and ostracize others.

The Devil laughs, ‘with Christians like these who needs enemies’.

 

[Sy_Noe]

So if you admit that you might be wrong, would you also admit that you might be wrong concerning properly catechized Catholics leaving the faith?

Sure I could be. Except for the fact I don’t see how Catholics come to believe they know they are so immensely certain of things without first having just faith and belief. Seems to me you would have to place just faith and belief in something. In something you accept just by faith and not by sight. Faith and a belief in God or the New Testament story of Christ or the RCC or the early fathers or you have to believe what you are being told in your proper catechism instruction. For instance I’ve even seen Protestants right here on CAF say they have read the ECFs too yet see things differently than you do. It just seems to me whether Catholic or Protestant a lot of faith and belief is involved. Jews don’t believe the NT story of Christ as Savior. Non believers don’t have faith in God.

So I don’t know why someone properly catechized could not come to believe differently or could not have a different faith than you do. Maybe people attracted to Protestantism lose faith in Roman Catholic teaching authority while you continue to have faith. Some Protestants will even say they believe the RCC or it’s human leaders strayed and Christ needs to reform His church along the way. You don’t but that’s what they believe.

 

[Peter_J]

Originally Posted by Peter J
I see it differently. If I may say, I think it ultimately comes down to supply and demand. If people stop frequenting a certain kind of blog or forum-post, then the “supply” is likely to dry up.

On the contrary, I hope you will not leave the forum. Granted I have not read what PRmerger said to you (heck, I haven’t read half or even close to half of the posts) but I do know that there are a great many of us Catholics who post on the internet. Would you form your opinion of *all *of us based on what someone said to you?

 

[Sy_Noe]

On the contrary, I hope you will not leave the forum. Granted I have not read what PRmerger said to you (heck, I haven’t read half or even close to half of the posts) but I do know that there are a great many of us Catholics who post on the internet. Would you form your opinion of *all *of us based on what someone said to you?

Thanks for clearing up what you meant for me. No. Thankfully I’ve not only encountered Catholics on the internet but practicing ones as well in my real life even in my own family, who come across differently than some do here. I’ve heard and seen Pope Francis on TV and he even seems to me to have a different tone at times. No he hasn’t changed teaching but his tone and how he comes across can seem different to me.

 

[Sy_Noe]

Thanks Steve for your thoughts. As I said, the Eucharist is the source and summit of my faith. The Eucharist does trump everything for me. It is the reason I am still Catholic despite having major issues with many aspects of our faith. However, I need both communities and God is present in all of it. Other Christians have always been a deep part of my life and faith so it is natural for me to connect with them.

If we have such a great gift in the Eucharist then everything else should follow, but it does not. The Pope and authors of “Rebuilt” realized they had some things they could learn from our non-Catholic Christian brothers and sisters. I have not seen anyone here acknowledge that. That comes across as arrogant to me. (I am not saying you are arrogant. I am making a general statement)

The mass is a gift. My most sacred time is daily mass because I don’t need to listen to awful music during it and I can pray. At my current “home” parish there are over 100 kids in confirmation. The vast majority do not go to church. It will be the last generation, I believe. When they grow up and have kids they will not even go through the motions of Baptism, First Communion and Confirmation. We are losing our youth. The parish has no life giving liturgy. This is common. Yet it all looks good on paper. When an old lady sings hymns from the 1700’s and no one is singing it is a major problem. I understand some people are drawn to organ music and I respect that. However, organ music does not engage most people. Especially, poorly done organ music. Poor liturgy does destroy faith.

Please know I am not judging the music ministers. It is my desire that music be played that the congregation can sing to. Isn’t this a basis for the liturgy? That the congregation participate? The choir at the cathedral is clearly putting on a performance and it is grand. (Yet, we belittle the evangelicals for wanting to go and be entertained???) It is odd to me because not many in the congregation are actually singing. We can’t just say, well we have the Eucharist and therefore we can put up with lousy everything else.

Forgive my frustration, but I really don’t think people in the church who have control over these things are listening.

I can understand why you need both communities. Your comments about people not singing reminded me of correspondence I had once with an Episcopal priest. When I asked about the music at her church, she said they try to sing what most everyone will sing to and that most do.

