What do you think of climate change?

[JanR]

This planet has been undergoing climate changes since its beginnings, and these cycles are mostly natural. That said, we do have a responsibility to be good stewards and not wantonly pollute our environments. But I think way too much blame is being placed onto mankind, and our roles in it are being blown way out of proportion. Nature has built-in mechanisms for making corrections, and if left alone, can pretty much take care of itself. Sometimes, interventions are necessary, but need to be thoughtful and intelligent. And, there’s a thin, delicate line between intervention and interference. Sometimes, we humans think we’re way smarter than we really are. That we know better than God or nature. Yes, do take good care of the planet, but don’t hang every change in climate around human necks like albatrosses, because our activity comprises only a small part of the overall picture.

 

[Freddy]

Nature has built-in mechanisms for making corrections, and if left alone, can pretty much take care of itself.

I think that you may be missing the point. That nature will indeed take care of itself is actually the problem we face.

 

[EndTimes]

Anyone who Accepts Ice Age could never Deny Climate Change

 

[AdyEbor63]

I believe that climate change is a reality, but then if one looks back over world history it’s something that’s been going on for a long time, thousands of years in fact. At the same time I’m a little less certain that the current phase of climate change through which we’re going is necessarily or wholly linked to industrialisation and modern life styles. Of course it makes sense to do what we can to limit pollution and do what we physically can to protect our environment, but one can do all of that without completely buying into the current climate change agenda, about which not all scientists are agreed.

 

[Metis1]

Simply put, climate scientists have known for over a century that higher levels of CO2 and methane gas can cause what is known as the “greenhouse effect”. This also has been made worse by the cutting down of trees worldwide on a massive scale.

Over more recent decades they have tried to find evidence that this climate change may be caused by other factors, but they have come up empty.

 

[EndTimes]

What I think about climate change doesn’t matter. The climate changes. That’s a scientific fact. I live in the US in an area that was covered by a HUGE layer of ice not very long ago (geologically speaking). Climate changes.

YEP… No one actually Denies that Climate can and has Changed…
Ergo - The phrase, “Climate Change Denial”, seems stupid…

Two notions get piggy-backed into “CC”

1. BEING GREEN - as per Genesis 1:28
   and
2. If Not-Stopped - Man Made Global Warming Shall Raise Oceans to Fearful Levels

What’s the Climate Going to be 100 years from now?
or…
What’s it going to be Two Months from now?

 

[Ender]

Some real world concerns about going green (in the UK):

In order to keep global temperatures to within 1.5◦C of pre-industrial levels, we intend to eliminate emissions of greenhouse gases (mainly carbon dioxide) by replacing all the energy developments since about 1880 with zero-carbon alternatives. This is to be achieved by 2050. Figure 6 shows the scale of what has been proposed. Even reaching the old target of an 80% reduction in carbon dioxide emissions would be miraculous; this is a level of emissions not seen since 1880. I assert that a herd of unicorns will be needed to deliver this target, let alone full decarbonisation. I also point out the utter nonsense of Extinction Rebellion’s demands to complete the task by 2025. (Energy Utopias and Engineering Reality - Michael Kelly)

 

[Theo520]

Report: If Earth Continues To Warm At Current Rate Moon Will Be Mostly Underwater By 2400

Report: If Earth Continues To Warm At Current Rate Moon Will Be Mostly Underwater By 2400​

 

[EndTimes]

Report: If Earth Continues To Warm At Current Rate Moon Will Be Mostly Underwater By 2400

And… If the present rate of population growth continues unabated,
the Radius of Earth shall increase by the Speed of Light by 2050

 

[Metis1]

Rome wasn’t built in a day, nor can we stop global warming overnight. But if we don’t take seriously what’s happening and make amends as we had been doing before electing President Bone-Spurs, then we’re as dumb as bricks.

So sorry to insult bricks, so my apologies to them.

 

[Ender]

Rome wasn’t built in a day, nor can we stop global warming overnight. But if we don’t take seriously what’s happening and make amends as we had been doing before electing President Bone-Spurs, then we’re as dumb as bricks.

Then again, maybe the problem is simply the hype.

From 1850 to the present, the noise-corrected, average warming of the surface of the earth is less than 0.07 degrees C per decade.
(Thomas K. Bjorklund, University of Houston, Dept. of Earth and Atmospheric Sciences, 2019)

 

[RCIAGraduate]

Would carbon taxes be that bad; we have a deficit, why not use carbon tax revenues to help curb it as an idea?

 

[LeafByNiggle]

From 1850 to the present, the noise-corrected, average warming of the surface of the earth is less than 0.07 degrees C per decade.
(Thomas K. Bjorklund, University of Houston, Dept. of Earth and Atmospheric Sciences, 2019)

By taking an average over a period that goes all the way back to 1850, we artificially dilute the significance of a change that has been concentrated mostly in the last quarter of that period. Why not average the temperature change starting with the year 850 instead? Then we can get an even smaller noise-averaged rate of change, and it will similarly meaningless.

 

[Ender]

By taking an average over a period that goes all the way back to 1850, we artificially dilute the significance of a change that has been concentrated mostly in the last quarter of that period. Why not average the temperature change starting with the year 850 instead? Then we can get an even smaller noise-averaged rate of change, and it will similarly meaningless.

