What Muslims are taught in their mosques - unbiased

[Palladio]

Hi

You are most welcome to differ with me.
Please don’t mind, it is just a discussion to reach the truth.
No compulsion.

Thanks

Don’t be foolish: you flatter yourself to assume you could discuss what you do not know.

Just apologize for your insulting and blasphemous ignorance.

 

[fatma]

You know nothing about Catholics, so please refrain from making such outrageous claims as you do in this post.

You know less about the NT.

I am going to use just one example.

You are lamentably wrong about the famous–repeat famous–passage in which Christ speaks of a sword, which is nothing but a figure of speech for the division between families and civil society to occur as Jews and Gentiles become Christians. If your grotesquely mistaken misinterpretation were true–and it is blasphemously false–it would warrant family member killing family member. Which is stupid and disgusting beyond words.

You need to provide something more than your assertions - how convenient to allow catholics but not muslims to explain things by ‘figures of speech’

You are a Catholic (if not a great speller: majescules matter), but enter as your religion Muslim Catholic: which is ignorant, disgusting, and blasphemous.

Your creed does not ask you to believe in Catholics, but in the RCC.

Do grow up.

Don’t tell me what is blasphemous! I find you to be blasphemy personified. How can anyone claim to belong to any religion and be so arrogant and rude. You are a condescending prat, with pretences to intellectualism. If you think religion is about winning intellectual arguments, you have no idea. You do not practise any values associated with catholicism.

Don’t be foolish: you flatter yourself to assume you could discuss what you do not know.

Just apologize for your insulting and blasphemous ignorance.

Everyone else is ignorant except you.

 

[Montalban]

You need to provide something more than your assertions - how convenient to allow catholics but not muslims to explain things by ‘figures of speech’

Perhaps we should let Moslems show that they are speaking literally - hence the suicide bombers aren’t just there ‘metaphorically’.

 

[Palladio]

You need to provide something more than your assertions - how convenient to allow catholics but not muslims to explain things by ‘figures of speech’

Don’t tell me what is blasphemous! I find you to be blasphemy personified. How can anyone claim to belong to any religion and be so arrogant and rude. You are a condescending prat, with pretences to intellectualism. If you think religion is about winning intellectual arguments, you have no idea. You do not practise any values associated with catholicism.

Everyone else is ignorant except you.

No, as is perfectly obvious, you and the other Islamo-infant are ignorant, but you now you are hitting the gutter fast and hard, insulting, demanding, ranting, and raving.

I’ll pray for you both, that you come to the RCC, which can teach more than this bizarre dot.com can about what it means to be an adult even as you remain a child of God.

God bless.

 

[fatma]

Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of Heaven. Blessed are the meek, for they shall posses the earth. Blessed are they who hunger and thirst for justice,for they shall be satisfied. Blessed are the merciful, for they shall obtain mercy. Blessed are the clean of heart, for they shall see God. Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called children of God. Blessed are they who suffer persecution for justice sake, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven Blessed are you who men reproach you, and persecute you, and speaking falsely, say all manner of evil against you, for my sake.

 

[dolphinlove]

Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of Heaven. Blessed are the meek, for they shall posses the earth. Blessed are they who hunger and thirst for justice,for they shall be satisfied. Blessed are the merciful, for they shall obtain mercy. Blessed are the clean of heart, for they shall see God. Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called children of God. Blessed are they who suffer persecution for justice sake, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven Blessed are you who men reproach you, and persecute you, and speaking falsely, say all manner of evil against you, for my sake.

Blessed are those who are catholic muslims
For they really are having an identity crisis…

 

[fatma]

Blessed are those who are catholic muslims
For they really are having an identity crisis…

:tiphat: :clapping:
haha i think you have a sense of humour

 

[Lance]

Fatima,
I notice that you captalize neither Catholic or Muslim in your Religion profile. Does that mean you are really neither? If you are trying to be both how can that be? Since catholic, with a small ‘c’ means universal, did you mean to say that you are a universal Muslim? I know you can be Arab and Catholic since my son in law is one but I don’t see how you could be Catholic and Muslim since you would have to reject some of the teachings of one or both religions. If you have already explained this please point me to your explanation.

 

[Booklover]

some people just amaze me. Why must you quote from an anti-muslim site to prove what muslims believe booklover? Whats wrong with quoting from a muslim site. I could have easily went to an anti-catholic site to learn about catholics but I’m here on a catholic site instead because I want to get my information from a non-biased source.

How about these reasons?

