What is the difference between Roman Catholic and Byzantine Catholic?

[babochka]

You can’t miss Mass on Sunday, nor should one go to a non-Catholic service unless there’s a serious reason (e.g. family funeral).

This is an old discipline, which is no longer in effect.

The original post-Vatican II Ecumenical directory said this:

N. 50 Catholics may be allowed to attend Orthodox liturgical services if they have reasonable grounds, e.e. arising out of public office or function, blood relationships, friendships, desire to be better informed, etc. In such cased there is nothing against their taking part in the common responses, hymns, and actions of the Church in which they are guests. Receiving Holy Communion, however, will be governed by what is laid down above , nr 42 and 44.
N. 47 A Catholic who occasionally, for reasons set out below, attends the Holy Liturgy (Mass) on a Sunday or holy day of obligation in an Orthodox Church is not then bound to assist at Mass in a Catholic Church, It is likewise a good thing if on such days Catholics who for just reasons cannot go to Mass in their won Church, attend the Holy Liturgy of their separated Oriental brethren, if this is possible.

The directory was updated in 1993 and no longer allows Catholics to fulfill their Sunday obligation in an Orthodox Church, but the justifiable reasons for attending an Orthodox liturgy remain the same.

 

[Margaret_Ann]

The directory was updated in 1993 and no longer allows Catholics to fulfill their Sunday obligation in an Orthodox Church

One couldn’t fulfill their Sunday obligation in a non-Catholic church anyway.

Also, were you referring to the Balamand statement?

Signing off now. Good night!

 

[dochawk]

After the services, I talked to the deacon and asked him: Since they have the same Liturgy as we do, why do they (the Orthodox) not believe in the Immaculate Conception? He couldn’t answer me.

That’s surprising, as the answer is trivially easy and well known.

The Orthodox don’t “not believe in the Immaculate Conception”, but rather they a) object to the Roman church purporting to unilaterally declare a dogma, and b) scratch their heads at the very notion of it being a dogma, as they never adopted the Augustinian notion (which is not dogma even in the RCC) of original sin, with the individual taint that the IC holds that Mary didn’t have.

As such, from that perspective, it’s kind of like making “2+2=4” a dogma. They don’t dispute that, either, but . . .

There is no eastern notion, EO or EC, that she was stained–how often do we sing, “Hail o maiden, ever pure!” and the like?

 

[ziapueblo]

To the best of my knowledge, one must avoid communio in sacris when attending non-Catholic services for a serious reason.

Here is a quote from the Second Vatican Councils DECREE ON ECUMENISM UNITATIS REDINTEGRATIO:

“These Churches, although separated from us, possess true sacraments, above all by apostolic succession, the priesthood and the Eucharist, whereby they are linked with us in closest intimacy. Therefore some worship in common (communicatio in sacris), given suitable circumstances and the approval of Church authority, is not only possible but to be encouraged.”

I’m not sure if “a serious” reason and “given suitable circumstances” are the same thing. I could be wrong. I know of a Byzantine Catholic family who lives in a part of the country where there are no Byzantine Catholic parishes but are given permission to commune at an Orthodox parish because they do not wish to leave their spiritual tradition and join a RC parish. I’m not sure how common this is, maybe @edward_george1 knows if this happens frequently.

The priest will not give communion to a non-Orthodox person.

Most Greek Orthodox priests probably would not commune a Catholic, especially a RC, unless under special circumstances. I believe this is due to the fact that there is a very, very small Greek Byzantine Catholic community compared to Antiochians and Melkites, which I hear, there is often intercommunion between the two Churches (less nowadays in this country due to the number of Protestant converts who have become priests and have baggage when it comes to Catholics, so I hear anyway).

. . . I felt a spiritual coldness there. It was not a physical coldness (I was warm) but a spiritual coldness which I could not describe.

I’m sorry to hear this. As I can only speak for my parish and the local OCA, we are very warm and open to visitors. Every fall we have a “discovering Orthodoxy” class which is 16 weeks long (once a week). It is very well attended, not only By parishioners but RC, BC, Protestants from various denominations and not Christians. It’s very fun and informative. It’s a pot luck style class in the evening. After the 16 weeks everyone goes on their merry way happy to have learned something and having met new people.

ZP

 

[LovelyLadybug]

So, if I wanted to attend an Orthodox Church Service, I wouldn’t have to go to Sunday Mass? It would count as my Sunday requirement? (I’ de much rather go to a Catholic service. I’m just wondering.

 

[edward_george1]

That is not what I said. I said you should still go to Mass if you attend an Orthodox liturgy.

 

[LovelyLadybug]

I don’t go to an Orthodox Church. I go to a Catholic One. I was just wondering if it would be ok to attend one if I wanted to (I don’t want to)

 

[Phillip_Rolfes]

Catholics are free (and even encouraged) to attend Sunday Divine Liturgy at an Orthodox parish. However, they would also be expected to attend Mass at a Catholic Church in order to fulfill their “Sunday Obligation” (a concept that’s foreign to the Eastern Catholic and Orthodox tradition, but… ).

