What Kind Of Church Is This?

[Illuminatrix]

And the Bible thumping type of churches aren’t my style. At all.

Is the “right” church the one that fits your style? Don’t forget that Bible you mock others for thumping is Sacred Scripture and the bedrock of our faith.

I couldn’t deal with that and I couldn’t sit for a service where just the sermon alone was 40 -50 minutes long.

Now just imagine what eternity in Heaven will be like.

In my email, I did ask if they recognize infant Baptism of former Catholics or if they must be re-Baptised,
And if members are free to believe in evolution of the world and body or if they must believe in creationism?

You seem really passionate about your pro-evolution stance, even to the point of it being a deal-breaker in relation to your belief in what church teaches the (or your) truth. Are you a biologist or do you just watch a lot of the Discovery channel or something?

I just really can’t understand how people can believe in a young earth when we have modern science, fossils and carbon dating. I just don’t get it.

It’s simple. Let me show you the vicious circularity of your reasoning: I believe evolution is true. > I am a product of evolution. > My beliefs are programmed by my brain to help me survive, including my belief that evolution is true (and every “fact” I assume that correlates with reality as “evidence” for my position).

Do you see the problem?

[T]hose sermons are as long as an entire Catholic Mass and I can’t listen to anyone drone on that long.

The entire Epistle to the Hebrews is a sermon. Have you read it? I can only imagine you in the original audience, cheek in palm, sighing every three minutes, and asking what time lunch is going to be served.

I wonder how many people who go to their churches know that their pastor was ordained online?

Do you think most Catholics have any idea what it takes to become a priest? No, but they’re (at least some) certainly eager to run over and offer their contradictory and often ill-informed opinions to the priest on the homily immediately after Mass.

Probably not very many. What does a priest have to do to become a priest? I do know that it involves much more than taking an online course.

As one currently pursuing a vocation to the priesthood, I can tell you that first you have to be a Confirmed Catholic (a process I’m currently undergoing). Then you have to have attained an undergraduate degree, usually in philosophy (also currently doing), plus an additional two or more years in seminary for your graduate degree in theology, just to name a few things.

 

[Illuminatrix]

I’ve tried so many things to deal with the OCD.

It’s just a byproduct of evolution, remember? It’s an automated, offline, risk-avoidance process that developed in the species overtime as a survival mechanism. Or it could be explained by some pesky theology we probably shouldn’t get into for the sake of avoiding any controversy.

 

[poche]

“Non Denominational” is a religion.

 

[TheLittleLady]

Some Dioceses have the Calix Society for those dealing with addiction as well as a St Dymphna Society for those with various mental/emotional conditions. I hope you can find support for your needs in a group who supports your faith!

 

[Wannano]

Hope1960:

And the Bible thumping type of churches aren’t my style. At all.

Is the “right” church the one that fits your style? Don’t forget that Bible you mock others for thumping is Sacred Scripture and the bedrock of our faith.

I couldn’t deal with that and I couldn’t sit for a service where just the sermon alone was 40 -50 minutes long.

Now just imagine what eternity in Heaven will be like.

In my email, I did ask if they recognize infant Baptism of former Catholics or if they must be re-Baptised,
And if members are free to believe in evolution of the world and body or if they must believe in creationism?

You seem really passionate about your pro-evolution stance, even to the point of it being a deal-breaker in relation to your belief in what church teaches the (or your) truth. Are you a biologist or do you just watch a lot of the Discovery channel or something?

I just really can’t understand how people can believe in a young earth when we have modern science, fossils and carbon dating. I just don’t get it.

It’s simple. Let me show you the vicious circularity of your reasoning: I believe evolution is true. > I am a product of evolution. > My beliefs are programmed by my brain to help me survive, including my belief that evolution is true (and every “fact” I assume that correlates with reality as “evidence” for my position).

Do you see the problem?

[T]hose sermons are as long as an entire Catholic Mass and I can’t listen to anyone drone on that long.

The entire Epistle to the Hebrews is a sermon. Have you read it? I can only imagine you in the original audience, cheek in palm, sighing every three minutes, and asking what time lunch is going to be served.

I wonder how many people who go to their churches know that their pastor was ordained online?

Do you think most Catholics have any idea what it takes to become a priest? No, but they’re (at least some) certainly eager to run over and offer their contradictory and often ill-informed opinions to the priest on the homily immediately after Mass.

Probably not very many. What does a priest have to do to become a priest? I do know that it involves much more than taking an online course.

As one currently pursuing a vocation to the priesthood, I can tell you that first you have to be a Confirmed Catholic (a process I’m currently undergoing). Then you have to have attained an undergraduate degree, usually in philosophy (also currently doing), plus an additional two or more years in seminary for your graduate degree in theology, just to name a few things.

Thank you for addressing the superficial. You will very likely make a good priest.

 

[Hope1960]

You seem really passionate about your pro-evolution stance, even to the point of it being a deal-breaker in relation to your belief in what church teaches the (or your) truth. Are you a biologist or do you just watch a lot of the Discovery channel or something?

Just went to school and have read about it, but I did talk to one of the pastors at this church on the phone today. He talked a little about micro evolution vs macro evolution and it gave me something to think about, regardless of whether I remain in the Catholic Church or if I eventually convert to this one.

