What does the Bible mean to Catholics?

[JRKH]

When all else is said,it is a fact that the Bible was on the index as a a danger to Catholics and most Catholics did not possess a Bible whilst most protestants did possess one or more.Even to this day Catholics are wary and suspicious of the Bible as a protestant book undermining the authority of their priests at sermons and homilies for no two priests will give exactly the same homily but the Bible says exactly the same for all and some would regard Peter and James as catholics and Paul as a Protestant.Even now Catholics not only do not study or search or even read the Bible and regard the Bible as full of errors,contradictions,exaggerations,lies,myths and fairy stories of Adam and Eve,Noahs Ark and a global flood and Jonah as a whale of a story and totally unreliable as history or science and not the inerrant word of God - btw most Catholics still do not possess a Bible or are inclined or intent to do so - twinc

A most unfortunate Post because it lumps all catholics into a single entity. I can destroy this entire argument by simply stating - -
"I am Catholic, and I own, and read the bible. I do not fear it for I do not believe it contains errors or contradictions. I do not see it undermining anything in The Church.

Now I am sure that there are some catholics who feel this way, just as there are some protestants who probably feel this way. But that is a far cry from making blanket statments about “Catholics”.

Peace
James

 

[JRKH]

I have no problem with submitting to the Church’s understanding. I will confess that it doesn’t stop me wanting to know why certain teachings exist though. I’ve never been able to accept “Just because I said so” and - so far anyway - the Church doesn’t appear to make rash decisions on things “just because”. It seems when you are prepared to dig a little that the reasons for those teachings becomes clear. I’m truly searching to understand firstly what the Church teaches and why - and how that fits (or doesn’t!) with what I’ve been told for the last 35 years of my life. It’s a pretty big paradigm shift…

Yes it is a big shift.
One thing though. After you’ve investigated a couple or a few issues and found the teachings sound you’ll begin to have much greater confidence in the other teachings, even if you haven’t looked into them (yet).
Soon you have no problem with “defaulting” to the Church’s view because she has shown herself to be trustworthy.

Hmm… Good insight.

Thanks but I can’t take credit for this. It was a convert apologist who pointed it out to me.

I can definitely see what you mean. It seems so sad that these people with their agendas create such anxiety.

I don’t really blame these people. They are, “on fire for The Lord”, and wish to share what they have received. Often they just don’t realize how narrow and skewed a vision they have been given.
Also, many times when one encounters these people the timing is inconvenient. Our minds are elsewhere, we have an appointment etc. It would be necessary to set up a meeting time with them to go over the issues, and frankly I don’t think they are interested in that kind of exchange.

Peace
James

 

[twinc]

JRKH - I can destroy your argument because I did not say all for how could I since this would include myself - so lets just stick with it and not gloss over the seriousness or make excuses just because there are just a few exceptions as you and I - twinc

 

[JRKH]

Snarky and unnecessary. If you have nothing constructive to post, then stop wasting your time.

I agree with Justaservant.
I have seen none of the negatives that you attribute to Lightbee’s posts.

Besides, it is far better, and more productive, to assume that another is sincere rather than insincere. Give answers in Charity so that they, and any others lurking, receive good information. Then let the Holy Spirit deal with their sincerity or lack thereof.

Peace
James

 

[rinnie]

At my RCIA class last night we were having a discussion about “the Bible and the Church”. For me, the Bible has always been very important as it is God’s word in written form. It has also been the means by which I have been led to the Catholic church.

I got the impression from the others talking (we have only 2 RCIA people, and last night 3 leaders, so we’re somewhat outnumbered) that those in the Catholic Church, particularly those in the church before Vatican II, do not have much interest in the Bible and distrust those who do read it regularly and study it intently.

I don’t know if that’s just the few people from last night, or if that is a normal Catholic stance. I would be very grateful to hear of the experiences of other Catholics - particularly “cradle Catholics” - to get a better understanding of the place of the Bible in the Catholic church.

;
Hi Lighbee and welcome. I think what you are seeing is they are not against you reading the bible at all, Its just that the bible was not the tool that they were used to learn the word of God. Let me explain.

