What does it mean to abide "in Christ?"

[AmbroseSJ]

BRB1:

MD … you claim to be a BAC. If true, why do you reject need to ABIDE in Christ – as taught by Christ to his NT Apostles & to his Church Triumphant elect ?

My thinking is that he is oppressed with an irrational bigotry. His oppression is unrecognized and vehemently denied by himself. He refuses to see that he is subdued and oppressed with a malignant doctrine FIRST, and THEN views all of the Scriptures in that warped context. He is positive his doctrine comes from the Scripture first, even though ALL erroneous doctrines can be extracted from the Bible (and quasi-proved from the Bible.) That is why only the Church can bring light to the Holy Scriptures. It was the divine plan from the beginning.

 

[mikeledes]

The word “abide” - in Greek meno – means to remain, to stay, or to continue. We find a variant of this same Greek word (epimeno) in Romans 11:22-23, which has a similar theme and clearly refers to true Christians:

22Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in (epimeno) His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. 23And they also, if they do not continue in (epimeno) their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.

Now to be “in Christ” means to be a member of His Body, to be in vital union with Him. So to abide in Christ means to remain or continue to be in vital union with Him and this is made clear by the following verse:

John 15:4

**"Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself unless it abides in the vine, so neither can you unless you abide in Me. **

Why can’t a branch that does not remain vitally attached to the vine bear fruit? Because once it has been detached from the vine, it no longer partakes of the life in the vine which gives it the vital power to bear fruit. And the detached branch dies. Hence, one who does not remain “attached” (i.e. abide) to Christ is cut off from the life in the True Vine and the vital power it gives to bear fruit pleasing to God. How does one remain in Christ? As the Scripture says, one remains in Him though faith and love, not by faith alone. (1 John 3:23-24). This faith that is united to or works through love (Galatians 5:^) is what the Catholic Church fides formata or living faith. A faith that is united to love will bear fruit for God, for a supernatural love for God cannot remain in one’s heart without it bearing fruit (i.e. works). The faith that saves is a living faith - faith united to love - and such a faith produces works. But a deliberate refusal to produce fruit for God (which is sin) leads to a hardening of the heart and the love of God does not remain in that person’s heart (1 John 3:17-18). Once faith is separated from the animating principle of love, that faith becomes a dead faith, unable to save. As James says, faith without works is dead.

So in the case of John 15, we have those who once had living faith - since only by grace through living faith can one be incorporated into Christ - but their deliberate refusal to bear fruit for God reflects a hardening in their heart - a turning away from the *love *of God - which is evidenced by their lack of fruit. It is by grace through living faith that we enter into vital union with Christ, it is by grace through living faith that we remain in vital union with Christ, and it is by grace through living faith that we enter into eternal glory. Once that living faith becomes a dead faith through a turning away from the love of God, that vital union is broken and that person no longer enjoys of the life found in the True Vine and thus no longer has the vital power to bear fruit for the greater glory of God. Such a person who has been severed from Christ and has fallen from grace serves no useful purpose except to be thrown away, gathered by angels, and cast into hell fire.

God Bless,
Michael

 

[NoelFitz]

Michael,

Thank you for a clear and scholarly post that presents Catholic teaching powerfully in a very positive way.

 

[mikeledes]

Michael,

Thank you for a clear and scholarly post that presents Catholic teaching powerfully in a very positive way.

Thank you for your kind comment. It’s very important that Catholics have a proper understanding of what the Catholic Church teaches regarding saving faith. Faith alone does not save for such a faith is dead and hence cannot end in justification. For Catholics, the faith that saves is the faith that is united to the love of God. How can one have saving faith prior to justification without the love of God? Protestants define saving faith as trust. How can one “trust” someone and not love the One upon whom one places his trust? How can you have sorrow for sins…

2 Corinthians 7:10

10For the sorrow that is according to the will of God produces a repentance without regret, leading to salvation, but the sorrow of the world produces death.

