What's wrong with marrying a non-virgin?

[Norseman82]

I’m not telling you that you should marry a non-virgin if you don’t want to. I am saying that there is nothing wrong with doing so - the original topic of this thread.

But here’s the problem - you see all the threads where virgins fret about their bf/gf’s past and they are often told that if they limited themselves to virgins, they would be limiting their pool af available people to choose from? Well, don’t you think the pool would be bigger if the non-virgins would stop stealing all the virgins?

Do the math.

God wants us to join in the celebration, not pout because we didn’t get a goat for being a “good son.”

Those “kid goats” are often necessary to get us through life, so don’t knock people for speaking up when they are unjustly denied one. After all, if the Greek widows didn’t “pout” there would be no diaconate today.

 

[hannajomar]

Norseman, a virgin does not owe it to all the other virgins to marry one of them. I believe that each virgin is more than capable of making this decision for themselves. If a virgin chooses to only marry another virgin, they are free to do that. But you can’t put that limitation on every other virgin out there just because you want a larger marriage pool.

 

[Norseman82]

Norseman, a virgin does not owe it to all the other virgins to marry one of them. I believe that each virgin is more than capable of making this decision for themselves. If a virgin chooses to only marry another virgin, they are free to do that. But you can’t put that limitation on every other virgin out there just because you want a larger marriage pool.

Then the problems will only continue and we’ll have more threads about virgins who complain that can’t find other virgins to marry. Lather, rinse, repeat.

At least I am proposing a solution.

 

[thewanderer]

I never said that non-virgins should not marry. There are plenty of fellow non-virgins for them to choose from - in fact, the pool there is probably bigger - so they should not have to steal from the pool of virgins. It reminds me of the parable that Nathan told David of the rich man who had a whole flock to choose from but instead robbed a lamb from the poor family and left the poor family with nothing.

Ummm as a virgin I object to being talked about as some object to be “stolen” or that someone is “entitled to”. I will freely commit myself to my fiance. If he were a non-virgin I would still freely commit myself to him. I would not have been “stolen”. I highly doubt that any virgin who married a non-virgin would appreciate being told that they did not, in fact, freely choose to commit themselves to their spouse, but were instead “stolen”.

To be frank, the language you use is very telling. Virgins are being “stolen” by non-virgins for marriage. Virgins are “entitled” to a virgin spouse. This kind of language is completely innapropriate for speaking about marriage as a freely given commitment of self to other. The fact that you insist on speaking this way sends the message that you either really don’t have a high regard for marriage or are just plain ignorant about what it is actually** is. **Maybe this is not the case, but that is the impression that your posts give because of your way of speaking about this sacrament. All I can say is thank goodness that I am not engaged to someone who thinks as you appear to. I could never marry someone who did not fully understand and respect the full meaning of marriage.

 

[thewanderer]

Norseman, a virgin does not owe it to all the other virgins to marry one of them. I believe that each virgin is more than capable of making this decision for themselves. If a virgin chooses to only marry another virgin, they are free to do that. But you can’t put that limitation on every other virgin out there just because you want a larger marriage pool.

Exactly. dvrc, the fact that you are trying to control the decisions of other virgins as to who they will marry just so that you can have a larger pool from which to choose a spouse is unbelievable. I am sorry but I am not about to let you influence my decision of who to give myself to freely just because you think it will give you a better chance of finding your own virgin (who you are apprantly entitled to ) to marry.

I will leave you with the words of Miss Bennet, justly upset at the interference of others in who she was to marry, an affair that was none of their buisness.

I am only resolved to act in that manner which will, in my own opinion, constitute my happiness, without reference to you, or to any person so wholly unconnected with me.

 

[Do_Good_Then_Go]

I never said that non-virgins should not marry. There are plenty of fellow non-virgins for them to choose from - in fact, the pool there is probably bigger - so they should not have to steal from the pool of virgins. It reminds me of the parable that Nathan told David of the rich man who had a whole flock to choose from but instead robbed a lamb from the poor family and left the poor family with nothing.

I’ve seen a few points of view on this board that make me go ‘wait, what???’ but the idea that non-virgins should be limited to other non-virgins so as to keep the pool of virgins larger for other virgins and that virgins deserve to marry a virgin as some sort of reward for ‘following the rules’ or ‘doing the right thing’ is truly bizarre and what’s more it almost sounds like a form of segregation. Virgins on this side of the room please, non-virgins on that side and remember, no mingling!

