What would you do if you think your mother is a sociopath?

[mommamaree]

Disclaimer: I am working on this issue right now, through self-help books and supportive people. I also plan to go back to my counselor soon, in order to get help to make some decisions. So, I am not expecting anyone to tell me what I should do or offer medical advice.

So what I am needing is feedback. I am researching on narcissism, sociopathy, emotional abuse, etc. Yet I am still very much emotionally attached to my mother (obviously) and have a hard time believing what I suspect about her. Other people see it very clearly, and have no hesitation in proclaiming her a sociopath, or at the very least, an incorrigible narcissist. My emotional idea of who my mother is seems to not be at all in touch with the reality of who she is, and this disconnect in my thinking is evidenced in how deeply and how often she is able to hurt me.

My question is, then, is this normal for emotionally abused people? Is it common for them to be so emotionally attached to their abuser (maybe sometimes purposefully constructed by the abuser in creative ways?) that they cannot acknowledge the reality of who their abuser is? Also, human behavior being so complex, is it possible for even someone demonstrating sociopathic traits to act generously or to seem kind at times? Or is it all part of their plan to control their target? Are there ways that I can learn to hold onto the REAL reality, instead of it slipping through my fingers like water as soon as my anger at the latest outrage subsides?

I guess that is more than one question…sorry about that. I am still so new to this whole concept, yet the situation with my family of origin has gotten very bad (AGAIN) and I need to try to figure this stuff out very quickly so that I can make some decisions. Any book or online recommendation would be greatly appreciated, too. Thank you so much everyone for whatever bits of wisdom you have to offer!

 

[BlueEyedLady]

I was very abused as a kid and teen, so I understand. I am naturally very suspicious of people and I am wary that so and so could be a sociopath. Sometimes, I even worry that I may be one. But like my therapist told me if I’m that worried about it and the idea of being a sociopath makes me that sad, then I’m probably not. I’m just a person who has been hurt.

I also tend to label people with personality disorders. I’m sure sometimes I’m right, other times I’m just paranoid. But like a dog that has been beaten I tend to flinch when people get close. And I’m very guilty of reading too much in to emotions and actions.

I guess in short my suggestion is to talk to a counselor. Getting help goes a long way towards having a healthy, happy, and productive life.

 

[mommamaree]

I was very abused as a kid and teen, so I understand. I am naturally very suspicious of people and I am wary that so and so could be a sociopath. Sometimes, I even worry that I may be one. But like my therapist told me if I’m that worried about it and the idea of being a sociopath makes me that sad, then I’m probably not. I’m just a person who has been hurt.

I also tend to label people with personality disorders. I’m sure sometimes I’m right, other times I’m just paranoid. But like a dog that has been beaten I tend to flinch when people get close. And I’m very guilty of reading too much in to emotions and actions.

I guess in short my suggestion is to talk to a counselor. Getting help goes a long way towards having a healthy, happy, and productive life.

Thanks, BlueEyedLady. Sounds like we have a lot in common.
You are right about seeing a counselor. I am still reluctant to go see mine again because my issues are mother issues, and she is a woman about ten years older than my mother. I have found that my mother issues come up with an elder female/expert. I have even had some severe struggles with my midwives, who are great, simply because of their age and authority. I am now struggling with elevated blood pressure and other symptoms of anxiety during pregnancy due to this. But a counselor could help me sort through that. In fact, I am going to call for an appt right now, and stop putting it off out of fear.

 

[mt_gooseberry]

I’m pretty sure my DH is on the sociopath/narcissist spectrum. There are times when he can be kind and caring, but I don’t know if it is something that is done superficially (ie. for show) or if it is real. I love him deeply and always will, but no longer like him or trust him. Human emotions are just so complex. I guess I don’t really have any answers for you, I just wanted to commiserate.

 

[mamaslo]

Disclaimer: I am working on this issue right now, through self-help books and supportive people. I also plan to go back to my counselor soon, in order to get help to make some decisions. So, I am not expecting anyone to tell me what I should do or offer medical advice.

So what I am needing is feedback. I am researching on narcissism, sociopathy, emotional abuse, etc. Yet I am still very much emotionally attached to my mother (obviously) and have a hard time believing what I suspect about her. Other people see it very clearly, and have no hesitation in proclaiming her a sociopath, or at the very least, an incorrigible narcissist. My emotional idea of who my mother is seems to not be at all in touch with the reality of who she is, and this disconnect in my thinking is evidenced in how deeply and how often she is able to hurt me.

