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CMatt25
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From your post it seems more than teens were drawn. And isn’t that the whole point? To draw people closer to Christ? I’m far removed from being teen. But lively upbeat music certainly nourishes my faith and moves my soul far more than traditional. So my opinion? I like the option.
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Whitacre_Girl
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I offer no rage. OnlyYeah…this thread is going to explode in a hurry. Orchids, it’s not rocket science; if people have issues with the charismatic movement (and with the OF as a whole) the odds are high they will not like the Life Teen Mass
Anyway, I’m 28 years of age and I’ve been involved (ie; volunteering) in the program for the past six years or so, which makes me biased. Currently I run the R.C.I.T. program as well, which is good times (we have two girls getting confirmed on Pentecost Sunday).
I’ve got zero issues with the Life Teen Mass, and that includes the music (provided that it is mixed well and the volume is at an acceptable level). Of course, I’m in the music ministry as well so that’s even more bias.
I’m ducking out of this now before the RAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGEEEEEEEEE comes in.
and :clapping:It’s refreshing to see someone who understands that youth need to worship with music that is relevant to THEM! Rather than what is relevant to their PARENTS who, convieniently enough, make up most of the parish population.
Just remember the outcries when gregorian chant was introduced, or when those darn satanic organs were brought in to the churches. (I am NOT making this up, take a simple music history course).
It’s good that the church is finally starting to pay attention to the spiritual needs of youth, rather than ignoring them, belittling them, and driving them away. Wanna kill a church? Drive out the youth with a misplaced sense on piety and self-righteousness in music choices. Respect people’s preferences on what constitutes “holy music” for crying out loud!!!
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Catholicdude92
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I’m 18 and I don’t like it. It’s nearly impossible to pray with all the noise. Funny, I went to easter mass at our cathedral this year. They had an excellent choir full brass and the organ. People participated. People sang. I feelt close to God. It sort of made me think…WHY THE HECK DID WE SWITCH TO GUITARS? And i was not raised in a uber traditional parish…we didn’t have organ music normally. I’m young. Where did this rich tradition of music go? Why no reverence?
With that said I think some parts of the Lifeteen program are just fine.
Oh and I’m going to get killed for this one. Why to Choirs like to be up front? I think it honestly gets to their egos. My mom did it for years and now she won’t go to a lifeteen mass anymore. She told me I does get to become like a “show” or “concert” Even when they pray before mass. Even when the intentions were good. It gets to you. Why no choir lofts now?
With that said I think some parts of the Lifeteen program are just fine.
Oh and I’m going to get killed for this one. Why to Choirs like to be up front? I think it honestly gets to their egos. My mom did it for years and now she won’t go to a lifeteen mass anymore. She told me I does get to become like a “show” or “concert” Even when they pray before mass. Even when the intentions were good. It gets to you. Why no choir lofts now?
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Whitacre_Girl
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No, it’s not there for anyone’s entertainment, but why do YOU go to a mass with organ music. Do you enjoy it? Are you uplifted by it? Can you imagine that some people are not? There are people out there for find a guitar far more spiritually uplifting than an organ. It’s called preference and culture. Not everyone thinks that same or feels the same as everyone else, this is the beauty of human diversity. I personally am diverse, thanks to an affinity for music. Organ music, guitar, heck even a PAN flute when played properly can show me Jesus. Can you not see Jesus in a guitar? That’s your preference. Just as some people can’t see Jesus in an organ. EVERYONE is different. It’s not about “those darn kids just wanting to be entertained!” it’s about “Those kids who can’t find relevance in a church that considers their preferences evil.”
Personally, I think it’s sick that youth have lost so much relevance to the gospel because they have been ignored so much that they are the MOST under represented demographic in the church. If that isn’t a sign that something has gone horrifically wrong, I don’t know what is. But, if our piety costs us the future through the youth, I guess it’s worth it to keep the faithful few.
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Whitacre_Girl
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- Organs are your preference. I love organs. I also love guitars. I have many preferences. Some people do not. Some people see guitars like you see organs. “Reverence” when we are talking about musical styles are a personal preference, and it’s really not fair to judge people as “irreverent” because they experience closeness to God through drums and guitars.
- Choirs are typically up front not to feed some ego, or show themselves off. We (yes, I am in a choir) have to stand in certain areas so everyone can HEAR, or because of the accoustics of the building. There are some churches built to have choirs in the back, the sides, or in a loft. It’s about accoustics, not egos. Unless someone wants to give tons of money to build new churches with the"accoustic sweet spot" in the back, it’ll just have to remain that way.
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japscarousel
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I’m 18 and I don’t know it.
But in synch with the discussion, i think this kind of Mass includes loud music? If that’s the case, I won’t like it.