"A Muslim is born Muslim, yet he acts as if he independently and through his own labor has discovered the great find; he clings to it as his cherished security blanket; and, would part with his life, rather than giving it up. It is, therefore, understandable what a recent poll has found. Fully 81% of British Muslims consider themselves Muslims first and British second. The 81% know full well that there is absolutely no chance of being harassed, much less persecuted, in Britain for professing their highest loyalty to Islam. So, they come out and admit it. The other 19% are even more Muslim. They are practicing what the Quran teaches—dissimulation. Muslims are taught to lie. They lie when they have to and they lie when they don’t have to, just to stay in practice." Amil Imani

news.faithfreedom.org/index.php?name=News&file=article&sid=364

Here is a video sermon delivered in holy month of Muharram this year, hope you enjoy it.

PROOF

Posted by ex-Muslim Obadiah, #296 under the thread " I am sick of the rabid Islamophobia.

“SIR, not to burst your bubble, I was Muslim, back in the 70s, I have read the Qur’an a number of times. I prayed the five daily prayers ( Salaat). I used to go to the Masjid, EVERY FRIDAY. I have listened to the rantings of the Mullas and Imams against the Shatan USA. I discussed with other brother muslims about going to fight Jihad. You my friend are blinding yourself if you think that Islam is not out to get us.
If I went to a Muslim country and declared my conversion to Christianity, as an Apostate from Islam, I would be executed post haste.”

"Deindividuation reduces an individual’s self-restraint and normative regulation of behavior. It contributes to collective behavior of violent crowds, mindless hooligans, and the lynch mob. Such behavior is particularly noticeable when the Ummah gets into the mosque and is roused by red faced speeches of the imams and mullahs calling upon them to curse the Jews and the infidels for “oppressing” the Muslims." Ali Sina

faithfreedom.org/Articles/sina40612.htm

 

[Grace_Seeker]

Fatma, while we are on the side issue of your listing your religion as “catholic muslim”, please allow me to say this. This isn’t meant as an attack, but you might wish to reconsider such a registration, even if your desire is to build a bridge between the two.

As the episcopal priest in Oregon is finding out, one can keep a foot in both worlds, but one cannot keep a heart in both worlds. Either we give our hearts and our faith to Jesus or we don’t. It doesn’t have anything to do with Islam, it has to do with the nature of Christ and his demands that he places on us.

Add to that that Islam feels the same way with regard to its practices (one of the reasons that you will find true Isalm rejecting the likes of bin Laden as being truly representative of Islam and writing of him to one another as a despoiler of true Islam). So it is that a person who is a Muslim cannot at the same time profess the Christian creeds and be a true follower of Islam. While it is possible to be a member of either faith and acknowledge that the other faith attempts to worship the same God, neither grants the possible that one can be a follower of both faiths at the same time. One must choose one faith or the other, and if a person cannot or will not then that individual really doesn’t belong to either.

Of course, I recognize that you may have listed such a thing not to truly identify your theology, but to make some other sort of statement. So, I don’t share the above in the way of chastisement. It appears that you have gotten the attention of many. Having done so, you might now take advantage of that attention to clarify the sort of statement you were trying to make for those who find it confusing.

 

[Keikiolu]

This thread has certainly shaken my belief in catholics and if I thought that certain people on this thread were representative of catholicism, i would not want to be associated with it. However I am still catholic.

Now you’ve got me very interested indeed…!

Please tell us, or just me, if you like, EXACTLY why this thread has shaken your belief in Catholics.

PLEASE please please don’t leave such a “provocative” statement as you’ve made naked to rampant interpretation, and tell us precisely what you mean by what you’ve said.

Thanks VERY much in advance for your continued conversation, which I’m not expecting you to continue with, but which would be nice to share with you.

Best to you, Fatma…

Mahalo ke Akua…!
E pili mau na pomaikai ia oe. Aloha nui.

 

[AgnosTheist]

This thread has certainly shaken my belief in catholics and if I thought that certain people on this thread were representative of catholicism, i would not want to be associated with it. However I am still catholic.

you think these people are awful? what about the islamist terrorists? what about the amazing cruelty of the entire nation of saudi arabia? catholics are pusycats compared to those. have those muslims shaken your belief in Islam?

maybe you should just abandon religion all together just like me. I just believe in God but I dont believe in any religion. Im a better person for it.

 

[Keikiolu]

Quote:Originally Posted by paarsurrey forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif

Hi

You are most welcome to differ with me.

Please don’t mind, it is just a discussion to reach the truth.

No compulsion.

Thanks
Don’t be foolish: you flatter yourself to assume you could discuss what you do not know.

Just apologize for your insulting and blasphemous ignorance.

Let’s not be like those who are “insulted” at other’s honest (or even not-so-honest) opinions of their religion…!