My question is, then, is this normal for emotionally abused people? Is it common for them to be so emotionally attached to their abuser (maybe sometimes purposefully constructed by the abuser in creative ways?) that they cannot acknowledge the reality of who their abuser is? Also, human behavior being so complex, is it possible for even someone demonstrating sociopathic traits to act generously or to seem kind at times? Or is it all part of their plan to control their target? Are there ways that I can learn to hold onto the REAL reality, instead of it slipping through my fingers like water as soon as my anger at the latest outrage subsides?

I guess that is more than one question…sorry about that. I am still so new to this whole concept, yet the situation with my family of origin has gotten very bad (AGAIN) and I need to try to figure this stuff out very quickly so that I can make some decisions. Any book or online recommendation would be greatly appreciated, too. Thank you so much everyone for whatever bits of wisdom you have to offer!

Yes. yes. and yes…It is so heavy to hold on to anger and hurt, when we start to feel better, it is as if nothing every happened, but the damage is there it just goes undercover. You sound a lot like me. I was emotionally abused as a child so when as an adult when my legal husband abused me, it didn’t look like abuse, he may not have even been fully aware of it, but still the result felt like abuse and I found that very confusing. When I would go to counseling they would try to fix what I felt was irreparably broken, so this added to my distress, until my daughter got depressed and I found her a therapist, and she explained it through her own words…she said what I suspected to be true and the therapist called it abuse.

So yes, they can even be nice, it actually makes you feel like YOU are the crazy one.

I feel for you.

Pray for wisdom, and love and healing. You have to honor your mom, but what does that look like when she does that stuff to you?

 

[mommamaree]

I’m pretty sure my DH is on the sociopath/narcissist spectrum. There are times when he can be kind and caring, but I don’t know if it is something that is done superficially (ie. for show) or if it is real. I love him deeply and always will, but no longer like him or trust him. Human emotions are just so complex. I guess I don’t really have any answers for you, I just wanted to commiserate.

Thanks mt_gooseberry. Commiseration is welcome, too.

I highlighted in red a comment you made that really jumped out at me. For so many of us struggling with this issue, we can only ever be “pretty sure”, can’t we? It is maddening sometimes to not know for sure. If I had certainty that my mother is a sociopath, or even a diagnosable NPD, I would grieve the loss of what she should have been in my life, and say goodbye and try to move on with my life. Instead, she hurts me with vindictive/competitive/sneaky/demeaning comments every single time we talk or visit, and I am left wondering what just happened. How did I go from self-confident and happy, to wanting to self-harm in two seconds flat? And she has always been that way with me, and it has gotten worse over the last decade. And I am the one left feeling guilty for wanting to leave her. I greatly fear breaking the fourth commandment. I greatly fear standing before the Lord on the day of my judgement and being told how wrong/selfish/evil I was for walking away from my mother who birthed me. No “well done, my good and faithful servant” for me.
Plus, even if I do get the guts to walk away, diagnosis or not, what can I do about my loneliness and the hole in my heart that only a mother could fill (not that she ever has)? I have already worked on addressing my father issues (another story altogether) that led to my choosing paganism upon reaching the age of majority, and have happily come home to the Catholic Church. I stopped projected my anger at my father onto my heavenly father, and now embrace Christianity. But how can my faith help me with mother issues? That is one of the reasons I embraced Goddess-worship for so many years before my conversion…trying to fill that mother-shaped hole in my heart.

When a person can never have certainty that what they suspect is true, and they are quite practiced at denial and self-blame to cope, how in the world are we supposed to recognize the wolf in sheep’s clothing and finally act on REALITY and not the emotional image we project upon the sociopath/narcissist?

I love my mother so very much, but she is not who I pretend she is. Not even close. Yet my heart longs for a closeness with her, so bad that sometimes I want to call her just to hear her voice, even though that beloved voice is going to tear me down.

