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fbl9
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Jesus was speaking to every one there,even those who where later to betray Him…St.Peter for one,was there.
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johnpaul87
Guest
hey moon, im sorry, but none of yall are close to the bulls eye.
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moondweller
Guest
Define your “bull’s eye.”
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moondweller
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Wrong gospel, SHW:1 Pet 1:3-5 "Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His great mercy has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, to an inheritance {which is} imperishable and undefiled and will not fade away, reserved in heaven for you, who are protected by the power of God through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time."In God’s economy (grace) there’s no such thing as a “disinherited” son. That would be a salvation based strictly on works, which would be in stark contrast to God’s salvation through faith, based entirely on the exercise of His grace through the death and bodily resurrection of the incarnated Son (His unblemished Lamb who took away the sin of the world):Eph 2:8-9 "For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast."A child is not adopted based on his worthiness (that’s a corrupt concept even in the mind of fallen humanity). Nor is an inheritance ever conditioned on the worthiness of the inheritor.
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moondweller
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Christ wasn’t crucified and subsequently bodily raised to give men the power to live according to Law. Rather Paul teaches:Rom 1:16-17 “For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek. For in it {the} righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith; as it is written, “But the righteous shall live by faith.””
Rom 3:21-24 "But now apart from the Law {the} righteousness of God has been manifested, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, even {the} righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe; for there is no distinction; for all sinned and fall short of the glory of God, being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus;
Rom 4:25 "{He} who was delivered over because of our transgressions, and was raised because of our justification.
Rom 5:1 "Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom also we have obtained our access by faith into this grace in which we stand; and we exult in hope of the glory of God.The power of the cross is God’s to save “by grace through faith.”
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Howie01
Guest
Notice as well the clear and joyful statements concerning the believer’s security in the 1 Peter passage, and Peter is alleged to have been the first Pope.
So the first Pope teaches eternal security, but the CC rejects it.
Perhaps Peter’s teaching wasn’t ex cathedra?
Nevertheless, the Ephesian passages teaches the same in its grammar. The believer is saved completely by grace through faith, and that salvation is continuous and on-going (cf Rom 8). :extrahappy:
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moondweller
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The parable is about the effects of the “word of God” on humanity.
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moondweller
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Yes! If only the subsequent Popes would have continued in the teaching of him whom they consider their first.Notice as well the clear and joyful statements concerning the believer’s security in the 1 Peter passage, and Peter is alleged to have been the first Pope.
So the first Pope teaches eternal security, but the CC rejects it.
Perhaps Peter’s teaching wasn’t ex cathedra?
Nevertheless, the Ephesian passages teaches the same in its grammar. The believer is saved completely by grace through faith, and that salvation is continuous and on-going (cf Rom 8). :extrahappy:
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ncgolf
Guest
You must be thinking of a different Peter … because this Peter never taught what you preach. Ever.
It was only the little popes who came later that taught what you preach.
The big problem with any of your quotes is you only give little pieces … read all of this section.
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who in his great mercy gave us a new birth to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 to an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, kept in heaven for you
5 who by the power of God are safeguarded through faith, to a salvation that is ready to be revealed in the final time.
6 In this you rejoice,although now for a little while you may have to suffer through various trials,
7 so that the genuineness of your faith, more precious than gold that is perishable even though tested by fire, may prove to be for praise, glory, and honor at the revelation of Jesus Christ.
8 Although you have not seen him you love him; even though you do not see him now yet believe in him, you rejoice with an indescribable and glorious joy,
9 as you attain the goal of (your) faith, the salvation of your souls.
You are never eternally secure here … where we sit … we will be tested in this life how shall I put it, “as you attain the goal of your faith, the salvation of your souls.”
This never teaches eternal security in this life only in the next. The true believer is identifed through his trials and tests, presently, for a future reward. The true believer is not identified because he merely professes faith but lives in faith and faithfully even if faced with trials and tests or in other words the person perseveres.
Yes the truly faithful do attain by the grace of God but you don’t know until the end, not because I say so because Peter does. Words like prove, trial, suffer do indeed suggest this, and Peter of all people knew what tests could come one’s way and that one could fail some of them.
Because true believers are identified precisely by what happens in their life, not because you claim it for yourself.
It is the true believer that attains … why does Peter use a word that so contradicts what you believe. Based on what you say attain totally contradicts “eternal security” in this present life … not the next.
It is only by grace we are able to able to “attain”.
1 Peter does not contradict what the Catholic Church teaches. No way.
What a nice Catholic thing to say.