 

[austenbosten]

And I can understand why you feel so threatened:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=9940613&postcount=86

That’s pretty low dude, shame on you.

 

[hannajomar]

And I can understand why you feel so threatened:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=9940613&postcount=86

I think you need to look in the mirror, Norseman. You are the one who is threatened by all the virgin stealing. Austenbosten’s post illustrates humble gratitude for the forgiveness of his sins when he knows that he - like any sinner - doesn’t deserve it.
I, too, am blessed that my husband looked past my past and doesn’t lord it over my head that I committed a certain sin that he didn’t.

:banghead:

 

[Do_Good_Then_Go]

That’s pretty low dude, shame on you.

Yes, I agree.

 

[RyanBlack]

Sorry, but if you are serious about wanting people to obey the rules, you need to reward thoose who obey the rules, otherwise you are short-circuiting your efforts to get people to obey the rules. It’s human nature.

And do we eternally punish those who broke the rules, even when they no longer break them? Even when God has forgiven them?

 

[RyanBlack]

I never said that non-virgins should not marry. There are plenty of fellow non-virgins for them to choose from - in fact, the pool there is probably bigger - so they should not have to steal from the pool of virgins. It reminds me of the parable that Nathan told David of the rich man who had a whole flock to choose from but instead robbed a lamb from the poor family and left the poor family with nothing.

This is one of the most ridiculous posts I’ve ever read. If someone who is a virgin consents to marry someone who is not, there is no stealing involved. The analogy to Nathan’s confrontation of David is ludicrous-to put it kindly.

 

[RyanBlack]

Yes, I agree.

As do I.

 

[RyanBlack]

I have some proposals.

Those who struggle with gluttony may marry only others who struggle with gluttony.
Those who struggle with alcoholism may marry only others who struggle with alcoholism.
Those who struggle with anger may marry only others who struggle with anger.
Those who struggle with jealousy may marry only others who struggle with jealousy.
Those who struggle with forgiving may marry only others who struggle with forgiving.
Those who struggle with disobedience may only marry others who struggle with disobedience.
Those who struggle with pharasaical self-righteousness may marry only others who strubble with pharasaical self-righteousness.

 

[Marie1234]

Speaking from a virgin’s view point, I would much rather marry a man who is not a virgin but has repented and changed his life than a man who is a virgin and uses his virginity as a weapon to judge others with.

It does not matter what a person’s past is. The present and future matter. That’s what matters to God, and that’s what should matter to Christians.

Be careful to cast stones my friend, no one is perfect. Not even a virgin.

God Bless you Norsemen, I hope you will one day see the true beauty of forgiveness and love in your life.

 

[Marie1234]

Yep my girlfriend is one of them. I’m blessed to have her in my life.

 

[sweetpetunia]

It does not matter what a person’s past is. The present and future matter. That’s what matters to God, and that’s what should matter to Christians.

Be careful to cast stones my friend, no one is perfect. Not even a virgin.

God Bless you Norsemen, I hope you will one day see the true beauty of forgiveness and love in your life.

+1. Thanks, Marie. I think this thread needs to de-escalate in light of the unfortunate comments that were made, and your comment reminded me of 1 Peter 3:9: “Do not repay evil with evil or insult with insult, but with blessing, because to this you were called so that you may inherit a blessing.” Kudos for your kindness and gentle reminder. I am pretty sure that we can all benefit from it. I know I can.

Austen, I think you know that a lot of people on here think very highly of you and I count myself among them God bless you, friend.

Guys, I think we can find it in our hearts to cut Norseman a little slack. If you sense an undercurrent of frustration in his posts, a quick look back through some of his posts explains why. He once said he is old enough to be a parent to a person in his early twenties, and he is still waiting. He has a lot invested into this–his whole life, in fact. It’s difficult, it’s challenging, and I’m sure it must be disappointing at times. I know we all think his position is extreme,but we can understand him better if we look at how much he’s invested into this. I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that when Hosea took Gomer as his wife, a faithful Jewish girl somewhere was all “What the heck, Lord??? What. the. heck.” Especially if she had had her eye on the holy prophet. But Gomer, in a very special way, represents us, as she did Israel, and manifests God’s redeeming love. How blessed are we?