 

[Sy_Noe]

The negative dialogue here is quite evident in many threads. Some make strong arguments of why the other person isn’t correct about the Church; that is how they start off the discussion. There are several Lutherans on this forum who regularly proclaim that most Lutherans are not really Christians because of whatever reason they can cite.

We may talk about the Christian faith but applying it to others is a weakness on CAF. To emphasize how much we share in Christ is difficult for some posters who prefer to criticize and ostracize others.

The Devil laughs, ‘with Christians like these who needs enemies’.

I just want to say I am sorry for any negativity in this dialogue I may have caused. Christians share unity in the most important of all. In Christ Jesus as Savior. And I’ve read he can break down walls.

 

[steido01]

The negative dialogue here is quite evident in many threads. Some make strong arguments of why the other person isn’t correct about the Church; that is how they start off the discussion. There are several Lutherans on this forum who regularly proclaim that most Lutherans are not really Christians because of whatever reason they can cite.

We may talk about the Christian faith but applying it to others is a weakness on CAF. To emphasize how much we share in Christ is difficult for some posters who prefer to criticize and ostracize others.

The Devil laughs, ‘with Christians like these who needs enemies’.

I agree with you regarding the negativity in this thread. The bullying tactics used by some (ignoring difficult arguments, re-posting logical fallacies, unwillingness to admit correction, demeaning images, etc.) have ruined this thread. That’s why we can give the thread a rating. Enough people give it one star, the good Mods will act.

That said, where are those Lutherans? Let me at 'em! I, and others, may question whether some of those who call themselves Lutheran act like Lutherans (what else would you do if you believed your brother to be acting contrary to his stated beliefs?) but I can’t think of a single post where someone accused you of not being Christian. Feel free to PM me.

 

[Eric_Hilbert]

**The direction this thread is heading is precisely why I locked it from the beginning.
This is a debate forum, not an interrogation forum or a place post silly pictures designed to ridicule people, Clean it up or the infractions will start.
And ask any Catholic here, I am an equal opportunity infractor. **

 

[Irishgal49]

You appear here to even judge people whom you know nothing about. They and their parents had Catholic educations, among them were altar servers, EMHCs, lectors & ushers. A relatively few remain in practice but many others, with similar instruction and backgrounds, do not. So my hope is for you and others to someday learn just going around spouting off “poorly catechized” to those who disagree with you or who believe differently than you do, is not the answer to everything.

:sad_yes::clapping:

I like how this turned into a “let’s come up with a pat solution on why people would leave the Catholic faith for the Protestant faith” posting. Blame them for being stupid, uneducated and accuse them of not really loving Jesus or having a relationship with him.

I studied extensively, delved into a lot of books, reading the catechism, and even the canon law book. I have worked with many priests for hours and the conclusion is, I do NOT agree with the Catholic faith. I left because I do not believe it. You can write it off however you want but lots of people who disagree leave and that doesn’t make them ignorant or mean they have no relationship with Jesus. I may not have what someone else thinks is a relationship with Jesus but I feel like I’m being honest with myself instead of faking it. I’m totally Protestant but I haven’t been church shopping either. I am not currently attending anywhere.

The reasons people leave are as varied as they are and although you may disagree, you should do what we are told to do on a Catholic forum, be respectful.

 

[PRmerger]

Well this is my story. It is my opinion only and my experience. I was born and raised catholic, went to parochial school for eight years. Received all the appropriate sacraments and was even married there. After I got married I had a strong desire to know God so I started reading the bible and watching Christian TV. But I was not looking to Christian TV to learn from them but prove to myself how wrong they were in light of my Catholic faith. I had no desire to be anything other than catholic. However I kept finding them more in line with the scriptures and making more sense to me.

When I finally went to a Christian church the people were actually friendly and welcoming. They loved and genuinely cared for you. Praise and worship was personal and corporate all at the same time. People actually enjoyed being in the presence of the Lord for twice the amount of time as a catholic mass. The bible was actually explained to you.

I have never felt personally closer to God than now. My life has been totally changed and transformed. To me I wasn’t becoming anything other than a better Christian.

That’s too bad that you did not understand what you left, jericho.