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SHW
Guest
We are saved through faith by baptism. They are not separated. If you believe, then you are baptized and your sins are washed away. This is justification.
Ephesians 2:8 “For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,”
Galatians 3:2 “This only I want to learn from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law (of Moses), or by the hearing of faith?”
Mark 16:16 “He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.”
To be “born again” means to be baptized with “water and the word.” (John 3:7-8, Ephesians 5:26)
Acts 22:14-16 “Then he said, ‘The God of our fathers has chosen you that you should know His will, and see the Just One, and hear the voice of His mouth. 15 For you will be His witness to all men of what you have seen and heard. 16 And now why are you waiting? Arise and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on the name of the Lord.”
What is faith? We are saved through faith. What does “through faith” mean? We are first saved through faith which means believing in Christ and obeying His command to be baptized.
After a person is justified, how does a person continue to be saved through faith to the gospel of Christ as in 1 Pet 1:3-5?
To be continued…
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Howie01
Guest
And John never taught that the believer can know he has eternal life (Jn 20:31; 1 Jn 5:13).
ISTM you understand the saved can’t lose salvation, but you posit they can’t know that they have it. But, John says the saved can know by believing.
Peter teaches eternal security, as does the Lord, and the other apostles; however, that’s not the subject of this thread.
No it’s not. From my perusal of the forum, Catholics don’t understand the words I use in the way I use them, neither do they understand Romans 8 correctly, as I do. If you believe Rom 8 says salvation can’t be lost, as I do, then what I’ve said is Catholic.
Do you believe salvation can’t be lost? :nope:
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SHW
Guest
Continued from post #70:
After a person is justified, how does a person continue to be saved through faith to the gospel of Christ as in 1 Pet 1:3-5?
1 Pet 1:3-5 "Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His great mercy has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, to an inheritance {which is} imperishable and undefiled and will not fade away, reserved in heaven for you, who are protected by the power of God through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
We are “born again” to a “living hope.” Hope is not a guarantee. We are protected through faith. What does “through faith” mean? It means that we are living a Christian life as in “we are obeying God’s commandments and we are producing good fruits/works.” We are therefore “abiding in Christ” and He is also abiding in us.
John 15:10 “If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love.”
1 Corinthians 4:1-2 “Let a man so consider us, as servants of Christ and stewards of the mysteries of God. 2** Moreover it is required in stewards that one be found faithful**.”
We remain faithful by obeying God’s commandments and producing good fruits as proof of our faith, as noted in the OP for this thread. When we obey the commandments of God and produce good fruits, we are “found faithful.”
Paul states that it is a requirement for salvation that we be found faithful.
2 Corinthians 13:5 “Examine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Do you not know yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you?—unless indeed you are disqualified.”
If we are not abiding in Christ by obeying His commandments and producing good fruits, which is explained in the OP of this thread, then we are disqualified for eternal life.
Galatians 5:5-6 “For we through the Spirit eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness by faith. 6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision avails anything, but faith working through love.”
Faith must work through love. “Love” is obeying God’s commandments and producing good fruits/works by cooperating with God’s grace which we received at our baptisms.
Colossians 1:21-23 “And you, who once were alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now He has reconciled 22 in the body of His flesh through death, to present you holy, and blameless, and above reproach in His sight— 23 if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was preached to every creature under heaven, of which I, Paul, became a minister.”
Paul states that we must continue in the faith in order to have hope of eternal life. Eternal life is our reward for remaining steadfast in the faith by obedience to God’s commandments. Eternal life is promised to us only IF we continue in the faith.
1 Thessalonians 3:4-5 “For, in fact, we told you before when we were with you that we would suffer tribulation, just as it happened, and you know. 5 For this reason, when I could no longer endure it, I sent to know your faith, lest by some means the tempter had tempted you, and our labor might be in vain.”
Paul states that if they succumbed to temptation and sinned; then he labored in vain, because they are no longer saved.
1 Timothy 1:18-20 “This charge I commit to you, son Timothy, according to the prophecies previously made concerning you, that by them you may wage the good warfare, 19 having faith and a good conscience, which some having rejected, concerning the faith have suffered shipwreck, 20 of whom are Hymenaeus and Alexander, whom I delivered to Satan that they may learn not to blaspheme.”
Not all persons remain faithful or are found faithful. They are excommunicated from the Church (they have disobeyed the gospel of Christ). Those who sin are no longer living through faith and they are not found faithful. What happens to persons who do not obey the gospel of Christ?