See I was raised Catholic, In school it was like they took scripture and taught you that, scripture, they never taught us to memorize that scripture or scripture place like Matt 9:1. It was more like we are going to study one of the Apostles today. Then they would concentrate on how Matt became a Apostle, how he was called to do Gods work.

Then you were taught that gospel but not the same way you guys were. It would start out like who do you invite for dinner at your homes. Do you have people like yourself, or do you invite others who are different then yourself? Then it would stay that way for maybe a day or so. (you have to remember we had Religion class every day like math, science, etc.)

Then it would continue on to fasting when you fast at your home, then it explained how fasting was a time of mourning etc. How it would be inapproprite to fast at a time of joy.

Then when it was all said and done it would explain how Matt became a Apostle of Jesus and how Jesus did not just eat with the Apostles he also ate with the sinners and never refused anyone who wanted to be part of his family. Then it showed how the Pharisees fasted so much but the Apostles did not. And how Jesus was showing them he was with tt he Apostles now its not a time to mourn, but to celebrate.

But to make it shorter see what I am saying? Thats how we learned scripture. Then after it was all said and done we would get the TEST .

Then we would read the scripture and then we could understand alot of what we were reading. Like here would be a question.

Why did the pharisees question the Apostles for eating with sinners? The answer would be because eating with sinners to the Pharisees was considered (name removed by moderator)ure.

Just thing’s like that. But you learned LITTLE details about the gospel first, then you could understand so much more. Because when you just read it in the bible you miss the little things that you really need to know. That is how the Church and the School tied Oral Tradition into SS.

Then we have our bible study in Church. You will notice 3 readings and how they tie into eachother. Its just we were taught the bible but not using only a book. Then when the time came to read the book you understood what you were reading.

 

[twinc]

;
Hi Lighbee and welcome. I think what you are seeing is they are not against you reading the bible at all, Its just that the bible was not the tool that they were used to learn the word of God. Let me explain.

See I was raised Catholic, In school it was like they took scripture and taught you that, scripture, they never taught us to memorize that scripture or scripture place like Matt 9:1. It was more like we are going to study one of the Apostles today. Then they would concentrate on how Matt became a Apostle, how he was called to do Gods work.

Then you were taught that gospel but not the same way you guys were. It would start out like who do you invite for dinner at your homes. Do you have people like yourself, or do you invite others who are different then yourself? Then it would stay that way for maybe a day or so. (you have to remember we had Religion class every day like math, science, etc.)

Then it would continue on to fasting when you fast at your home, then it explained how fasting was a time of mourning etc. How it would be inapproprite to fast at a time of joy.

Then when it was all said and done it would explain how Matt became a Apostle of Jesus and how Jesus did not just eat with the Apostles he also ate with the sinners and never refused anyone who wanted to be part of his family. Then it showed how the Pharisees fasted so much but the Apostles did not. And how Jesus was showing them he was with tt he Apostles now its not a time to mourn, but to celebrate.

But to make it shorter see what I am saying? Thats how we learned scripture. Then after it was all said and done we would get the TEST .

Then we would read the scripture and then we could understand alot of what we were reading. Like here would be a question.

Why did the pharisees question the Apostles for eating with sinners? The answer would be because eating with sinners to the Pharisees was considered (name removed by moderator)ure.

Just thing’s like that. But you learned LITTLE details about the gospel first, then you could understand so much more. Because when you just read it in the bible you miss the little things that you really need to know. That is how the Church and the School tied Oral Tradition into SS.

Then we have our bible study in Church. You will notice 3 readings and how they tie into eachother. Its just we were taught the bible but not using only a book. Then when the time came to read the book you understood what you were reading.

of course this is not true or the whole truth.Just this week’s gospel reading re the good Samaritan.No priest would be willing to identify himself as the priest in this gospel.The priest would identify himself as the good Samaritan just as we all would also - none of us would be seen dead lying in a gutter - twinc

 

[rinnie]

of course this is not true or the whole truth.Just this week’s gospel reading re the good Samaritan.No priest would be willing to identify himself as the priest in this gospel.The priest would identify himself as the good Samaritan just as we all would also - none of us would be seen dead lying in a gutter - twinc

Funny you would say that our Priest DID! This is what he said. He said what was the Priest thinking? Was he thinking I have to get somewhere very important and know this Man can get help by the next person comming by? Did the Priest think this is a trick and they will ambush me and try to kill me? (they did that back then) Did he think that it was too late and I cannot help this man now, but can help another? Father said no one knows but God what the Priest was thinking.

