What Role Do Catholics Play in Combatting Rape Culture?

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I do not know why this is mentioned in the OP as something that Catholics have a role in. It would be like asking what role does the Church have in DWI’s, or in forgeries. The question makes no sense to me.

The good (from the video): There were one, maybe two people, who were speaking the truth on the video. Is that enough, well, it depends on their role after they were belittled and laughed at, but it is no small feat for a teenager to stand up to his friends for ridicule for doing the right thing.

The bad? Oh, while two were punished, the idea these people were out of jail in less than two years, while their victim would face the rest of her life with this, is unconscionable. If rape and distributing child pornography carries only a year or two punishment, then yes, you can say we have a rape culture. If covering this up and hiding this to avoid embarrassing one’s program gets you 90 days in jail, then yes, you have a rape culture, especially in Steubenville, Ohio. Why do I mention them? Because they need to come to mind, along with Duke university, when one thinks about macho kids being allowed to rape girls for fun. If nothing else, they should be punished by serving as a by-word for this evil, and their part in it. Other institutions need to know that the bad press from cover-up will preserver their evil in history, as opposed to a passing news story where the culprits were punished by the good people in their town or institution.
 
Do otherwise good people ever slip into bad situations?

I’m thinking of some of the gang rapes we hear about in the U.S., such as the one in Steubenville, Ohio. Sociopathy isn’t always to blame; sometimes enough alcohol and pressure to fit in with the guys may be all it takes to do violence against women.

I agree with you that we can’t educate or “workshop” the problem away. Such thinking is naive. I posted above that rape culture may be a product of entitlement culture, i.e. raising a generation to believe that they can and should have whatever they want, even at someone else’s expense.

The solution may lie in raising boys with a strong moral compass. I have sons, so for me, the pressure is on . . .
 
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That’s what they teach. But are students learning?

Go to Google Scholar. These interventions tend to have mixed results. I’m not saying we should never do anything, but some healthy skepticism about how they’re approached is necessary.
 
Alex337 said:
  • Consent is about more than sex. Even if they are chaste they should know about personal boundaries.
  • Having taught sex ed while many young boys no that “no means no” many did not know that silence doesn’t mean yes, or that pressuring a partner is wrong (girls play hard to get! You just need to keep trying! etc) But I agree we should likely be teaching consent more consistently and from a younger age.
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I would say those messages get to girls too. A lot of women tend to second-guess themselves after assault. (A lot of other people second-guess women after assault too.) Women get the message that if you’re saying no, but you wore something immodest or if you were flirting, you can’t really expect a guy to understand no. And there’s a catch-22; if you didn’t yell and put up a fuss you didn’t say no clearly enough, but if you did you’re hysterical and making a big fuss over nothing.

The second-guessing is also part of rape culture. It makes women less likely to come forward and makes it harder to get convictions. A lot of women don’t want to say anything if they’re worried about being shamed for “crying rape” or for “asking for it” or something, so they’ll keep it to themselves and not report.
 
The same role as anyone else: Teach our kids to be good, and to realize that some people will be bad no matter what they’re taught and to take appropriate precautions.

Also, we don’t have a “rape culture” in the U.S. Rape is against the law and against right morals, and a small percentage of very sick people doing very bad things does not equate to a “rape culture.”

You want “rape culture”, go look in many places in the Middle East where rape is seen as disciplinary, or in places like the Congo where rape is used as a weapon of war.
 
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Sometimes I think the benefit of workshops etc. isn’t to teach predators to know better (because in most cases they don’t care), but it will teach everybody present about resources, how to spot and avoid predatory behavior or hopefully help someone else escape it, and to let the predator know that he (usually) will be watched.

I don’t blame the sexual revolution in its entirety for rape culture, but one thing that did change is that predators can feign ignorance or use casual sex/hookup culture to justify their behavior. Did it definitely exist before? Yes, but there was a reliance on other factors to get away with it (secrecy, shame, etc.) I think we shouldn’t demonize one era or another, but try to keep what was good and leave what wasn’t.
 
pensmama87 said:
Sometimes I think the benefit of workshops etc. isn’t to teach predators to know better (because in most cases they don’t care), but it will teach everybody present about resources, how to spot and avoid predatory behavior or hopefully help someone else escape it, and to let the predator know that he (usually) will be watched.

I don’t blame the sexual revolution in its entirety for rape culture, but one thing that did change is that predators can feign ignorance or use casual sex/hookup culture to justify their behavior. Did it definitely exist before? Yes, but there was a reliance on other factors to get away with it (secrecy, shame, etc.) I think we shouldn’t demonize one era or another, but try to keep what was good and leave what wasn’t.
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I definitely think this is a lot of the idea behind it. There’s actually been some studies done, and by and large you have a pattern of serial rapists who use various means to justify their behavior. So a lot of the education isn’t necessarily to teach them not to rape, it’s to teach other people how not to let them get away with it. Rapists count on other people accepting their excuses and on social shame to keep the victims from speaking up.
 