2 Thessalonians 1:7-9 “when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels, 8** in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 These shall be punished with everlasting destruction** from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power,”
Persons who are not found faithful are not saved, but instead they are subjected to the wrath of God and they are punished with everlasting destruction in flaming fire.
To be continued…
After a person is justified, how does a person continue to be saved through faith to the gospel of Christ as in 1 Pet 1:3-5?
1 Pet 1:3-5 "Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His great mercy has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, to an inheritance {which is} imperishable and undefiled and will not fade away, reserved in heaven for you, who are protected by the power of God through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
We are “born again” to a “living hope.” Hope is not a guarantee. We are protected through faith. What does “through faith” mean? It means that we are living a Christian life as in “we are obeying God’s commandments and we are producing good fruits/works.” We are therefore “abiding in Christ” and He is also abiding in us.
John 15:10 “If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love.”
1 Corinthians 4:1-2 “Let a man so consider us, as servants of Christ and stewards of the mysteries of God. 2** Moreover it is required in stewards that one be found faithful**.”
We remain faithful by obeying God’s commandments and producing good fruits as proof of our faith, as noted in the OP for this thread. When we obey the commandments of God and produce good fruits, we are “found faithful.”
Paul states that it is a requirement for salvation that we be found faithful.
2 Corinthians 13:5 “Examine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Do you not know yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you?—unless indeed you are disqualified.”
If we are not abiding in Christ by obeying His commandments and producing good fruits, which is explained in the OP of this thread, then we are disqualified for eternal life.
Galatians 5:5-6 “For we through the Spirit eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness by faith. 6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision avails anything, but faith working through love.”
Faith must work through love. “Love” is obeying God’s commandments and producing good fruits/works by cooperating with God’s grace which we received at our baptisms.
Colossians 1:21-23 “And you, who once were alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now He has reconciled 22 in the body of His flesh through death, to present you holy, and blameless, and above reproach in His sight— 23 if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was preached to every creature under heaven, of which I, Paul, became a minister.”
Paul states that we must continue in the faith in order to have hope of eternal life. Eternal life is our reward for remaining steadfast in the faith by obedience to God’s commandments. Eternal life is promised to us only IF we continue in the faith.
1 Thessalonians 3:4-5 “For, in fact, we told you before when we were with you that we would suffer tribulation, just as it happened, and you know. 5 For this reason, when I could no longer endure it, I sent to know your faith, lest by some means the tempter had tempted you, and our labor might be in vain.”
Paul states that if they succumbed to temptation and sinned; then he labored in vain, because they are no longer saved.
1 Timothy 1:18-20 “This charge I commit to you, son Timothy, according to the prophecies previously made concerning you, that by them you may wage the good warfare, 19 having faith and a good conscience, which some having rejected, concerning the faith have suffered shipwreck, 20 of whom are Hymenaeus and Alexander, whom I delivered to Satan that they may learn not to blaspheme.”
Not all persons remain faithful or are found faithful. They are excommunicated from the Church (they have disobeyed the gospel of Christ). Those who sin are no longer living through faith and they are not found faithful. What happens to persons who do not obey the gospel of Christ?
2 Thessalonians 1:7-9 “when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels, 8** in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 These shall be punished with everlasting destruction** from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power,”
Persons who are not found faithful are not saved, but instead they are subjected to the wrath of God and they are punished with everlasting destruction in flaming fire.
To be continued…
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SHW
Guest
Continued from Post #72:
2 Thessalonians 1:11-12 "Therefore we also pray always for you** that our God would count you worthy** of this calling, and fulfill all the good pleasure of His goodness and the work of faith with power, 12 that the name of our Lord Jesus Christ may be glorified in you, and you in Him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ.
We must be found worthy of our Christian calling in order to inherit eternal life.
Parents do disinherit their children.
Who do you think the “sons of disobedience” are who are subjected to the wrath of God?
Colossians 3:5-7 "Therefore put to death your members which are on the earth: fornication, uncleanness, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry. 6 Because of these things** the wrath of God is coming upon the sons of disobedience**, 7 in which you yourselves once walked when you lived in them.
Paul is warning them that if they do these things, then they will not continue to be saved. We are not saved by faith (head knowledge) alone. “Faith working through love” is what continues to save us. We must still be found faithful at our deaths in order to be saved. If we “walk” in these sinful things again, then we will become sons of disobedience and we will lose our inheritance of eternal life.