(A thought just occurred to me as I previewed my post, that Mary is what Jesus gives to us to heal those wounds inflicted upon us by our mothers. “Behold, your mother,” Jesus says. But how do I unlock that? How do I learn to receive that gift? How do I go to the perfect mother without fear of condemnation? How do I learn to love her? weeping so hard right now, this hurts so much)

 

[ringil]

“the Sociopath Next Door” is likely the best current book on the subject.

I am a licensed Therapist.

Consensus is that people should distance themselves from true sociopaths, even if they are in their family.

Theoretically, they are missing the very intra-psychic foundations required for self-betterment, not that they would seek treatment anyway.

There is no currently recognized treatment for the sociopath- individual with Anti-social Personality Disorder.

It is, perhaps, the most grim form of psychological dysfunction.

 

[mommamaree]

Pray for wisdom, and love and healing. You have to honor your mom, but what does that look like when she does that stuff to you?

Thanks mamaslo. Such a helpful post.

I edited to address this comment which was particularly helpful to me.

This is what torments me so. What DOES it look like to honor an emotionally and spiritually abusive (at one time, physically abusive) parent? What does forgiveness feel like even, in this situation?

These questions are the very reason why I am reaching out here, as well as in counseling and through reading and supportive friendships. I don’t only need psychological answers. I need spiritual answers, too. Especially since being Catholic is such a huge part of who I am, and now my mother is acting like she is a better Catholic than me (even though she is not done with RCIA, annulments, etc.) and pointing out how I am lacking spiritually.

I know of no one in “real life” who has had intimate personal relationships with sociopaths/narcissists/abusers. This is such a hard thing to even acknowledge, let alone make big decisions about.

 

[EEgirl]

I think the best thing you can do for yourself, and for the narcissist in your life, is to go “no-contact”. This prevents you from being repeatedly injured, and it stops the narcissist from sinning against you. You can then pray. You are not going to turn someone like this around yourself, only the narcissist can choose to change.

I recommend reading this blog: narcissists-suck.blogspot.com/

The author has a narcissistic mother and has many practical insights regarding people with this disorder, which at some level is always chosen by the individual who suffers (and inflicts suffering on others) from it.

Sometimes you just have to accept that there are things you cannot fix. Separate yourself from the ongoing abuse, and pray that God will touch the abuser’s heart and lead them home to heaven.

 

[mommamaree]

“the Sociopath Next Door” is likely the best current book on the subject.

I am a licensed Therapist.

Consensus is that people should distance themselves from true sociopaths, even if they are in their family.

Theoretically, they are missing the very intra-psychic foundations required for self-betterment, not that they would seek treatment anyway.

There is no currently recognized treatment for the sociopath- individual with Anti-social Personality Disorder.

It is, perhaps, the most grim form of psychological dysfunction.

Thanks ringil.

I have that book and read it cover to cover in two days. It was a gripping read, honestly. Like the story of my life. I have also read “Boundaries” and am working on “Will I Ever Be Good Enough: Healing the Daughters of Narcissistic Mothers”.
The thing I am struggling most with is in removing that veil that I use to cover my eyes to the truth. I have this emotional image that I project upon my mother. I see her as a loving, nurturing, generous, kind, fun person…that is, until the next time that she violates my boundaries or manipulates me or hurts me. Then the veil gets torn a little. So I rapidly try to repair the veil and put in back in place. That is how desperate I am for all of this NOT to be true! It is ridiculous and crazy-making. But that is the power of MOTHER in our lives. That, and she very effectively made herself gate-keeper to attachments to anyone else in my family of origin, who is all nuts now anyway. If I walk away from her, I literally have NO ONE left in my family of origin. So I have a hard time acknowledging the reality that is right before my eyes. It is crippling. And yet my relationship with her is psychologically damaging me, and could potentially damage my children one day.

 

[mommamaree]

I think the best thing you can do for yourself, and for the narcissist in your life, is to go “no-contact”. This prevents you from being repeatedly injured, and it stops the narcissist from sinning against you. You can then pray. You are not going to turn someone like this around yourself, only the narcissist can choose to change.

I recommend reading this blog: narcissists-suck.blogspot.com/

The author has a narcissistic mother and has many practical insights regarding people with this disorder, which at some level is always chosen by the individual who suffers (and inflicts suffering on others) from it.

Sometimes you just have to accept that there are things you cannot fix. Separate yourself from the ongoing abuse, and pray that God will touch the abuser’s heart and lead them home to heaven.