Bruised_Reed said:
I didn’t see a specific reply to this but it’s not about regret it’s about the ability to consent.
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I understand, but that was not the CDC’s criteria, nor has it been the universities; administration criteria when actual cases happened. Both parties were inebriated, but only one was found guilty despite both being on the same page. There are even texts showing that it was the girl who had requested it.

Again, I’m not condoning drunken sex, but I am saying this is not the same and there is a double standard, and it doesn’t help actual rape victims.
 
If consent is the primary issue, better get it in writing. There have indeed been cases of false rape charges. There have been cases on campus where consensual sex is followed by morning regret and yesterday’s yes becomes a next day no. I’m sure the legal profession can come up with a simple series of forms with signaure blocks acknowledging consent for every consecutive interaction from initial kiss to sexual congress. Get those forms signed, every time.

Was Charlotte Simmons a victim of rape? That’s another topic.
 
How would “enthusiastic yes” play out?

Suppose that my husband initiated, and I agreed with an unenthusiastic, “Sigh - OK, dear.” Apart from being a rather, (ahem!) substandard encounter, could it theoretically get my husband in trouble?

I’m as anti-rape as they come. But what you’re describing sounds as close as you can get to stationing a government agent at the foot of our beds.
 
JimG said:
If consent is the primary issue, better get it in writing.
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The best written consent is a marriage license. After that, it is a matter between the two, except in the most extreme and provable cases. A man or woman that does not understand that should not marry, have sex, or reproduce.
 
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pnewton said:
The best written consent is a marriage license. After that, it is a matter between the two, except in the most extreme and provable cases. A man or woman that does not understand that should not marry, have sex, or reproduce.
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Unfortunately, extramarital sex has always been a thing, and probably always will be. I know in more conservative communities, the stigma on extramarital sex can actually enable a rapist to get away with it. The victim is afraid that people will believe she* chose to have sex or was otherwise acting immorally, so in order to preserve her own place she stays quiet. Part of the education on consent is I think for third parties, to help avoid that being the aftermath.

*can also be he, although the issues can be somewhat different.
 
pnewton said:
The best written consent is a marriage license.
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Yes, of course, but I get the impression from this thread that a lot of the consent issues involve casual sex. Not only consent, but an enthusiastic consent, is proposed as one standard. But what good is consent if you can’t prove it? That’s where the legal forms come in.

I also agree that a marriage license is the best written consent. Marriage itself involves an implicit consent to marital relations with the other party. It would be wrong for a married person to unreasonably withhold consent from a spouse. But the aspect of marital rape has also been brought up, so one can never be too careful. Maybe the forms should still be signed.

As to casual sex, it might be better to teach the moral law (i.e., no sex outside of marriage) rather than relying so heavily on teaching consent. Consent to a wrong does not make it right.
 
Abusive relationships may contain rape.
A marriage licence is a flimsy defense against a fist around your throat, just saying.
 
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JimG said:
As to casual sex, it might be better to teach the moral law (i.e., no sex outside of marriage) rather than relying so heavily on teaching consent. Consent to a wrong does not make it right.
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I think the flip side is that there’s no guarantee that a chaste woman isn’t going to be a victim. (And as I was mentioning upthread, there are men who present themselves as chaste and faithful in public who are not so in private.) As a woman, my concern is that if I’m in a situation where I’m afraid, and I don’t end up fighting back because I don’t want to get hurt, that I don’t end up being shamed as being unchaste simply for “going along.”

It’s not like such men announce their intentions upfront. Many women have found themselves in relationships with men they thought to be godly and trustworthy, only to find that the man changes when he drops his mask. There’s no foolproof defense except that we go to middle eastern style harems with women locked away from ever interacting with men alone.
 
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Separation is one thing. That happens afterwards.
But as I said, however chaste and loyal you are, a marriage is no guarantee either.

That’s why I insist rape is more a crime/sin of power and pride and entitlement, only partially of lust. (A man may be almost dying of lust but unless he believes he has a right to your body for his disposal and entertainment, that sin stays with him and constitues no civil crime)
 
SnowRose said:
a marriage is no guarantee either.
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Welcome to life. People do not come with guarantees, which is why one must be careful with whom they marry. The point about marriage, that if we so narrowly define consent as some sort of enthusiastic support, that is an absurd bar in marriage. That is why not only does the circumstance need to be extreme, as in forcible, but the evidence must be clear.

Separation does not have to be after. Seldom do incidents occur in a vacuum.
 
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Are you trying to educate a secular society that premarital sex is wrong? Not all rapes are associated with casual sex. It would be a little much to try to teach the nexte generation to save themselves for marriages especially if they aren’t religious.
 
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