 

[babochka]

babochka:

The directory was updated in 1993 and no longer allows Catholics to fulfill their Sunday obligation in an Orthodox Church

One couldn’t fulfill their Sunday obligation in a non-Catholic church anyway.

Also, were you referring to the Balamand statement?

From 1967 to 1993, under guidance from the Vatican, it was officially and explicitly allowed.

The quotes I gave were from the 1967 Ecumenical Directory, well before the Balamand statement. It was revised in 1993 and the provision allowing one to fulfill one’s obligation to at an Orthodox Divine Liturgy did not appear in the revised version. It is my understanding that this was done in response to Orthodox objections.

The wording regarding acceptable reasons to attend an Orthodox service is exactly the same in the 1993 directory as it is in the 1967 directory.

Here’s the text of the 1967 directory. Full text of "Directory for the application of the decisions of the Second Ecumenical Council of the Vatican concerning ecumenical matters, May 14, 1967, Part I"

The relevant sections are numbers 47 and 50.

My parents taught me that we shouldn’t go to non-Catholic services unless it was a wedding/funeral and even then we should not participate in the services.

It seems as if the practice in your family was stricter than the Church requires, which is fine. We are to avoid indifferentism, which is a real danger. You have definitely done that. I wonder if the particular perspective in your family has to do with the historical, political and social situation with the Church in Ukraine?

Example #2: My late Russian Orthodox aunt was very devout . She had a nephew on her side of the family who served at the cathedral in Moscow. She would never participate in a Catholic service. She would probably pronounce an anathema sit against any Orthodox prelate who did so.

Example #3: When my father died, my Russian Orthodox cousins came to Dad’s funeral Liturgy but they did not participate. They didn’t even sing “eternal memory” for him.

Honestly, these stories make me sad.

 

[Vico]

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

 

[Margaret_Ann]

Honestly, these stories make me sad.

It’s not only sad but heartbreaking. My cousins and I can exchange Nativity/Paschal cards but can’t pray together. If Pope Francis were to personally order me to pray with my cousins (won’t happen, I guarantee), I would never be able to obey due to the simple fact that my RO cousins would never join me in prayer.

We can do everything except pray together.

 

[Vico]

… It was revised in 1993 and the provision allowing one to fulfill one’s obligation to at an Orthodox Divine Liturgy did not appear in the revised version. It is my understanding that this was done in response to Orthodox objections. …

It also had to be updated because of the 1990 Codex Canonum Ecclesiarum Orientalium (Code of Canons of the Oriental Churches).

 

[KBS]

Thankyou for asking this!
I am learning many new things today!

 

[TheLittleLady]

I always keep this oldie but goodie bookmarked:

The Other Catholics: A Short Guide to the Eastern Catholic Churches - Crisis Magazine

 

[AlNg]

Catholics are free (and even encouraged) to attend Sunday Divine Liturgy at an Orthodox parish. However, they would also be expected to attend Mass at a Catholic Church in order to fulfill their “Sunday Obligation”

Not what I was told by an Eastern Catholic bishop and a Roman Catholic priest.

 

[Phillip_Rolfes]

So you’re saying that the Eastern Catholic bishop and the Roman Catholic priest told you that you wouldn’t have to fulfill your “Sunday Obligation” at a Catholic Mass/Divine Liturgy? Or are you saying that they said you wouldn’t be permitted to attend an Orthodox Divine Liturgy? I just want to make sure I correctly understand you.

For the record, I’ve been told by a number of priests, laity, and “experts” that Catholics can attend Orthodox Divine Liturgy to fulfill their “Sunday Obligation” under the right circumstances (cf. some of the posts above). I’ve attended a couple of Greek Orthodox parishes for that very reason. But naturally I didn’t present myself for Holy Communion.

 

[AlNg]

So you’re saying that the Eastern Catholic bishop and the Roman Catholic priest told you that you wouldn’t have to fulfill your “Sunday Obligation” at a Catholic Mass/Divine Liturgy?

That was my understanding. But it may have only applied to a specific situation which we were talking about. Or that the obligation was perhaps partially satisfied in some sense. The EC clergyman was not a bishop at that time, but became such later on.

 

[DeniseNY]

Ya’ll are the other ones; not us!

Just joking!

 

[OrbisNonSufficit]

Ya’ll are the other ones; not us!

Just joking!

On a side note, it would be interesting if far into the future, there would be articles about “other” Catholics explaining Latin Rite to Eastern Catholics, pointing out how different Latin Liturgies are and how we call it “Mass”, or perhaps even pointing to the fact that Pope, on whom rests primacy over entire Church, is actually direct Patriarch of those Latins

Probably won’t happen as Latin Rite will always be known thanks to office of Papacy and history, even if we become minority somehow… but still it’s a really funny thought.

 

[tafan2]

Yes and no.

MY first time, I was stunned by how much it had in common while being so different.

Could you point me to a good overview of the Byzantine liturgy, without having to go through a whole missal?