Thanks EEgirl. I am eager to check out that blog. Your perspective is also very helpful. I don’t want to provide further occasions for my beloved crazy mother to continue to impale herself upon her own sword as she tries to run me through with it. Abusers always hurt themselves, too. Letting her experience the natural consequences of her actions could, in the end, be the most loving thing I could do for her, painful as it may be now.

 

[exoflare]

My question is, then, is this normal for emotionally abused people? Is it common for them to be so emotionally attached to their abuser (maybe sometimes purposefully constructed by the abuser in creative ways?) that they cannot acknowledge the reality of who their abuser is?

Both of my parents (and most of the rest of my family) are emotionally abusive in at least some significant way, and once I realized it I had no problem accepting it. Far from being emotionally attached to them, my biggest struggle is trying to avoid wishing ill towards them. But honestly if any of them died I would not miss them at all and would even feel relieved. It seems like I’m the anomaly, though, and for some reason I still fail to understand, the typical response is as you say to remain emotionally attached to family even if they’re abusive. It’s something I noticed early on and has always puzzled me to no end. I see it in my own family for example, where I’m the only one that acknowledges what’s going on and the rest of them bury their heads in the sand and keep making excuses for each other’s toxic behavior. I will be made out as the bad guy for daring to deny the fantasy world.

Also, human behavior being so complex, is it possible for even someone demonstrating sociopathic traits to act generously or to seem kind at times? Or is it all part of their plan to control their target? Are there ways that I can learn to hold onto the REAL reality, instead of it slipping through my fingers like water as soon as my anger at the latest outrage subsides?

They CAN act generous sometimes but it is always about control in some way. Sometimes it can be kind of hard to believe as they can put on an excellent act, but yeah it’s still fake. The best thing you can do is figure out what boundaries you need to set with that person no matter what, and then force yourself to act on them.

 

[ringil]

Thanks ringil.

I have that book and read it cover to cover in two days. It was a gripping read, honestly. Like the story of my life. I have also read “Boundaries” and am working on “Will I Ever Be Good Enough: Healing the Daughters of Narcissistic Mothers”.
The thing I am struggling most with is in removing that veil that I use to cover my eyes to the truth. I have this emotional image that I project upon my mother. I see her as a loving, nurturing, generous, kind, fun person…that is, until the next time that she violates my boundaries or manipulates me or hurts me. Then the veil gets torn a little. So I rapidly try to repair the veil and put in back in place. That is how desperate I am for all of this NOT to be true! It is ridiculous and crazy-making. But that is the power of MOTHER in our lives. That, and she very effectively made herself gate-keeper to attachments to anyone else in my family of origin, who is all nuts now anyway. If I walk away from her, I literally have NO ONE left in my family of origin. So I have a hard time acknowledging the reality that is right before my eyes. It is crippling. And yet my relationship with her is psychologically damaging me, and could potentially damage my children one day.

This sounds enormously difficult for you and I’m sorry,

Since you have read the book you may have an idea whether she is truly antisocial, borderline, or narcissistic, or just abusive.

Your therapist is there to help you make the best decisions for yourself.

Speaking as a Catholic I would say that honoring your mother and father doesn’t mean allowing yourself to be abused.

It’s a tough situation.

 

[Sebrina]

Disclaimer: I am working on this issue right now, through self-help books and supportive people. I also plan to go back to my counselor soon, in order to get help to make some decisions. So, I am not expecting anyone to tell me what I should do or offer medical advice.

So what I am needing is feedback. I am researching on narcissism, sociopathy, emotional abuse, etc. Yet I am still very much emotionally attached to my mother (obviously) and have a hard time believing what I suspect about her. Other people see it very clearly, and have no hesitation in proclaiming her a sociopath, or at the very least, an incorrigible narcissist. My emotional idea of who my mother is seems to not be at all in touch with the reality of who she is, and this disconnect in my thinking is evidenced in how deeply and how often she is able to hurt me.

My question is, then, is this normal for emotionally abused people? Is it common for them to be so emotionally attached to their abuser (maybe sometimes purposefully constructed by the abuser in creative ways?) that they cannot acknowledge the reality of who their abuser is? Also, human behavior being so complex, is it possible for even someone demonstrating sociopathic traits to act generously or to seem kind at times? Or is it all part of their plan to control their target? Are there ways that I can learn to hold onto the REAL reality, instead of it slipping through my fingers like water as soon as my anger at the latest outrage subsides?