 

[Hope1960]

It’s simple. Let me show you the vicious circularity of your reasoning: I believe evolution is true. > I am a product of evolution. > My beliefs are programmed by my brain to help me survive, including my belief that evolution is true (and every “fact” I assume that correlates with reality as “evidence” for my position).

Do you see the problem?

Not really. Please explain further.

 

[Hope1960]

This morning I spoke on the phone with one of the pastors at this church I’ve been posting about. They don’t require re-baptism for Catholics who convert although many do, by immersion, because that’s the way it’s done in the Bible.

They are ok with, and the pastor himself, believes in micro evolution, but not macro evolution.

The way he described their church still interests me so I might check it out this weekend, or I may chicken out.

 

[Illuminatrix]

They are ok with, and the pastor himself, believes in micro evolution, but not macro evolution.

Literally no one denies “microevolution”, the idea that variety or speciation occurs through processes like genetic mutation or drift, hybridization, and/or natural selection.

The disagreement comes in when people start claiming that modern human beings share a common ancestor with the other apes.

 

[Hope1960]

The disagreement comes in when people start claiming that modern human beings share a common ancestor with the other apes.

Do you believe it’s possible modern human beings share a common ancestor with the other apes?

If not, how do you explain the charts we’ve all seen that shows pictures of ape going from being to another, until it reaches modern man?

How do you explain the fossils, carbon dating etc. that point to macro-evolution?

This pastor told me that even Darwin, himself, had some difficulty explaining parts of his own theory. Is that true?

 

[Illuminatrix]

Not really. Please explain further.

He was quoting me. This is the problem with the vicious circularity of your reasoning. You’ve made an argument or posited a claim that assumes what you already believe is true (evolution) prior to actually demonstrating it. Darwin probably said it best:

“But then with me the horrid doubt always arises whether the convictions of man’s mind, which has been developed from the mind of the lower animals, are of any value or at all trustworthy. Would any one trust in the convictions of a monkey’s mind, if there are any convictions in such a mind?”

 

[TexasLoneStar]

“Non-denominational” is just Baptist-Lite. Mixed in with some Pentecostal stuff sometimes. They share like 99% of their theology and non-liturgical contemporary with the Evangelical movement.

 

[Illuminatrix]

Do you believe it’s possible modern human beings share a common ancestor with the other apes?

I don’t believe that modern humans share a common ancestor with other apes, no. Do I believe it’s a logical possibility? I’m not willing to commit to an answer to that question at this time.

If not, how do you explain the charts we’ve all seen that shows pictures of ape going from being to another, until it reaches modern man?

Again, you’re assuming evolution before demonstrating its veracity. Your question is akin to me asking, “If you don’t believe the Bible, how do you explain the words on pages 1-2 that say God created man from dust in six literal days?”

How do you explain the fossils, carbon dating etc. that point to macro-evolution?

Fossils therefore evolution is a non sequitur. Carbon dating therefore evolution is a non sequitur. Additionally, neither of those things taken cumulatively demonstrate “macroevolution”.

This pastor told me that even Darwin, himself, had some difficulty explaining parts of his own theory. Is that true?

Yes. It’s called “Darwin’s Doubt” and I quoted him above.

 

[Hope1960]

My husband was raised Baptist but all the yelling and screaming from the pulpit during their hellfire and brimstone sermons turned him off organized religion entirely. He does attend a Christmas Eve Mass with me every year, though.

This church didn’t sound at all Baptist -like. It’s very contemporary.

 

[Hope1960]

How do you explain the fossils, carbon dating etc. that point to macro-evolution?

Sorry. I meant micro-evolution.

 

[TC3033]

They don’t claim a specific denomination in order to draw in a wider variety of people. That’s the way the large non-denominational are in my area anyway. Many have multiple “campuses” as well. They have a very soft/shallow theology, you go and can drink your coffee while hearing a good concert and then hear a feel-good message. These places would recognize a catholic baptism. Coming from the Catholic Church you probably wouldn’t feel spiritually fed, though.

IDK…I come from a non-denominationl background and I’d say my wife experiences quite the opposite. She made mention more than once how much more she takes away from the sermon at my church vs. her Catholic church…but it’s an N=1 experience, and no…there is no concert at my church. I’m surprised that’s either A) so common or B) that’s become a stereotype of non-denominational churches. I think I’ve only been to one that was “concerty”… ¯_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Hope1960]

Catholic church…but it’s an N=1 experience,

What is an N=1 experience?

 

[Hope1960]

there is no concert at my church. I’m surprised that’s either A) so common or B) that’s become a stereotype of non-denominational churches. I think I’ve only been to one that was “concerty”… ¯_(ツ)_/¯

This church is “concerty” with contemporary Christian pop/rock music, lighting, etc.

 

[TC3033]

It’s a short way of saying “one person’s personal account”.

 

[TheLittleLady]

Which group of Baptists?

All of the non-denominational pastors/attendees I know do not believe OSAS, which is a foundational belief for the majority of Baptist denominations.

Non-Denoms tend to be very accepting of dancing, again, a no-no for Baptists.

So, I wonder, are you speaking more of Freewill Baptists than Southern, Independent or Hardshell Baptists?