Isaiah 55:7

7 Let the wicked forsake his way,
And the unrighteous man his thoughts;
Let him return to the LORD,
And He will have mercy on him;
And to our God,
For He will abundantly pardon.

Acts 3:19

19"Therefore repent and return, so that your sins may be wiped away, in order that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord;

… without love? In order for there to be true repentance that leads to salvation/forgiveness of sins, there has to be sorrow for sins and a firm decision to forsake them. Again, all of this must occur prior to forgiveness of sins/ justification. So how can one’s affections towards sin change without a change in one’s affections towards God? You either love God or you hate Him, there is no middle ground. You cannot simultaneously feel sorrow for sins and hatred for God, for hating God is sin. The Bible clearly says that not only must we believe, but we must also repent and there can be no true repentance without the love of God. That’s why the Catholic Church teaches that the faith that ends in justification is the faith that is united to love (fides caritate formata). The faith that is formed by love is living faith and ends in justification. That’s why we reject sola fide (faith alone). Justification requires faith and repentance, and you cannot have true repentance without the love of God.

God Bless,
Michael

 

[BRB1]

Faith alone does not save for such a faith is dead and hence cannot end in justification.

How can one have saving faith prior to justification without the love of God? Protestants define saving faith as trust. How can one “trust” someone and not love the One upon whom one places his trust? How can you have sorrow for sins…

In order for there to be true repentance that leads to salvation/forgiveness of sins, there has to be sorrow for sins and a firm decision to forsake them. Again, all of this must occur prior to forgiveness of sins/ justification.

The Bible clearly says that not only must we believe, but we must also repent and there can be no true repentance without the love of God. That’s why the Catholic Church teaches that the faith that ends in justification is the faith that is united to love (fides caritate formata). The faith that is formed by love is living faith and ends in justification.

That’s why we reject sola fide (faith alone). Justification requires faith and
repentance, and you cannot have true repentance without the love of God.

Mike …

You are suggesting here that God’s absolving us of former sins … is not in itself sufficient justification. You say ‘faith formed by love is living faith and ends in justification’. And that ‘we must not only believe, but we must repent … and there can be no true repentance w/o the love of God’.​

Its my understanding that the Gospels teach we are justified ‘apart from works’, based solely on our faith in Christ and his ability to intercede for us before the Father, and present us to God for spiritual adoption.

None of us would ever find God, if we had to first demonstrate a sufficient measure of love. All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. God first loved us, while we were yet sinners, and lay down his life for us. We need only accept/receive this love of Calvary, experience miraculous ‘initial’ justification based on our faith that Jesus is the Christ, … and allow Christ to transform us into new creations capable of understanding what the Law of Love entails/demands of us. As Christ taught, he must Rebirth us, in order for us to become pleasing to God … [born of water & the spirit, as he related salvation process/sequence to Nicodemus].

In other words … we must undergo more than a single, initial ‘justification’ event. Initial justification is our Spiritual rebirth and introduction to the H.S. following our publically expressed faith [via verbal oath] to Christ, to follow him in discipleship.

Lifelong ABIDING in Christ, taught by Apostles and Christ … entails ongoing repentance, additional justification events … needed when we departure from the Way, forsake our oath, and learn by trial & error what True Discipleship demands.

Man’s best knowledge of truth and love … is what the Spirit gives to us via grace. Thus, the good works we Catholic believe so important, are the reflection of God’s grace revealed/expressed in us via ‘infusion’ of H.S., not ‘imputation’. Christ taught we can do nothing apart from his inner help.

We must develop a dependence [a trust], that Christ is our sure and only hope. Verbally acknowledging Christ and receiving initial justification [via Protestant claimed Faith Alone] is only Step 1. Initial Conversion and lifelong Abiding in Christ are not the same experience. However, both are needed … and taught by Apostles, as they learned from Christ.

