What can be done to stop gun violence

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Nihilo said:
What I meant by person was whether the entity in question possesses rights, and the reason I said that political theory can’t help us is because political theory begins with those who are already accepted as people, and proceeding from there.
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Ok taking that argument, if fetuses aren’t accepted as people then neither are you and I since the exact same defining criteria delineate you and I and you and fetus and me and fetus. So that argument is obviously absurd, unless we’re suggesting that now politically the concept of person doesn’t exist in which case society doesn’t exist.
 
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the question was whether it was true or not that “the same people who supported slavery now support abortion”. This question did not involve the geographical location of those who supported slavery. The issue of discussion is whether or not “the same people who supported slavery now support abortion.”
My counter example shows that this is not a true statement.
The question of the geographical distribution of those who supported slavery is a different issue. But I can say that I did read that at one time, there were people in the Northern states who did support slavery.
 
Maxirad said:
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steve-b:
What wasn’t mentioned in either video is all the gun violent video games out in the market.

One spending hours upon hours playing such games AND to up their score by how many one can kill in the shortest amount of time, ultimately has to desensitize one to violence and violent behavior that either has a disposition to violence NOW or learns it from a video .
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Check out this piece by Catholic apologist Dave Armstrong.
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Great article. 👍
 
Put God back into homes, schools, businesses, and government and you will find a great reduction in gun violence.
 
probably will help in the short run / IN THE LONG RUN IF PEOPLE IN THE MORNING , DURING THE DAY , AT BEDTIME HUG THEIR CHILDREN AND TELL THEM THAT THEY LOVE THEM I BELIEVE THE COMBATIVE NATURE OF HUMANKIND WILL CHANGE
 
Dave Armstrong is right in saying that there are societal causes driving the recent increase in violence. But his guesses as to what those society causes are I find way too narrowly focused on secularization. Other nations are more secular than the US and have no where near the level of violence we have. In any case, whatever those societal issues are, they may not be as easily dealt with as restricting guns. I think these “primary causes” are brought up by apologists for the gun industry not as any serious attempt to reduce gun violence, but as a means of deflecting attention away from a solution that may actually work, but which inconveniences the gun lobby.
 
LeafByNiggle said:
Dave Armstrong is right in saying that there are societal causes driving the recent increase in violence. But his guesses as to what those society causes are I find way too narrowly focused on secularization. Other nations are more secular than the US and have no where near the level of violence we have. In any case, whatever those societal issues are, they may not be as easily dealt with as restricting guns. I think these “primary causes” are brought up by apologists for the gun industry not as any serious attempt to reduce gun violence, but as a means of deflecting attention away from a solution that may actually work, but which inconveniences the gun lobby.
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IMV

I thought he covered all the main issues (secular / societal / moral) in his 11 points.
 
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He did not cover inequality of opportunity. He did not cover racism.

He was wrong in blaming prescription anti-depressants.

And the things he did blame were mostly things that are extremely difficult to do anything about.
 
LeafByNiggle said:
He did not cover inequality of opportunity. He did not cover racism.

He was wrong in blaming prescription anti-depressants.

And the things he did blame were mostly things that are extremely difficult to do anything about.
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And there ya have it. Not the gun but all the issues behind the one behind the trigger.
 
steve-b said:
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LeafByNiggle:
He did not cover inequality of opportunity. He did not cover racism.

He was wrong in blaming prescription anti-depressants.

And the things he did blame were mostly things that are extremely difficult to do anything about.
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And there ya have it. Not the gun but all the issues behind the one behind the trigger.
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The topic of the thread is “What can be done to stop gun violence”. You apparently think you have answered the question by identifying some things that cause people to be violent. For one thing, the things so identified may be nearly impossible to change. And secondly, changing those things are not the only way to reduce violence. One example is the fact that we have visible police patrols at sporting events. Why? To keep people from becoming violent. Do these police patrols address the root causes of that violence? No. They reduce violence by making it harder to get away with being violent. So addressing “root causes” is not always used. In fact, it seems to me that the whole law enforcement effort is less than 1% dedicated to “root causes” and 99% dedicated to making it harder to be violent.

So why dismiss gun restrictions on the grounds that it does not address “root causes”? If those were valid grounds for dismissing gun restrictions, we would also have valid grounds for dismissing 99% of all law enforcement efforts.
 
LeafByNiggle said:
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steve-b:
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LeafByNiggle:
He did not cover inequality of opportunity. He did not cover racism.

He was wrong in blaming prescription anti-depressants.