Yes, God loves music but we must be responsible where to use certain kinds/genre of music. We don’t rap/rock on solemn occasions, and Holy Mass is a special and solemn occasion. You can sing your lungs out loud somewhere else but not on a Holy Mass. I believe Holy Mass demands contemplation and rock music will never make a person contemplate in the silence of a church-goer’s heart.
Yes youth, like me, would like a music known to us. That’s very true. But don’t place it during the Holy Mass. Place it somewhere else, on prayer meetings etc. etc.
In the Philippines, we use the guitar. Not the electric one, but the acoustic (whatever we call that) guitar. It’s part of our culture. During the Palm Sunday, the choir played vernacular religious songs with guitar and it is amazing. The choir was all-male, they’re quite old and they sounded like ‘kundiman’ (local and traditional love songs. So usually the song is sweet). BTW, We Filipinos have traditional religious songs called ‘dalit (traditional song of praise to God in Spanish or in vernacular)’.
I am troubled with the original meaning of the phrase ‘You rock!’
But in synch with the discussion, i think this kind of Mass includes loud music? If that’s the case, I won’t like it.
Yes, God loves music but we must be responsible where to use certain kinds/genre of music. We don’t rap/rock on solemn occasions, and Holy Mass is a special and solemn occasion. You can sing your lungs out loud somewhere else but not on a Holy Mass. I believe Holy Mass demands contemplation and rock music will never make a person contemplate in the silence of a church-goer’s heart.
Yes youth, like me, would like a music known to us. That’s very true. But don’t place it during the Holy Mass. Place it somewhere else, on prayer meetings etc. etc.
In the Philippines, we use the guitar. Not the electric one, but the acoustic (whatever we call that) guitar. It’s part of our culture. During the Palm Sunday, the choir played vernacular religious songs with guitar and it is amazing. The choir was all-male, they’re quite old and they sounded like ‘kundiman’ (local and traditional love songs. So usually the song is sweet). BTW, We Filipinos have traditional religious songs called ‘dalit (traditional song of praise to God in Spanish or in vernacular)’.
I am troubled with the original meaning of the phrase ‘You rock!’
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Erin_Anne
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Actually instruments of any kind are very, very seldom used in our Parish’s Masses. I don’t find it lacking at all personally.
Kids CAN find relevance in the Church the way it is. What they need are good Teachers of the Faith.
The Gospel is relevant to all. Young and Old. When the Priest speaks the words, he is speaking to everyone. When the Holy See speaks, it speaks to everyone as well - all Catholics. The Youth are not ignored, they’re part of ALL that the Church is. They need to understand that.
E.A.
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Catholicdude92
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- It is NOT ONLY a matter of preference IMHO They are building churches now that are just ugly on purpose. Read the book “Ugly as Sin” It’s actually really interesting. When we say it only is about tastes we border relativism. I also listen to rock music. I love rock concerts. I don’t listen to Mozart in the car driving. I’m not even a hard core “traditionalist” I’m young. I grew up on this stuff you seem to love so much. Maybe if you heard it done well you might change your opinon
And at our Cathedral they have a choir loft. But guess what? The teen mass is done up front. The point is not to connect with the chior/ band but with Christ. Nearly all new churches are built (that I have seen) with the intention of having the choir up front. I really think being up front will work your ego. Sorry to be so blunt about that. I’ve done preforming arts (dance and mucic) all of high school. It is REALLY easy for it to become “a show”
(whew…rant over) I don’t mean all this personally so please don’t get upset. I’m young. I’m part of the “future of the church” I’m not the only young person to feel like this. Please don’t ignore us. Please don’t brush us aside as a bunch of old people who can’t stand a change because I wasn’t even alive when this stuff was changed.
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franklinf
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Well put
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franklinf
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None of these passages are even remotely relevant. We are talking about the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. These passages are 1) OT 2) Not referring to Mass. Time and place for everything.
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franklinf
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The music isn’t the primary issue with Life Teen Masses. It is the wrong focus. The Masses, by definition, are focused on “teens” NOT God. That is, quite obviously, wrong. The Mass speaks for itself. There have been numerous saints pre V2.
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Catholicdude92
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agreed. but that is no excuse for low quality music or irreverence. There was a point when they only had people receive the blessed sacrament under the species of bread because there was a heresy that you had to receive under both species to receive Jesus. Right now all of the irreverent masses (that I have been to) with funky liturgical stuff going on play guitar music. I think we need at this point in time to put restrictions on what music can be used at mass until it improves. Maybe not say “no guitars at all” but restrict what sort of music is allowed I mean…What’s with all the non catholic music at mass? “Lord of the Dance” is a Shaker song. What happed to Ave Maria?
I’m just a bummed out teen who feels like he’s missing out.