I guess that is more than one question…sorry about that. I am still so new to this whole concept, yet the situation with my family of origin has gotten very bad (AGAIN) and I need to try to figure this stuff out very quickly so that I can make some decisions. Any book or online recommendation would be greatly appreciated, too. Thank you so much everyone for whatever bits of wisdom you have to offer!

My 23 year old stepdaughter has been diagnosed with narcissistic personality/borderline sociopath disorder. In addition to being a habitual liar (which from my point of view, goes hand in hand with sociopaths). Don’t get me wrong. I love her. But I find it difficult to like her. I will babysit my stepgrandaughter, I will help my stepdaughter with money at times, I’ll make idle chit-chat with my stepdaughter, but that is as far as it goes.

Realistically, you should put some emotional distance between yourself and your mother if not physical distance. I know that’s not always possible, though. I honestly don’t think psychotherapy helps with people who have this mental problem, because they can’t seem to tell the truth for even an hour at a time, or they are utterly incapable of facing themselves honestly. They have an intense fear of being judged by other people. Knowing all of this about my stepdaughter has actually helped me love her more, because I don’t feel she’s capable of being any other way, and didn’t choose this kind of life for herself.

I hope you can find some peace in your life. You deserve it.

 

[Eleanor61]

It took me 48 years to cut myself off from my mother. I did not love her, in fact my earliest memories are of intense dislike for her, but I felt guilty and responsible. It was a huge mistake. My husband, children, and my already fragile mental and physical health suffered tremendously. Our lives would have been so much better if we had not maintained a relationship with her. If things are indeed as you describe, the sooner you cut her off, the better.
Yes, we do have a tendency to make excuses for them and feel guilty when we have been abused as children. Narcisstic mothers know this weakness and exploit it. Escape.

 

[EasterJoy]

Some people keep bears as pets. It’s not a good idea, but people do it and some wouldn’t have it any other way. The ones who get hurt are the ones who forget even for a moment that a bear that has acted like a dog for ten years is still a bear. An elephant that has acted like a pony for ten years is still an elephant. A lizard is a lizard, and will always be a lizard. Forget that, even for a moment, and no matter what a great “trainer” you are, you are very vulnerable to serious and lasting harm.

Conversely, there are people who love bears but who would never for a second consider letting one live in their home. It is nothing against the bear, but it is too dangerous. There is no one, however, who pretends that a bear is really a dog and fails to be hurt when that reality crashes down on their heads. Love that isn’t honest is not love.

You are in a similar situation, and have similar choices to people who love bears or elephants or lizards. If you’re going to have a relationship with your mother, you must resolve that you will have a relationship with her as she is, not as you wish she were. This means you must always remember that she is unpredictable and can be dangerous. This means coming to terms with the truth that this will not change. It is not that she has no ability to behave in a moral manner, but that she does not have the psychological equipment to make the same kind of connection with you that you make with her. She will probably never change, and will probably never see any need to try.

As you grieve this reality, do remember that there really aren’t any Hallmark-card mothers. Your mom is especially difficult, but the “normal” mother you didn’t get could not have been perfect, either. It might also be helpful to be grateful that God did give you the capacity to feel an emotional connection with your husband and your children and your friends, to be the wife and mother and friend that your mother couldn’t have been for anyone else even if she had been perfect in her every moral decision.

What a handicap her incapacity is! It is easy to believe that your mother would have been better off if she had been born blind or deaf instead of emotionally insensitive. The only mercy is that she is more or less insensitive to it. She did not have the capacity and then lose it, and therefore cannot miss it as you would if your emotional capacities were lost or damaged. Still, our emotional capacity to feel empathy is a great gift. Sometimes, it is the person close to us who lacks some such precious capacity who brings that truth home. When we have the trial of dealing with that person, we can sometimes at least take that appreciation as some sort of consolation. Maybe, maybe not, I wouldn’t punish yourself if you can’t, because people with particular capacity can be so hurtful, but it is something to consider, in case the thought might make your trial just a little easier to endure.

 

[antunesaa]

Disclaimer: I am working on this issue right now, through self-help books and supportive people. I also plan to go back to my counselor soon, in order to get help to make some decisions. So, I am not expecting anyone to tell me what I should do or offer medical advice.