The number is not meaningless, but clearly it depends on what one chooses as the starting date. The report goes on to say, however…

The rate of warming of the surface of the earth does not correlate with the rate of increase of CO2 in the atmosphere. The perceived threat of excessive future global temperatures may stem from misinterpretation of 40 years of increasing intensities of the El Nino Southern Oscillation (ENSO) climate pattern in the eastern Pacific Ocean. ENSO activity culminated in 2016 with the highest surface temperature anomaly ever recorded. The rate of warming of the earth’s surface has dropped 41 percent since 2006.

This also goes to the assertion raised in an earlier post that others have tried to come up with evidence that this climate change may be caused by other factors, but they have come up empty. Clearly that assertion is without basis.

 

[Theo520]

Rome wasn’t built in a day, nor can we stop global warming overnight. But if we don’t take seriously what’s happening and make amends as we had been doing before electing President Bone-Spurs, then we’re as dumb as bricks.

So sorry to insult bricks, so my apologies to them.

You have some logic failures to fix.

The country (US) never agreed to ‘make amends’ and send billions to the developing world as the prior president numskull promised when he signed the Paris agreement. He intentionally failed to seek Congressional approval.

We are doing fantastic in reducing our rate of contribution to CO2 emissions, and Trump hasn’t reversed that trend in the slightest.

 

[Theo520]

Would carbon taxes be that bad; we have a deficit, why not use carbon tax revenues to help curb it as an idea?

We already have carbon taxes, had them ever since fuel has been sold. History has shown that dramatic increases in fuel taxes is not supported by voters. and economists have stated that the required amount of increase would be ginormous. It’s also a very regressive tax.

 

[phaster]

Some real world concerns about,…

just like there exists a total lack of basic scientific understanding (by the general public) of what causes CC

www.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/tops.12187

seems there also exists a total lack of basic understanding of the magnitude of various financial risk(s) associated w/ the changing climate (AND VICE VERSA),… IOW

there is the other unacknowledged man made problem of ever growing unsustainable off balance sheet debt which is fractal in nature,… meaning debt obligations are happening at the local level

www.TinyURL.com/13thcheck

as well as at the state AND national levels

TinyURL.com - shorten that long URL into a tiny URL

bottom line,… ignoring manmade climate change and off balance sheet debt obligations is an unappreciated knockout “combo” punch risk!!!

said another way let’s,…

suppose humanity needs to build various kinds of infrastructure to address very noticeable adverse symptoms of “climate change”

and that the global finance system isn’t working (as expected)

FYI

Record high global debt of $250 trillion ‘could curb efforts to tackle climate risk,’ report warns

The global debt ballooned to a record high of more than $250 trillion and shows no sign of slowing down, according to a new report from the Institute of International Finance (IIF), which warned that this massive debt could impact international efforts to mitigate climate change.

Worldwide debt surged by $7.5 trillion in the first half of 2019, urging researchers to predict that the global debt would exceed $255 trillion by the end of the year.

…The bulk of the global debt – or more than 60% – is from the U.S. and China, the report released on Thursday found.

…Hidden debt and other “poorly understood contingent liabilities” can create additional uncertainty, the report said, “and could leave some sovereigns struggling to source international and domestic capital – including to combat climate change.”

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/record-high-global-debt-250-trillion-curb-efforts/story?id=67042801

in any case now that the big players in the finance sector are recognizing the more immediate risk posed by CC I sense the tide toward taking active measure to reduce carbon loading the atmosphere will accelerate

The Economics of Climate Change - San Francisco Fed

PS one other thing,… going forward religious skeptic/deniers of AGW should expect a little bit more pressure to change their tune

Catechism will be updated to include ecological sins, pope says | National Catholic Reporter

 

[LeafByNiggle]

as the prior president numskull promised

Name calling may make you feel good, but it does degrade the respect you might otherwise get for your reasoned debate, such as it is.

 

[LeafByNiggle]

RCIAGraduate:

Would carbon taxes be that bad; we have a deficit, why not use carbon tax revenues to help curb it as an idea?

We already have carbon taxes, had them ever since fuel has been sold.

Those were taxes meant to pay for roads and repairs. It is not a “carbon tax” as seen by the fact that fuel used in farm tractors and equipment that does not run on public roads is exempt from the fuel tax. They even color the tax-free diesel a different color to prevent cheating.

History has shown that dramatic increases in fuel taxes is not supported by voters. and economists have stated that the required amount of increase would be ginormous. It’s also a very regressive tax.

Carbon taxes are not regressive if they apply only to industrial consumers of fossil fuel, which is the way most people talk about carbon taxes.

 

[Metis1]

Some here seem totally oblivious to this administration’s reversing of so many of the EPA mandates., including the issue of greater CO2 emissions that are now being allowed:

The environmental policy of the Donald Trump administration represents a shift from the policy priorities and goals of his predecessor, Barack Obama. While Obama’s environmental agenda prioritized the reduction of carbon emissions through the use of clean renewable energy, the Trump administration has sought to increase fossil fuel use and scrap many environmental regulations, which he has referred to as impediments to United States economic and energy output…

In April 2018, the administration announced plans to undo the Obama administration’s auto fuel efficiency and emissions standards. The administration also proposed significant cuts in funding for the Endangered Species Act. In 2018 and, in 2019, it announced major changes in how it is to be implemented.

The Trump administration is also noted to have rewritten the EPA’s pollution-control policies—including on chemicals known to be serious health risks—particularly benefiting the chemicals industry.A 2018 analysis reported that the Trump administration’s rollbacks and proposed reversals of environmental rules would likely “cost the lives of over 80,000 US residents per decade and lead to respiratory problems for many more than 1 million people.”…. – Environmental policy of the Donald Trump administration - Wikipedia