Matthew 10:22 “And you will be hated by all for My name’s sake. But he who endures to the end will be saved.”
James 2:24 “You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.”
We continue in the faith (remain justified) by our works (obeying God’s commandments and producing good fruits) by cooperating with the grace of God who indeed helps us to do His will because we cannot do anything good by ourselves.
Hebrews 10:26-30 "For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. And again, “The LORD will judge His people.”
2 Peter 2:20-21 “For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning. 21 For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them.”
We lose our salvation if we sin willfully after our justification. Jesus’ sacrifice no longer covers for us and we are now even worse off than before we were ever saved.
2 Timothy 2:19 "Nevertheless the solid foundation of God stands, having this seal: “The Lord knows those who are His,” and, “Let everyone who names the name of Christ depart from iniquity.”
We must be found worthy of our “Christian” name and be found faithful to the gospel of Jesus Christ in order to inherit eternal life.
2 Thessalonians 3:6 “But we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you withdraw from every brother who walks disorderly and not according to the tradition which he received from us.”
Paul commands the Christians (those who obey God) to withdraw from the pseudo-Christians who do not obey God (the gospel of Christ).
All “sons of disobedience” are subjected to the wrath of God.
Ephesians 5:5-7 “For this you know, that no fornicator, unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God. 6 Let no one deceive you with empty words, for** because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience**. 7 Therefore do not be partakers with them.”
I think it best that we heed Paul’s warning and always obey God’s commandments in order to not become partakers of the wrath of God which comes upon all of His sons of disobedience.
We are not saved by faith alone. We are saved through faith and this “faith working through love” must endure to the end of our lives in order for us to inherit eternal life.
SHW
2 Thessalonians 1:11-12 "Therefore we also pray always for you** that our God would count you worthy** of this calling, and fulfill all the good pleasure of His goodness and the work of faith with power, 12 that the name of our Lord Jesus Christ may be glorified in you, and you in Him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ.
We must be found worthy of our Christian calling in order to inherit eternal life.
Parents do disinherit their children.
Who do you think the “sons of disobedience” are who are subjected to the wrath of God?
Colossians 3:5-7 "Therefore put to death your members which are on the earth: fornication, uncleanness, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry. 6 Because of these things** the wrath of God is coming upon the sons of disobedience**, 7 in which you yourselves once walked when you lived in them.
Paul is warning them that if they do these things, then they will not continue to be saved. We are not saved by faith (head knowledge) alone. “Faith working through love” is what continues to save us. We must still be found faithful at our deaths in order to be saved. If we “walk” in these sinful things again, then we will become sons of disobedience and we will lose our inheritance of eternal life.
Matthew 10:22 “And you will be hated by all for My name’s sake. But he who endures to the end will be saved.”
James 2:24 “You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.”
We continue in the faith (remain justified) by our works (obeying God’s commandments and producing good fruits) by cooperating with the grace of God who indeed helps us to do His will because we cannot do anything good by ourselves.
Hebrews 10:26-30 "For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries. 28 Anyone who has rejected Moses’ law dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing, and insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. And again, “The LORD will judge His people.”
2 Peter 2:20-21 “For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning. 21 For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them.”
We lose our salvation if we sin willfully after our justification. Jesus’ sacrifice no longer covers for us and we are now even worse off than before we were ever saved.
2 Timothy 2:19 "Nevertheless the solid foundation of God stands, having this seal: “The Lord knows those who are His,” and, “Let everyone who names the name of Christ depart from iniquity.”
We must be found worthy of our “Christian” name and be found faithful to the gospel of Jesus Christ in order to inherit eternal life.
2 Thessalonians 3:6 “But we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you withdraw from every brother who walks disorderly and not according to the tradition which he received from us.”
Paul commands the Christians (those who obey God) to withdraw from the pseudo-Christians who do not obey God (the gospel of Christ).
All “sons of disobedience” are subjected to the wrath of God.
Ephesians 5:5-7 “For this you know, that no fornicator, unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God. 6 Let no one deceive you with empty words, for** because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience**. 7 Therefore do not be partakers with them.”
I think it best that we heed Paul’s warning and always obey God’s commandments in order to not become partakers of the wrath of God which comes upon all of His sons of disobedience.
We are not saved by faith alone. We are saved through faith and this “faith working through love” must endure to the end of our lives in order for us to inherit eternal life.
SHW
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ryanoneil
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And our reaction to it.