---

Feel free to correct my errors in understanding of Catholic doctrines … Mike and MD

Mother called yesterday. Said her Southern Baptist minister preached Sunday that OSAS is not correct, and doesn’t fully reflect the Gospel message of Christ & Paul.

MD … you better listen to MY mother and her Protestant pastor

 

[NoelFitz]

mikeledes

Thank you!

As you note in your very perceptive way Protestants have a different slant on the meaning of the word* faith (PISTIS)*. Thus one of the problems about the word is that Catholics and Protestants have different ideas about what it means. For a Protestant, it seems to me (in agreement with you), the emphasis is on trust, while for Catholics the emphasis is on believing truths.

πίστις , εως f faith, trust, belief; the Christian faith; conviction, good conscience (Ro 14.22, 23); perhaps body of faith, doctrine (Jd 3, 20); assurance, proof (Ac 17.31); promise (1 Tm 5.12)

Barclay Moon Newman, Concise Greek-English Dictionary of the New Testament. (Stuttgart, Germany: Deutsche Bibelgesellschaft; United Bible Societies, 1993), 143.

 

[mikeledes]

Mike …

You are suggesting here that God’s absolving us of former sins … is not in itself sufficient justification. You say ‘faith formed by love is living faith and ends in justification’. And that ‘we must not only believe, but we must repent … and there can be no true repentance w/o the love of God’.

Hi BRB! I’m not saying that we have to have a certain amount of love first in order to be justified. What we need to have is the beginning of the love of God. We believe that if faith is not united to incipient charity, then that faith is dead and unable to justify. In order to be justified, we have to feel sorrow for our sins, forsake them, and repent. That’w why the Bible says that in addition to faith, we must also repent of our sins in order to receive forgiveness:

Psalm 32:5 (The first verse of this Psalm is quoted in Romans 4)

5 I acknowledged my sin to You,
And my iniquity I have not hidden.
I said, “I will confess my transgressions to the LORD,”
And You forgave the iniquity of my sin.

Isaiah 55:7

7 Let the wicked forsake his way,
And the unrighteous man his thoughts;
Let him return to the LORD,
And He will have mercy on him;
And to our God,
For He will abundantly pardon.

Acts 3:19

19"Therefore repent and return, so that your sins may be wiped away, in order that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord;

1 John 1:9

**9If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. **

What I’m saying is that none of the above is possible if one’s affections towards God have not changed. How can one truly repent of sins if the love of God is not present in your heart? Can one simultaneously “trust” a person and not love him? And this repentance precedes justification. Therefore, the love of God must be present prior to being justified. If faith is not united to the love of God prior to justification, then that faith is a dead faith and is as useless as the “faith” of demons. Once a person is justified, that person now has the responsibility to express and nurture that love for God through a life of Christian holiness, fufilling the royal law of Christ and the Beatitudes and by doing so, he or she also pefects his or her faith and grows in holiness. If that love for God is not expressed and nurtured, then one’s heart becomes hardened and the love of God does not remain. That’s why we believe that we are justified through a living faith, and a living faith is one that is animated by love (Galatians 5:6)

John 16:27

27 for the Father Himself loves you, because you have loved Me, and have believed that I came forth from God.

John 14:23

**23Jesus answered and said to him, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him. **

God Bless,
Michael

 

[BRB1]

Hi BRB! I’m not saying that we have to have a certain amount of love first in order to be justified. What we need to have is the beginning of the love of God. John 16:27

27 for the Father Himself loves you, because you have loved Me, and have believed that I came forth from God.

John 14:23

23Jesus answered and said to him, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him.

Interesting idea, that our love of God, draws him to us … suggested by the scripts above.

However, scriptures also teach that no one seeks God … unless first drawn by God’s spirit. Christ clearly taught that the Father gave the 12 apostles to him, and he retained them all … except for Judas, who withdrew/rejected God’s love via freewill apostasy. Judas never truly bonded [Abided] in Christ … like Peter, James, and John did.

