When did the raising your hands during the our father start?

  • Thread starter Thread starter dfp42
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
I first saw this ritual in our parish in 1988.
It has developed from there to become more an more disruptive. At some Masses the ushers go down to the front stand in the center of the aisle reaching across to both sides this signals the folks at the ends of the pews to the rear to move into the aisle. The objective is to form an unbroken chain of hands through the entire church. I have been met with rudeness and a bit of hostility when I have refused to participate in this illicit ritual.
 
dfp42 said:
How much longer until the Church is more forceful on straightening out these matters and others. The longer stuff like this goes on the more people have the power to run a muck and do whatever they feel like doing. Can’t the bishops just write a document to us so we know how to act in Church? Like basic conduct. For example when you enter the church you are to remain silent. When I was in first grade I had to do certain things in school that the teacher said and if I didn’t like it so what. It was the norm.
Click to expand...
Here is the document

vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/ccdds/documents/rc_con_ccdds_doc_20040423_redemptionis-sacramentum_en.html

Read the book of Jeremias. The Prophet was clear what God want, people disobeyed. They were perished only a remnant survived.

So will be with us.
 
I first seen this when a group of African dignataries visited our parish many years ago. They stood elbows by their side and their palms upwards so I always thought that this came from missionaries.
 
Deckie said:
I first seen this when a group of African dignataries visited our parish many years ago. They stood elbows by their side and their palms upwards so I always thought that this came from missionaries.
Click to expand...
Yesterday I noticed something similar at my parish.
It’s a wonderful parish - very devout and committed to serving God.

The parishoners are a diverse group: Chinese, Sri Lankan, Filipino,
Hispanic, Eastern European and lots of born-here of several races.
The priests are Irish, Nigerian, and former Protestant (married).

Because I could see variations in certain actions of those in
the pews, it occurred to me that maybe many had brought
‘customs from home.’ That’s very true of our music; the
instrumentation is varied and beautiful, some instruments
unknown to me but surely known to those playing them.
 
The practice started with the charismatic movement in the 1970s and has spread since that time.
 
karennascargo3 said:
As a fairly new Catholic, these types of things are very confusing to me. Do I follow what our congregation does and hold hands; or do I not (because it is not the right thing to do) and then appear to be uncharitable or too good to do so?

There are so very many things like this that keep coming up. Things like should women wear a headcovering, should the church be silent before mass, should there be applause, etc., etc., etc. There’s literally hundreds of these types of things in question.

I can’t help but keep wondering why these types of things are not resolved by the Catholic leadership or even the Pope himself?

Don’t these unanswered questions, or non-enforcement of established rules, only divide us as Catholics, create hard feelings and unneeded controversy, disrespectful to God, and make us appear uncreditble to the non-believing world? Shouldn’t the biggest drawing point and strength for Catholicism be unity and respect among and between our brothers and sisters in Christ?

I’m so totally confused and find myself wondering why in the world someone doesn’t do something to resolve these issues and let God’s work move forward. Perhaps I’m growing disillusioned with what I thought were people who cared about God’s agenda rather than our own. It just seems like all these issues could be resolved within literally minutes if someone would stand up and say – “this is how it is to be universally done. If you don’t like it, either live with it or find another denomination”.

I’m kind of getting so I don’t care one way or another, just someone make a decision and let’s move forward. I don’t mean to sound negative, I’m just so frustated and it all seems so unnecessary.
Click to expand...
Hi Karen (or Karenna?).
I hope you won’t get too discouraged.
The central issue might be that you are now a part
of very large Church.
The Catholic Church is enormous, as you know.
As I said in Post # 24, it’s likely that certain actions
float in from just about anywhere. It will take some
time for all to be ‘in sync.’ Yet it will happen.
Our faith, the Church, has been in existence for
two-thousand years. Over time, all will be properly
educated. As a convert, you might feel uninformed.
I promise that many lifelong Catholics feel the same!