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moondweller
Guest
How could it be “a nice Catholic thing to say?” Didn’t you go on to read SHW’s posts trying to convince all that salvation is NOT completely by grace (unmerited) through faith (in Christ alone), and is NOT continuous and on-going?
I’m sure you, a Catholic, agree with SHW’s entire Catholic reasoning that “by faith” means keeping the commandments, loving God and neighbor and keeping one’s self unstained from sin. IOW, by the works of law all men shall be justified.
Based on his Catholic reasoning the only thing changed from the O.T. to the N.T. is the replacing of circumcision with baptism. But the problem is circumcision and commandment keeping never did save anyone in the O.T. So where does that leave you?
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ryanoneil
Guest
Of course the inheritance is imperishable.
But we can renounce our inheritance.
**See to it that no one be deprived of the grace of God, that no bitter root spring up and cause trouble, through which many may become defiled, that no one be an immoral or profane person like Esau, who sold his birthright for a single meal. (Heb 12:15-16)
If we sin deliberately after receiving knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains sacrifice for sins but a fearful prospect of judgment and a flaming fire that is going to consume the adversaries. Anyone who rejects the law of Moses is put to death without pity on the testimony of two or three witnesses. Do you not think that a much worse punishment is due the one who has contempt for the Son of God, considers unclean the covenant-blood by which he was consecrated, and insults the spirit of grace? We know the one who said: “Vengeance is mine; I will repay,” and again: “The Lord will judge his people.” It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God. (Heb 10:26-31)**
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moondweller
Guest
Like the Jewish Sadducees, you fail to understand the Scriptures and the power of God (being still under the principle of law, of course, it’s completely understandable).
Peter writes through the Holy Spirit that God Himself causes the believer to be “born again” to an inheritance which is imperishable, undefiled, will not fade away and reserved in heaven. And the only way the believer could ever lose that inheritance is for God to reverse the spiritual re-birth. But Peter reveals that it is God Himself who protects the born again believer by His power until the day his salvation is fully revealed in the last times (1 Pet. 1:3-5).
Esau never believed, even though he was blessed by God.
This is addressed to the Jew who, in unbelief, desires to go back to the Law and its sacrificial system for sin. But it could apply to you also who self-impose the principle of law keeping for justification and refuse to turn to God through FAITH in Christ alone. Rather than try to emulate the Jew who desires to remain under the principle of law, you should rather learn from his error. You should rather heed the warnings to those unbelieving Jews in the Book of Hebrews.
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ryanoneil
Guest
No, I understand the difference between the Law of Moses and the Law of Christ.
Do you?
Maybe you should re-read this scripture.
**If we sin deliberately after receiving knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains sacrifice for sins but a fearful prospect of judgment and a flaming fire that is going to consume the adversaries. Anyone who rejects the law of Moses is put to death without pity on the testimony of two or three witnesses. Do you not think that a much worse punishment is due the one who has contempt for the Son of God, considers unclean the covenant-blood by which he was consecrated, and insults the spirit of grace? We know the one who said: “Vengeance is mine; I will repay,” and again: “The Lord will judge his people.” It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God. (Heb 10:26-31) **
This is a call to persevere. He is addressing Jewish converts who are sanctified by the blood of the covenant, and his example is the sin of reverting to the worship of traditional Judaism.
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ryanoneil
Guest
No that is not the only way. God does not force us to remain faithful. He protects us through faith, but we can reject the gift of faith after recieving it. The imperishable inheritance is still there and God’s promise of protection is still there, but we can reject that faith and walk away. People stop believing every day.
Those on rocky ground are the ones who, when they hear, receive the word with joy, but they have no root; they believe only for a time and fall away in time of trial. (Luke 8:13)
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ryanoneil
Guest
See to it that no one be deprived of the grace of God, that no bitter root spring up and cause trouble, through which many may become defiled, that no one be an immoral or profane person like Esau, who sold his birthright for a single meal. (Heb 12:15-16)
He is warning them not to relinquish their inheritance (like Esau).
Let there be, then, no man or woman, no clan or tribe among you, who would now turn away their hearts from the LORD, our God, to go and serve these pagan gods! Let there be no root that would bear such poison and wormwood among you. (Deut 29:18)
But the author of Hebrews is talking to believers. He is warning against people who lead believers away from the Lord.
He is warning them not to relinquish their inheritance (like Esau).
Let there be, then, no man or woman, no clan or tribe among you, who would now turn away their hearts from the LORD, our God, to go and serve these pagan gods! Let there be no root that would bear such poison and wormwood among you. (Deut 29:18)
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