It seems this is why the concept of Abiding is so crucial in Holy Scirptures [esp. stressed in John’s writings]. It we fail to bond … our faiths can wither like Judas’.

God seems to equate our obedience with a demonstration of love of him. To obey is tantamount with loving/abiding. James further supports this idea with his teaching that ‘faith w/o works [borne of obedience] is dead’.

 

[mikeledes]

Interesting idea, that our love of God, draws him to us … suggested by the scripts above.

However, scriptures also teach that no one seeks God … unless first drawn by God’s spirit. Christ clearly taught that the Father gave the 12 apostles to him, and he retained them all … except for Judas, who withdrew/rejected God’s love via freewill apostasy. Judas never truly bonded [Abided] in Christ … like Peter, James, and John did.

God loves us first and draws us to Him through grace. However, that love is taken to another level when we are justified, become partakers of the divine nature, and hence become His children.

It seems this is why the concept of Abiding is so crucial in Holy Scirptures [esp. stressed in John’s writings]. It we fail to bond … our faiths can wither like Judas’.

God seems to equate our obedience with a demonstration of love of him. To obey is tantamount with loving/abiding. James further supports this idea with his teaching that ‘faith w/o works [borne of obedience] is dead’

You make an excellent point here. The Bible primarily links obedience/works to love, not faith per se.

1 John 3:17-18

**17But whoever has the world’s goods, and sees his brother in need and closes his heart against him, how does the love of God abide in him?
18Little children, let us not love with word or with tongue, but in deed and truth. **

1 John 5:3

**3For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments; and His commandments are not burdensome. **

Revelation 2:4-5

4’But I have this against you, that you have left your first love.
5’Therefore remember from where you have fallen, and repent and do the deeds you did at first

In their attempt to reconcile James 2 with faith alone, Protestants often argue that the faith that saves is the faith that works. That is only partially true. I say it’s partially true because they leave out a very important element:

Galatians 5:6

**6For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything, but faith working through love. **

The faith that saves is the faith that works through love. Good works are the visible manifestation of love and the presence of love means that faith is present as well, for you cannot have the love of God without faith. The error of many Protestants is that in their attempt to reconcile sola fide with James 2, they attempt to make good works an automatic extension of faith. Works demonstrate that you have faith. So that means if there are no works, the faith was not genuine. That is not taught by Scripture. In fact, I don’t know how they reconcile this interpretation of James 2 with the following verse:

2 Peter 1:5-9

**5 But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, 6 to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, 7 to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. 8 For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins. **

Note, Peter does not say that the one who lacks these qualities (virtue, self-control, perseverance, godliness, brotherly kindness, love), never had genuine faith. He says that such a person had “forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins.” That obviously means the person had genuine faith. And how about the fruitless branches of John 15:2? All this clearly indicates that works are not the automatic extension of faith and that the lack of works is not necessarily evidence that a person’s faith was never genuine.

Faith that works through love bears fruit. A fruitful faith is a living faith and a living faith is one that is united to love. Without love, faith is unfruitful and dead and does not save:

James 2:14-17

**14 What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him? 15 If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, 16 and one of you says to them, “Depart in peace, be warmed and filled,” but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit? 17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead. **

And since faith by itself - without love - cannot save, we reject the doctrine of faith alone.

God Bless,
Michael

 

[BRB1]

The error of many Protestants is that in their attempt to reconcile sola fide with James 2, they attempt to make good works an automatic extension of faith.

True enuf ! Good works are a resultant of faith … but, automatic ?
I don’t think. No one does Beatitude type works just naturally. Charity, turning the other cheek, giving up both coat and cloak. These works are antithetical concepts … that go against our natural human instincts.

Christ gave us a new Law that cannot be followed apart from his inspiration and grace. Those whose lives demonstrate the Beatitude law … are the true saints, the elect.