 

[David_Thorne]

I think the main reason I replied as harshly as I did was not because of the generalization, but because you seemed to be dismissing me as someone who just doesn’t understand what is being talked about, like a little child that you pat on the head and say, ‘thats ok sweetie, we get that you just don’t understand these things’ and then send them off for the real discussion to begin. Its quite possible you did not intend it to come across that way, and if I reacted too harshly I am sorry for doing so.

See, I am by no means saying that virginity isn’t important, so I hope you don’t think that that is what I am saying.

I agree entirely and have tried to make both of those points on this thread at different points depending on who I was replying. But if people are misstaking what is being said then it is good to make sure that this point is being made clearly. No one (so far as I can tell at least) is trying to say that you should go out of your way to find non-virgins so that you can show them mercy and marry them. Maybe the reason the responses on the thread come across as biased is because they are trying to answer the question of whether or not marrying a non-virgin is wrong. It makes sense that in answering that question they would emphasize mercy, because that explains why it is of course not wrong to do so. Thanks for stating it in such a nice clear way.

I can assure I was not intending to be dismissive.

On to the topic at hand:

If something doesn’t affect your decision, it is unimportant. If someone only wants to marry another person with blue eyes, then that is an important quality because it both affects and effects their decision.

On the topic of Norseman’s comments: I’ll give him a point for bringing up the “rewarding” of people who’ve strayed from chastity. I have witnessed on more than one occasion conversation amongst younger Christian men (20s) where the implicit understanding was that the devout woman they would marry, would, or would have to, accept their sexual indiscretions. So while I wouldn’t say those women are “rewarding” them, the men are assuming prior acceptance based upon something that has become nothing less than a social construct. The opposite isn’t necessarily true, though, and the fact that it isn’t so only reinforces the above; a woman cannot assume a man will accept her in light of previous sexual indiscretions - we arrive back at the little fact of “men lying up and women lying down”. Most people are aware that physical infidelity on the part of a wife in a marriage is normally a fatal blow to that marriage, but as for the other way around, it is simply not the case. This idea is almost institutional in Islam with “Nikah al-Mut’ah”; a temporary marriage for men to be “lawfully” sexual.

The question of the OP falls under the classic quote: “In theory, theory and practice are the same. In practice, they are not.”

 

[ValPal]

I never said that non-virgins should not marry. There are plenty of fellow non-virgins for them to choose from - in fact, the pool there is probably bigger - so they should not have to steal from the pool of virgins. It reminds me of the parable that Nathan told David of the rich man who had a whole flock to choose from but instead robbed a lamb from the poor family and left the poor family with nothing.

Stealing? Really?

IMHO, that is a egregiously warped view of sex and relationships. There is no “stealing” involved if a virgin and non-virgin decide to have a relationship, and quite frankly it’s none of anyone’s business. To compare the agreement of a virgin and non-virgin to date and get married to a crime is just ludicrous.

I certainly have great respect for those that wait, and certainly can understand why a virgin would want another virgin as a partner, since in many cases it is indicative of a strong underlying moral makeup. But the reality of the situation is that virginity alone guarantees nothing. There must be an underlying compatibility for a relationship to work.

 

[Patavium]

Norseman82,

You sound exactly like the elder son of the parable in Luke 15

[BIBLEDRB]Luke 15:21-32[/BIBLEDRB]

 

[Lucky7]

+1. Thanks, Marie. I think this thread needs to de-escalate in light of the unfortunate comments that were made, and your comment reminded me of 1 Peter 3:9: “Do not repay evil with evil or insult with insult, but with blessing, because to this you were called so that you may inherit a blessing.” Kudos for your kindness and gentle reminder. I am pretty sure that we can all benefit from it. I know I can.

Austen, I think you know that a lot of people on here think very highly of you and I count myself among them God bless you, friend.

Guys, I think we can find it in our hearts to cut Norseman a little slack. If you sense an undercurrent of frustration in his posts, a quick look back through some of his posts explains why. He once said he is old enough to be a parent to a person in his early twenties, and he is still waiting. He has a lot invested into this–his whole life, in fact. It’s difficult, it’s challenging, and I’m sure it must be disappointing at times. I know we all think his position is extreme,but we can understand him better if we look at how much he’s invested into this. I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that when Hosea took Gomer as his wife, a faithful Jewish girl somewhere was all “What the heck, Lord??? What. the. heck.” Especially if she had had her eye on the holy prophet. But Gomer, in a very special way, represents us, as she did Israel, and manifests God’s redeeming love. How blessed are we?

Somehow I don’t think the reason why he has been waiting so long is because non-virgins are stealing his virgins.