Then to the next, He was a Jew, Did the Jew think the man was dead? If so according to their faith he could not touch the man. Was he afraid that they ambushed this man and if I stop they will get me too? Again who knows what the Man thought only God. Or was he just so scared he kept walking. Only God knows for sure.

Then of course we know how the story ended. But the point also was not only should we do what is right, and what our heart tells us, We can never judge others either, No one knows for sure what was on the others mind.

 

[twinc]

Funny you would say that our Priest DID! This is what he said. He said what was the Priest thinking? Was he thinking I have to get somewhere very important and know this Man can get help by the next person comming by? Did the Priest think this is a trick and they will ambush me and try to kill me? (they did that back then) Did he think that it was too late and I cannot help this man now, but can help another? Father said no one knows but God what the Priest was thinking.

Then to the next, He was a Jew, Did the Jew think the man was dead? If so according to their faith he could not touch the man. Was he afraid that they ambushed this man and if I stop they will get me too? Again who knows what the Man thought only God. Or was he just so scared he kept walking. Only God knows for sure.

Then of course we know how the story ended. But the point also was not only should we do what is right, and what our heart tells us, We can never judge others either, No one knows for sure what was on the others mind.

so shall we take it as suggested by Christ that your priest is not your neighbour or you his and neither of you are good samaratians or are you both lying in the gutter needing someone to help you - twinc

 

[crazzeto]

At my RCIA class last night we were having a discussion about “the Bible and the Church”. For me, the Bible has always been very important as it is God’s word in written form. It has also been the means by which I have been led to the Catholic church.

I got the impression from the others talking (we have only 2 RCIA people, and last night 3 leaders, so we’re somewhat outnumbered) that those in the Catholic Church, particularly those in the church before Vatican II, do not have much interest in the Bible and distrust those who do read it regularly and study it intently.

I don’t know if that’s just the few people from last night, or if that is a normal Catholic stance. I would be very grateful to hear of the experiences of other Catholics - particularly “cradle Catholics” - to get a better understanding of the place of the Bible in the Catholic church.

Unfortunetly it would seem the older generation was mistaught many of the things which you discuss here. I’ve talked about it with several folks, it just seems to be a sad truth. Unfortunetly this played greatly in many peoples sloth in their faith, frankly a lot of people “like just going to church on sunday and getting it over with, no bible study or homework”. It’s sad, very sad.

Fortunetly though, we seem to be in a period of a great awakening. Like any awakening it’s happening slowly, but steadily. Allow me to exhort you to share your passion for scripture, and how it lead you to the catholic church with anyone that will listen. You don’t have to engage in apologetics per se, and I would actually discourage you to do so until you feel truely confident in your “new skin” as it were. But just share your passion for scripture, people will listen.

God bless,

 

[rinnie]

so shall we take it as suggested by Christ that your priest is not your neighbour or you his and neither of you are good samaratians or are you both lying in the gutter needing someone to help you - twinc

Huh? Are you saying what you got out of this scripture Christ telling us our Priest is not our neighbor

 

[twinc]

Huh? Are you saying what you got out of this scripture Christ telling us our Priest is not our neighbor

it seemed to me that these were the excuses the priest was making for not helping and being a good samaratin rather than a not so good priest - twinc

 

[rinnie]

it seemed to me that these were the excuses the priest was making for not helping and being a good samaratin rather than a not so good priest - twinc

Or was it a way for the Priest to make his point of the story. And could his point have been that what is GOD asking of YOU?

Is the story to say that the Priest should have stopped? Is the point that the Jew should have stopped? Or was Jesus saying something totally different to the man. Was he telling him what is God asking of you. Now do you see what Father was saying??

 

[JRKH]

Or was it a way for the Priest to make his point of the story. And could his point have been that what is GOD asking of YOU?

Is the story to say that the Priest should have stopped? Is the point that the Jew should have stopped? Or was Jesus saying something totally different to the man. Was he telling him what is God asking of you. Now do you see what Father was saying??

This line seems to be off the topic of this thread. Might I suggest starting another thread in Sacred Scripture to discuss this?