So what I am needing is feedback. I am researching on narcissism, sociopathy, emotional abuse, etc. Yet I am still very much emotionally attached to my mother (obviously) and have a hard time believing what I suspect about her. Other people see it very clearly, and have no hesitation in proclaiming her a sociopath, or at the very least, an incorrigible narcissist. My emotional idea of who my mother is seems to not be at all in touch with the reality of who she is, and this disconnect in my thinking is evidenced in how deeply and how often she is able to hurt me.

My question is, then, is this normal for emotionally abused people? Is it common for them to be so emotionally attached to their abuser (maybe sometimes purposefully constructed by the abuser in creative ways?) that they cannot acknowledge the reality of who their abuser is? Also, human behavior being so complex, is it possible for even someone demonstrating sociopathic traits to act generously or to seem kind at times? Or is it all part of their plan to control their target? Are there ways that I can learn to hold onto the REAL reality, instead of it slipping through my fingers like water as soon as my anger at the latest outrage subsides?

I guess that is more than one question…sorry about that. I am still so new to this whole concept, yet the situation with my family of origin has gotten very bad (AGAIN) and I need to try to figure this stuff out very quickly so that I can make some decisions. Any book or online recommendation would be greatly appreciated, too. Thank you so much everyone for whatever bits of wisdom you have to offer!

I’m appalled by the number and types of experiences with sociopath relatives that people have posted here. I almost feel guilty about not having ever experienced such a trying situation. It’s so strange to me that I can’t even imagine how you and the others feel about your mom/daughter/etc. But your testimonies are also pungently real and one can feel the whole pain and sorrow involved. I pray for you but unfortunately - or perhaps fortunately - I cannot give you advice on this.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

Disclaimer: I am working on this issue right now, through self-help books and supportive people. I also plan to go back to my counselor soon, in order to get help to make some decisions. So, I am not expecting anyone to tell me what I should do or offer medical advice.

So what I am needing is feedback. I am researching on narcissism, sociopathy, emotional abuse, etc. Yet I am still very much emotionally attached to my mother (obviously) and have a hard time believing what I suspect about her. Other people see it very clearly, and have no hesitation in proclaiming her a sociopath, or at the very least, an incorrigible narcissist. My emotional idea of who my mother is seems to not be at all in touch with the reality of who she is, and this disconnect in my thinking is evidenced in how deeply and how often she is able to hurt me.

My question is, then, is this normal for emotionally abused people? Is it common for them to be so emotionally attached to their abuser (maybe sometimes purposefully constructed by the abuser in creative ways?) that they cannot acknowledge the reality of who their abuser is? **Also, human behavior being so complex, is it possible for even someone demonstrating sociopathic traits to act generously or to seem kind at times? Or is it all part of their plan to control their target? ** Are there ways that I can learn to hold onto the REAL reality, instead of it slipping through my fingers like water as soon as my anger at the latest outrage subsides?

I guess that is more than one question…sorry about that. I am still so new to this whole concept, yet the situation with my family of origin has gotten very bad (AGAIN) and I need to try to figure this stuff out very quickly so that I can make some decisions. Any book or online recommendation would be greatly appreciated, too. Thank you so much everyone for whatever bits of wisdom you have to offer!

Yes, it is normal for children of narcissists to still want a loving and close relationship, but it is not the real person who is desired, it is the “fantasy parent.” That fantasy can stay in front of the real person for a lifetime, if the adult child doesn’t work VERY hard to face reality (usually in therapy).

I do not believe that a narcissist EVER does anything out of kindness or generosity. All of their actions are self-interested and manipulative in some way. They do nothing for the sake of it, and you can discover this when you are either blocking something they want, or you do not act as they want you to. Suddenly you are on the “bad list,” ignored, or you might just get the full force of their anger. Do as they wish, and all is well. Stand in their way, and all hell breaks loose.

I think people raised by narcissists need therapy more than just about any other group. It’s almost a “de-programming” function - so that when you start making excuses for your narcissistic parent, the therapist can give you a reality check. Also, once you truly, TRULY recognize your parent for the person she IS, someone needs to be there to help you through those emotions (anger, grief, fear, more anger, sadness, etc.).