Paars is not insulting, at least to me, of my religion. He simply has a (rather oddball) opinion of it.

Paars is NOT being blasphemous, because he is speaking out of ignorance and mis-information.

Paars, just like the rest of us, is just airing his opinions, which in his case are really QUITE amusing, and very informative of the lengths to which “islam” can be stretched to “fit” a particular mindset.

I must admit, though, that I do have Paars on my /ignore list.

Have a great one, folks,… and keep talking.

Mahalo ke Akua…!
E pili mau na pomaikai ia oe. Aloha nui.

 

[Booklover]

not all muslims want sharia law, they support democracy and the australian way of life. they also find much of the middle eastern practises reprehensible.

Don’t Muslims believe that sharia law is from God??

Vickie

 

[Keikiolu]

Quote:Originally Posted by fatma forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif

not all muslims want sharia law, they support democracy and the australian way of life. they also find much of the middle eastern practises reprehensible.
Don’t Muslims believe that sharia law is from God??

Fatma,… this is the whole point. Moslems are “allowed” (by “islam”) to believe that it’s OK to NOT believe in a commandment of God, according to “islam”.

Is that inherently psychopathic, or what?

Moslems, as individual persons, are free to believe as they wish. They have no central authority.

You call non-sharia-believing-moslems MOSLEMS.

Sharia-believing-moslems call them NON-MOSLEMS.

Sharia-believing-moslems have a punishment for non-moslems, and an especially harsh one for non-moslem moslems, such as non-sharia-believing non-moslems who call themselves moslems.

Since we’re (non-sharia-believing-humanity) put in the position of being constantly threatened by sharia-believing-moslems, should we not perhaps be “on guard” against those who threaten to do us harm?

Mahalo ke Akua…!
E pili mau na pomaikai ia oe. Aloha nui.

 

[Keikiolu]

you think these people are awful? what about the islamist terrorists? what about the amazing cruelty of the entire nation of saudi arabia? catholics are pusycats compared to those. have those muslims shaken your belief in Islam?

maybe you should just abandon religion all together just like me. I just believe in God but I dont believe in any religion. Im a better person for it.

You believe in God, but not in religion?

What do you think “belief in God” means, if not “religion”…?

You’re welcome to your little word games, and I’m very happy for you that you’ve found a religion you can believe in,… even if you don’t call it a religion.

It doesn’t matter what you call it. If it brings you closer to God, then it will eventually lead you to some sort of “communion with others”, which is the part of religion that you find distasteful, most likely due to “abuse by communion with fools” in your past.

If your religion doesn’t lead you toward the humanly necessary communion with others in God, then your religion is just you worshipping yourself, as only YOU are worthy of communion with YOU. This will lead you into the pit,… but if that’s where you need to go,… so be it.

But,. best to 'ya…!!

Mahalo ke Akua…!
E pili mau na pomaikai ia oe. Aloha nui.

 

[AgnosTheist]

You believe in God, but not in religion?

What do you think “belief in God” means, if not “religion”…?

i see religion as nothing more than another man’s system of beliefs. A lot of fantastic claims but no supporting evidences whatsoever.

Believing in God means looking at all the wonders of life and associating all that with an ultra powerful supreme intelligence out there that manipulates the forces of the universe. It means admiring the divine and striving to be a good person in hopes that something wonderful will happen for you.

You’re welcome to your little word games, and I’m very happy for you that you’ve found a religion you can believe in,… even if you don’t call it a religion.

It doesn’t matter what you call it. If it brings you closer to God, then it will eventually lead you to some sort of “communion with others”, which is the part of religion that you find distasteful, most likely due to “abuse by communion with fools” in your past.

If your religion doesn’t lead you toward the humanly necessary communion with others in God, then your religion is just you worshipping yourself, as only YOU are worthy of communion with YOU. This will lead you into the pit,… but if that’s where you need to go,… so be it.

whats the big deal all that ‘communion’ stuff anyway?

 

[Booklover]

This thread has certainly shaken my belief in catholics and if I thought that certain people on this thread were representative of catholicism, i would not want to be associated with it. However I am still catholic.

And you continue with your rants against Catholicism and Catholics and completely ignore the posts by Tawheed! Why the double standards?

Why do you claim to be both a Catholic and a Muslim? You can’t be both! Do you believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and 2nd person of the Trinity? If you do, you have to reject Muhammad and his claims. You can’t have it both ways.

Vickie

 

[Booklover]

Hi

I would now bridge the gaps between the TraditionalMuslims and the Catholics/Orthodox Christians, if both sides don’t mind it, please.