Peace
James

 

[rinnie]

This line seems to be off the topic of this thread. Might I suggest starting another thread in Sacred Scripture to discuss this?

Peace
James

Maybe but I don’'t think so. Let me explain. I used this as an example to show that the bible is not all we have to learn about God. I was going to get back to that shortly to get back to the topic and show the point I was trying to make.

My point is that the Church is our teacher and the Priest is our teacher, and its him taking the scripure every Sunday and finding a way to bring it into our lives is one of our ways of Bible Study. We learn the bible many ways in the RCC its just what we are used to.

In the Protestant faith it is the bible only as the sole words of God. In the Catholic Church it is the Church teaching us, not us studying the bible only.

So while Protestants are lost without the bible, Catholics don’t really need it to center our faith. Our faith is Jesus Christ in the Church Alive. I hope I have helped her in some way understand why she is not getting the response she may want.

 

[UnworthyApostle]

As a former Protestant, the Bible is the very breath of my spirituality. It is the very principle upon which I live my life and faith. However, I do not believe in Sola Scriptura, and I see the necessity of having tradition to render correct interpretations of Sacred Scripture. It is the Bible and Sola Scriptura ironically that led me to the Catholic Faith.

 

[rinnie]

As a former Protestant, the Bible is the very breath of my spirituality. It is the very principle upon which I live my life and faith. However, I do not believe in Sola Scriptura, and I see the necessity of having tradition to render correct interpretations of Sacred Scripture. It is the Bible and Sola Scriptura ironically that led me to the Catholic Faith.

Thats pretty much what I was trying to say. Isn’t that awesome though, How it was the bible the one thing that the RCC does not, dare I say need that brought you to the faith.

Don’t get me wrong its great to read the word, and connect with God in that way. But it is not necessary for our Salvation. It is the CC that we need for our Salvation. It was by the Love for us of Christ and suffering on the Cross that made the CC possible. And because of it we all can learn what he has left for us to know. And by the way welcome

 

[UnworthyApostle]

The implications of the following sunk in along with many other Catholic sounding verses.

And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it… Mattthew 16:18 (The Papacy)

Therefore whosoever shall eat this bread, or drink the chalice of the Lord unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and of the blood of the Lord.For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh judgment to himself, not discerning the body of the Lord.
1 Cor. 11:27,29 (The Eucharist)

And the apostles and ancients assembled to consider of this matter…For it hath seemed good to the Holy Ghost and to us, to lay no further burden upon you than these necessary things. Acts 15:6,28 (Ecuinemical Councils)

I did what my pastor told me get a bible, read it, and pray. I did not let any preconcieved notions affect my reading of the bible, well the attempt to show the Catholic Church was FALSE could have been a pre-concieved notion as I was very anti-Catholic, and let the spirit speak to me. After I saw how Catholic the biblical church was, i read the church fathers in order to see what they belived, and that was a whopper!

 

[Lightbee]

The implications of the following sunk in along with many other Catholic sounding verses.

And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it… Mattthew 16:18 (The Papacy)

That was the same verse that was the clincher for me too!!!

 

[StillWondering]

I’m a cradle Catholic and when I was little I had a very good children’s bible. It wasn’t a paraphrased bible, but one that didn’t have all the books (mainly the first five books, kings, and some other stories) and only excepts of the four Gospels put together into a single Gospel. Not for adults of course, but it was amazing to me as a child. Then I bought my old copy of the New American Bible when I was taking first communion as a child. I couldn’t understand most of it, and I didn’t go to any bible study but I still have my first bible next to me right now.

 

[JRKH]

Originally Posted by UnworthyApostle
The implications of the following sunk in along with many other Catholic sounding verses.

Added to this verse is Mt 18:15-18.
15 "If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother. 16 "But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you, so that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every fact may be confirmed. 17 "If he refuses to listen to them, **tell it to the church **(Singular); and if he refuses to listen even to the church let him be as a tax collector. 18 "Truly I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven.
What struck me on this was that, these two places (Mt 16 and Mt 18) are the only times “Church” is mentioned in the Gospels and both times it is Jesus speaking and both times it is in connection with granting the authority to Bind and Loose - Whatever.

Powerful Stuff.

Peace
James