And the things he did blame were mostly things that are extremely difficult to do anything about.
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And there ya have it. Not the gun but all the issues behind the one behind the trigger.
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So why dismiss gun restrictions on the grounds that it does not address “root causes”? If those were valid grounds for dismissing gun restrictions, we would also have valid grounds for dismissing 99% of all law enforcement efforts.
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I think you are missing Dave Armstrong’s points.

✓> 1) Relentless secularization and opposition to Christian mores and values: especially in public venues.
  1. Related to #1 is societal sanctioning of many sinful things, particularly the sexual norms of Christianity.
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  1. Breakdown of the family, as a result of divorce, the sexual revolution, and the factors involved in #1 and #2.
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✓> 4) Glorification of violence (even if merely “fantasy” and non-“approved”) in music and movies and video games, etc., leading to a blunting of the normal human reactions to violence.

✓> 5) Rejection of Christianity on a personal level, leading to sin (which never helped anyone), meaninglessness, despair, and possibly, violence.

✓> 6) Devaluation of human life due to all of the above factors, plus corrupt forms of religion (most notably, jihadism) and extreme political ideologies (left or right).
  1. Legal abortion and its philosophical and legal predecessor contraception: the notion that conception or “too many” children are bad things, rather than good things. In other words: anti-child / anti-life philosophies.
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✓> 8) Substance abuse, leading people to not be in their right minds and to do things they would never do, sober or drug-free.

✓> 9) Poverty and rotten, crime- and gang- and drug-infested neighborhoods. The more we allow millions to live in those conditions, without trying to help their lot in life, the worse their lives and our society get.

✓> 10) Terrible schools, teaching secular and anti-Christian notions, and not helping children get a proper education, so as to advance and be successful in life.
  1. Commenter Jim Brown added: “Don’t overlook the common denominator in most of the mass shootings: prescription anti-depressants. The one Paddock used carries a warning that it can cause homicidal and suicidal thoughts.”
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steve-b said:
I think you are missing Dave Armstrong’s points.
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No, I read them all. I didn’t miss them. They just don’t give any useful advice on how to stop gun violence. If you think they do, then please specify a solution based on these “points.”
 
LeafByNiggle said:
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steve-b:
I think you are missing Dave Armstrong’s points.
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No, I read them all. I didn’t miss them. They just don’t give any useful advice on how to stop gun violence. If you think they do, then please specify a solution based on these “points.”
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Redo and correct what was undone by all those points he made
 
steve-b said:
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LeafByNiggle:
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steve-b:
I think you are missing Dave Armstrong’s points.
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No, I read them all. I didn’t miss them. They just don’t give any useful advice on how to stop gun violence. If you think they do, then please specify a solution based on these “points.”
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Redo and correct what was undone by all those points he made
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How? By establishing a theocracy? Tell me a practical solution.
 
LeafByNiggle said:
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steve-b:
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LeafByNiggle:
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steve-b:
I think you are missing Dave Armstrong’s points.
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No, I read them all. I didn’t miss them. They just don’t give any useful advice on how to stop gun violence. If you think they do, then please specify a solution based on these “points.”
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Redo and correct what was undone by all those points he made
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How? By establishing a theocracy? Tell me a practical solution.
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Proper formation is a personal endeavor one freely wills to do. The information is ALL there from the Church, if one wants to use it and grow. It’s never been so easy to access the information, in all of history, as it is today. It took a LOOOOOOONG time for society to be deformed, it will take a looooong time to reform. As Peter taught HERE

So, If​

one doesn’t ever increase, without stopping, in these 7 conditions,

virtue, knowledge, self-control, steadfastness, godliness, brotherly affection, love.

Then​

As Peter warns, whoever lacks these things is blind and shortsighted and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins…and they will fall.

Therefore,​

This is a personal issue each and every person needs and must do for themself.
 
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If this is the one proper way to reduce violence, why do we have police at sporting events and other such gatherings? Are we misguided to attempt to limit violence with police presence? And if police are valid to use for this purpose, why not gun control?
 
LeafByNiggle said:
If this is the one proper way to reduce violence, why do we have police at sporting events and other such gatherings Are we misguided to attempt to limit violence with police presence? And if police are valid to use for this purpose, why not gun control?
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Re: Police,
Obviously they protect everyone else from others who aren’t peaceful.

Re: Gun control
Chicago has huge gun control laws. Does it prevent gun crimes? No. Because crooks will get guns
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It only puts emphasis on other weapons people use to inflict harm on others. Britain for example, has massive gun control laws. Does it prevent killings? Nope. People use knives to kill others. HERE
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Should knives be restricted?
 
So now poc is comparable to a corpse or an amputated limb?

I rest my case that the same mentality supports abortion and slavery - it views fetuses and poc as less than human. We don’t even have to speculate - we’ve been given examples of corpses and amputated limbs as analogous to fetuses and poc
 
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