If you have a problem with your current therapist, then switch. Find a male or a younger female, tell your current therapist that you have such a problem with mothering figures that you need to approach it in a different way. You CAN work through it with your current therapist but it’s going to add another layer of intensity onto what you are already dealing with, I think.

This is all so tragic.

p.s. A therapist told me, “You can never have the parents you WANTED, but you can BE that parent for your own kids.”

 

[mommamaree]

Love that isn’t honest is not love.

It is not that she has no ability to behave in a moral manner, but that she does not have the psychological equipment to make the same kind of connection with you that you make with her. She will probably never change, and will probably never see any need to try.

As you grieve this reality, do remember that there really aren’t any Hallmark-card mothers. Your mom is especially difficult, but the “normal” mother you didn’t get could not have been perfect, either.

What a handicap her incapacity is! It is easy to believe that your mother would have been better off if she had been born blind or deaf instead of emotionally insensitive. The only mercy is that she is more or less insensitive to it. She did not have the capacity and then lose it, and therefore cannot miss it as you would if your emotional capacities were lost or damaged. Still, our emotional capacity to feel empathy is a great gift. Sometimes, it is the person close to us who lacks some such precious capacity who brings that truth home. When we have the trial of dealing with that person, we can sometimes at least take that appreciation as some sort of consolation. Maybe, maybe not, I wouldn’t punish yourself if you can’t, because people with particular capacity can be so hurtful, but it is something to consider, in case the thought might make your trial just a little easier to endure.

Easter Joy, thank you for your thoughts.

I edited your posts in order to address certain parts more easily, as well as highlighted specific comments I needed to respond to.

The first one about love…I don’t think that is very fair to me. I do love my mother. It has been a work of will and suffering for my whole life. It is real. Just because I try to cope with my suffering through denial (a coping strategy I picked up in childhood and now need to shed) doesn’t mean that I don’t really love her.

As to the rest of the blue highlighted comments, they really hurt. I feel like I am yearning to throw off a yoke of oppression and you are explaining how to bear it more gracefully. Maybe I am wrong, but it is exactly that kind of thinking that has kept me tied to my emotionally abusive mother for all these years. My compassion and empathy for her, my awareness of her emotional voids, are the very things that led me to keep trying. But I cannot handle the constant wounds.
She steals everything good from me and twists it. She belittles me and demeans me. She constantly competes with me, which means I always lose. She also is competitive with my niece (whom she has adopted) and my daughter, who is only two days younger than my niece. Now it is not only me who loses, but also my daughter.
Normally, EasterJoy, I appreciate your wisdom. But my reaction to your thoughts here is that I feel like I am suffocating or drowning. Like I will never get away. Her burden is NOT my cross to bear. I also felt like I was very judgemental and critical (which my mother accuses me of whenever I confront her about her mistreatment of me) when I read your comment about Hallmark card mothers.

 

[Eleanor61]

Yes, it is normal for children of narcissists to still want a loving and close relationship, but it is not the real person who is desired, it is the “fantasy parent.” That fantasy can stay in front of the real person for a lifetime, if the adult child doesn’t work VERY hard to face reality (usually in therapy).

I do not believe that a narcissist EVER does anything out of kindness or generosity. All of their actions are self-interested and manipulative in some way. They do nothing for the sake of it, and you can discover this when you are either blocking something they want, or you do not act as they want you to. Suddenly you are on the “bad list,” ignored, or you might just get the full force of their anger. Do as they wish, and all is well. Stand in their way, and all hell breaks loose.

I think people raised by narcissists need therapy more than just about any other group. It’s almost a “de-programming” function - so that when you start making excuses for your narcissistic parent, the therapist can give you a reality check. Also, once you truly, TRULY recognize your parent for the person she IS, someone needs to be there to help you through those emotions (anger, grief, fear, more anger, sadness, etc.).

If you have a problem with your current therapist, then switch. Find a male or a younger female, tell your current therapist that you have such a problem with mothering figures that you need to approach it in a different way. You CAN work through it with your current therapist but it’s going to add another layer of intensity onto what you are already dealing with, I think.

This is all so tragic.

p.s. A therapist told me, “You can never have the parents you WANTED, but you can BE that parent for your own kids.”

Perfect description of what it is like for the child/victim. Thank you.