Christianity which is propagated the world over by its various (33000+) denominations is peaceful, but when they preach it, they virtually expunge the following verses from it (and many, many more):

[Math. 10:34]"Do not think that I have come to make peace on earth? I HAVE NOT COME TO BRING PEACE, BUT A SWORD.“For I have come to set a man against his father, and a daughter against hermother.”[said Jesus]!

This means that Jesus message that meets with acceptance or rejection will be a source of conflict and dissension even within families.

Luk. 12:49]'I CAME TO CAST FIRE UPON THE EARTH, AND WOULD THAT IT WERE ALREADY KINDLED…DO YOU THINK THAT I HAVE COME TO GIVE PEACE ON EARTH? NO, I TELL YOU, BUTRATHER DIVISION; for from henceforth in one house there will be five divided,three against two, and two against three. They will be divided, father againstson, and son against father, mother against daughter, and daughter against hermother. [said Jesus]!

See above.

Luk. 19:27]For these enemies of mine, who did not want me to reign over them, BRING THEMHERE AND SLAY THEM BEFORE ME.

This is taken from the parable of the gold coins which Jesus used as an example to prove a point!

Luk. 14:26]If any one comes to me and does not HATE his own father and mother and wife,and children, and brothers and sisters yes and even his own life: he cannot be my disciple.

Jesus is stating that to be his disciple, total dedication is necessary. No attachment to family or possesions can stand in the way of total commitment. Also, acceptance of the call to be a disciple demands readiness to accept persecution and suffering and a realistic assessment of the hardships and cost.

Hating his father, means that the disciple’s family must take second place to the absolute dedication involved in following Jesus.

Now the Catholics would come to explain away the above, but won’t let the TraditionalMuslims to explain away the verses in Quran. I pu

t it in another way for understanding of the Catholics/Orthodox that Jesus lived for only 23 to 33 years in this world (as per the Catholics/Orthodox, which would be near half of the age of Muhammad) till he departed from Galilee and went to India, most probably if he would have lived up to the age of 63 in Jerusalem, he would have waged war with his opponents, as clearly were his intention (as reflected in the above passages). One thinks in terms of this, because Jesus’ teachings were treated incomplete by the Clergy, so they had to be practical and they promulgated the “Just war Doctrine” to complete the teachings of Jesus, yet they preferred not to include it in the Bible.

Stop comparing Jesus to your false prophet who was peaceful while he was weak and who showed his true colors when he became strong. And as for Jesus’ going to India, that is as real as statingt that chickens have teeth and pigs have wings!

The Muslims have it complete in the Quran, the Catholics held the half of it hidden from the common man’s eyes for propagation purposes.

Nonsense!It’s Islam that uses lies and dissimulation to confuse and lure the unwary into its trap!

Vickie

 

[Keikiolu]

Quote:Originally Posted by Keikiolu forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif You believe in God, but not in religion?

*What do you think “belief in God” means, if not “religion”…?*i see religion as nothing more than another man’s system of beliefs. A lot of fantastic claims but no supporting evidences whatsoever.

Of course you do. That’s obvious. You believe only what “you” generate between your ears.

Believing in God means looking at all the wonders of life and associating all that with an ultra powerful supreme intelligence out there that manipulates the forces of the universe. It means admiring the divine and striving to be a good person in hopes that something wonderful will happen for you.

And that’s a good-ish start, but…

Notice the predominant “inward directed you-ness” of your thoughts above.

It’s YOU LOOKING (you receiving),
It’s YOU ADMIRING (you receiving),
It’s YOU BEING GOOD (this one has promise! It’s you giving, but it’s you giving “to get something wonderful”, below),
It’s YOU GETTING SOMETHING WONDERFUL (you receiving).

It’s all about YOU, buckeroo…

That ain’t what “believing in God” is about.

Quote:Originally Posted by Keikiolu forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cad/viewpost.gif You’re welcome to your little word games, and I’m very happy for you that you’ve found a religion you can believe in,… even if you don’t call it a religion.

It doesn’t matter what you call it. If it brings you closer to God, then it will eventually lead you to some sort of “communion with others”, which is the part of religion that you find distasteful, most likely due to “abuse by communion with fools” in your past.

*If your religion doesn’t lead you toward the humanly necessary communion with others in God, then your religion is just you worshipping yourself, as only YOU are worthy of communion with YOU. This will lead you into the pit,… but if that’s where you need to go,… so be it.*whats the big deal all that ‘communion’ stuff anyway?

If it’s “all about YOU”, that’s a perfectly sensible question you’ve posed there, chief.

…but it’s not all about you.

Mahalo ke Akua…!
E pili mau na pomaikai ia oe. Aloha nui.