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stevusmagnus
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stevusmagnus
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stevusmagnus
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From former Life-Teen Music leader who left the Catholic Church…
Commenting on Cardinal Schonborn’s Balloon/ Disco Mass.
seizethedei.blogspot.com/2008/11/see-with-balloons-you-get-low-and-high.html
Commenting on Cardinal Schonborn’s Balloon/ Disco Mass.
seizethedei.blogspot.com/2008/11/see-with-balloons-you-get-low-and-high.html
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stevusmagnus
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stevusmagnus
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michaeldaniels
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Outside of The Eucharist, I abhor its format and the liberal inventions found in it
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stevusmagnus
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Catholicdude92, you are not far from the Truth.
You have been blessed with a true sensus catholicus from God telling you these things are wrong. It is a grace. Don’t let it pass.
Keep searching.
Compare…
**Traditional Latin Mass **
**Atmosphere of Reverent Worship: **
Peaceful, otherworldly atmosphere. Emphasis on individual “lifting his heart & mind to God.” Members of congregation direct attention to God, not each other.
**Profound Reverence for Real Presence: **
Sixteen genuflections. The hands of the priest alone touch the consecrated host. Communion given only on tongue.
**Fidelity to Catholic Doctrine: **
Over the course of a year, presents all facets of Catholic doctrine.
**Antiquity: **
Bulk of Sunday prayers & their arrangement goes back at least to 300s and 400s AD. Canon essentially the same since St. Ambrose (d. 397).
**Stability: **
Everything regulated by precise laws to protect purity of worship and doctrine.
**Priest is Sacrificer: **
Priest faces tabernacle, cross and altar (symbolically toward God). Priest performs all the actions & recites all the prayers of the Mass.
With …
**Modern Mass at your parish **
Social, Classroom, Entertainment Atmosphere:
Constant standing, sitting, amplified noise; atmosphere like a public meeting. Emphasis on “instruction.” Socializing in church before & after service, and handshaking during.
**Indifference, Irreverence towards Real Presence: **
Only three genuflections required. Lay men & women distribute communion. Communion given in hand - a practice protestants introduced to deny Christ’s Real Presence.
**Systematic Omission of Catholic Doctrines: **
New prayers systematically omit references to hell, judgement, punishment for sin, merits of the Saints, the one true Church, the souls of the departed & miracles.
Novelty:
Old Sunday prayers omitted or stripped of doctrines, and rearranged in 1960s. Only 17% of old prayers remain. Chunks of ancient Canon are now “optional.” The words of consecration, Christ’s own words “For you and for many” are changed. Three substitute “Canons” invented & introduced in 1960s, and still more invented later.
Constant Change:
Options, options and more options. Individual priests & parish liturgy committees get to pick, drop or invent texts to push what they think people should believe.
**Priest is “President”, Actor: **
Priest faces people instead of symbolically “toward God.” Priest sits off to side. His functions given away to lay men and women.
You have been blessed with a true sensus catholicus from God telling you these things are wrong. It is a grace. Don’t let it pass.
Keep searching.
Compare…
**Traditional Latin Mass **
**Atmosphere of Reverent Worship: **
Peaceful, otherworldly atmosphere. Emphasis on individual “lifting his heart & mind to God.” Members of congregation direct attention to God, not each other.
**Profound Reverence for Real Presence: **
Sixteen genuflections. The hands of the priest alone touch the consecrated host. Communion given only on tongue.
**Fidelity to Catholic Doctrine: **
Over the course of a year, presents all facets of Catholic doctrine.
**Antiquity: **
Bulk of Sunday prayers & their arrangement goes back at least to 300s and 400s AD. Canon essentially the same since St. Ambrose (d. 397).
**Stability: **
Everything regulated by precise laws to protect purity of worship and doctrine.
**Priest is Sacrificer: **
Priest faces tabernacle, cross and altar (symbolically toward God). Priest performs all the actions & recites all the prayers of the Mass.
With …
**Modern Mass at your parish **
Social, Classroom, Entertainment Atmosphere:
Constant standing, sitting, amplified noise; atmosphere like a public meeting. Emphasis on “instruction.” Socializing in church before & after service, and handshaking during.
**Indifference, Irreverence towards Real Presence: **
Only three genuflections required. Lay men & women distribute communion. Communion given in hand - a practice protestants introduced to deny Christ’s Real Presence.
**Systematic Omission of Catholic Doctrines: **
New prayers systematically omit references to hell, judgement, punishment for sin, merits of the Saints, the one true Church, the souls of the departed & miracles.
Novelty:
Old Sunday prayers omitted or stripped of doctrines, and rearranged in 1960s. Only 17% of old prayers remain. Chunks of ancient Canon are now “optional.” The words of consecration, Christ’s own words “For you and for many” are changed. Three substitute “Canons” invented & introduced in 1960s, and still more invented later.
Constant Change:
Options, options and more options. Individual priests & parish liturgy committees get to pick, drop or invent texts to push what they think people should believe.
**Priest is “President”, Actor: **
Priest faces people instead of symbolically “toward God.” Priest sits off to side. His functions given away to lay men and women.
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