You left the Eucharist. Talk about “being in the presence of the Lord”–how much more present could He be than Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity.

If you understood that, you wouldn’t have left.

 

[PRmerger]

Sure I could be. Except for the fact I don’t see how Catholics come to believe they know they are so immensely certain of things without first having just faith and belief. Seems to me you would have to place just faith and belief in something.

The Catholic way is Fides quarens intellectum.

In something you accept just by faith and not by sight

No. Never just by faith.

So I don’t know why someone properly catechized could not come to believe differently or could not have a different faith than you do.

They come to believe differently because they want a god who conforms to their own views.

They don’t want to change their own personal preferences, so they leave to find someone who preaches something that they agree with.

 

[PRmerger]

Blame them for being stupid, uneducated and accuse them of not really loving Jesus or having a relationship with him.

I guarantee you people are uneducated about the faith, Irishgal.

But no one has posited here that they are stupid, don’t love Jesus or don’t have a relationship with him.

 

[jericho777]

Thanks for sharing your faith journey, Jericho. I’m shocked though no one has questioned your catechism instruction or understanding or requested you write paragraphs explaining RCC teaching.

You’re welcome.

To tell you the truth the reason I’m here is to see the similarities and differences of my faith journey. How well was I catechized? I believed and did everything I was taught to do. I don’t know what else to say. There seems to be a belief that Catholics are not properly catechized. If that is so why doesn’t that change? Even priests don’t all believe the same thing. I used to work with a guy who was told by the priest to sleep with his wife before they got married to see if they were compatible! I know this is the extreme, but stuff of varying degrees goes on all the time.

 

[PRmerger]

You’re welcome.

To tell you the truth the reason I’m here is to see the similarities and differences of my faith journey. How well was I catechized? I believed and did everything I was taught to do.

That, my friend, is not at all the essence of catechesis.

Learning about the faith is NOT “doing everything I was taught to do”.

It is seeking understanding about the what, the why, the how.

But absolutely not “doing everything I was taught to do.”

I don’t know what else to say. There seems to be a belief that Catholics are not properly catechized. If that is so why doesn’t that change?

It absolutely is changing.

Even priests don’t all believe the same thing. I used to work with a guy who was told by the priest to sleep with his wife before they got married to see if they were compatible! I know this is the extreme, but stuff of varying degrees goes on all the time.

This poor guy should have been able to respond to his priest with some great quotes from Catholic sources. I sure hope he did!

But I’m guessing he didn’t. :sad_yes:

 

[jericho777]

That, my friend, is not at all the essence of catechesis.

Learning about the faith is NOT “doing everything I was taught to do”.

It is seeking understanding about the what, the why, the how.

But absolutely not “doing everything I was taught to do.”

It absolutely is changing.

This poor guy should have been able to respond to his priest with some great quotes from Catholic sources. I sure hope he did!

But I’m guessing he didn’t. :sad_yes:

That’s how we were taught. You did what you were told. No questions asked. Ask anyone who went to catholic school back in the day.

 

[PRmerger]

That’s how we were taught. You did what you were told. No questions asked. Ask anyone who went to catholic school back in the day.

Oh, I don’t doubt that. :sad_yes:

 

[dronald]

That’s too bad that you did not understand what you left, jericho.

You left the Eucharist. Talk about “being in the presence of the Lord”–how much more present could He be than Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity.

If you understood that, you wouldn’t have left.

Building on what he said and your response here; I can’t help but think of what the Apostles wrote on some of these disagreements. He found love, worship, and so much more in Christ.

Romans 14:17 For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking but of righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.

18 Whoever thus serves Christ is acceptable to God and approved by men.

19 So then let us pursue what makes for peace and for mutual upbuilding.

20 Do not, for the sake of food, destroy the work of God. Everything is indeed clean, but it is wrong for anyone to make another stumble by what he eats.

21 It is good not to eat meat or drink wine or do anything that causes your brother to stumble. { Some manuscripts add b or be hindered or be weakened b }

22 The faith that you have, keep between yourself and God. Blessed is the one who has no reason to pass judgment on himself for what he approves.

23 But whoever has doubts is condemned if he eats, because the eating is not from faith. For whatever does not proceed from faith is sin.