God bless you.
 
roadsend said:
I first saw this ritual in our parish in 1988.
It has developed from there to become more an more disruptive. At some Masses the ushers go down to the front stand in the center of the aisle reaching across to both sides this signals the folks at the ends of the pews to the rear to move into the aisle. The objective is to form an unbroken chain of hands through the entire church. I have been met with rudeness and a bit of hostility when I have refused to participate in this illicit ritual.
Click to expand...
Some people on the end of the row will reach back in a contortionist, possibly painful, position in order to hold hands. I look down, or gesture that I have a cold to avoid this.
I agree that something needs to be done. Otherwise there will be young people growing up thinking “It’s always been this way”!
Our original priest would remind us REGULARLY that there was silence before mass, (narthex for visiting), no GUM chewing, and dress “appropriately” which can be very nit-picky to people who think flip-flops and shorts are fine.

Things can get out of control fast if the priest doesn’t LEAD.
With our current pastor, anything goes. The more noise and laughter the better. There is applause, he tells jokes throughout the homily, it has such a secular, Price is Right feel to it. Before he processes down the aisle, he is announced, Now let’s welcome our pastor Father G! Like he’s the MC of a talk show. After the final blessing, he yells, “Have a good week everybody!” Ugh.

Remember when people could shout out “prayer intentions” that were sometimes rambling, too detailed, and incoherent? At least that has been stopped.
 
catharina said:
Hi Karen (or Karenna?).
I hope you won’t get too discouraged.
The central issue might be that you are now a part
of very large Church.
The Catholic Church is enormous, as you know.
As I said in Post # 24, it’s likely that certain actions
float in from just about anywhere. It will take some
time for all to be ‘in sync.’ Yet it will happen.
Our faith, the Church, has been in existence for
two-thousand years. Over time, all will be properly
educated. As a convert, you might feel uninformed.
I promise that many lifelong Catholics feel the same!

God bless you.
Click to expand...
What a good answer. “The pendulum swings”, too. Hope I’m still around when it gets more normal. I, too, have read the V2 documents, and all the “experimenting” was never condoned.
 
Going to be sarcastic here…

I guess if it is not in the rubric I am going to start screaming “AMEN” when I want.

Any suggestion when is a good time to do so? During the homily?

The point that a lot people don’t get is that the mass is not about “US” it is about about Christ and the Lord above. We should never interject anything in the mass that is not spelled out or there.

There are a lot of things that are not in the rubric, so does it give us the right to add things?
 
ljprevo said:
Going to be sarcastic here…

I guess if it is not in the rubric I am going to start screaming “AMEN” when I want.

Any suggestion when is a good time to do so? During the homily?

The point that a lot people don’t get is that the mass is not about “US” it is about about Christ and the Lord above. We should never interject anything in the mass that is not spelled out or there.

There are a lot of things that are not in the rubric, so does it give us the right to add things?
Click to expand...
I say “Amen!” to your comment.
Don’t forget to shout, “Preach it, brother!” during the homily.
 
I found holding hands to be very disruptive. Some people like it, but I just don’t. 😦
 
ljprevo said:
Going to be sarcastic here…

I guess if it is not in the rubric I am going to start screaming “AMEN” when I want.

Any suggestion when is a good time to do so? During the homily?

The point that a lot people don’t get is that the mass is not about “US” it is about about Christ and the Lord above. We should never interject anything in the mass that is not spelled out or there.

There are a lot of things that are not in the rubric, so does it give us the right to add things?
Click to expand...
Katrina5 said:
I say “Amen!” to your comment.
Don’t forget to shout, “Preach it, brother!” during the homily.
Click to expand...
I’m gonna say
PLEASE don’t come to my parish!
 
lampstand said:
I found holding hands to be very disruptive. Some people like it, but I just don’t. 😦
Click to expand...
We don’t hold hands at our church, nor do we do the sign of peace.

Many visitors that come to our church are like “There was no sign of peace!!!” stomp, stomp, stomp feet.

They don’t realize that the sign of peace is optional in the rubric of the mass. We choose not to do it so there is no interruption during the consecration.

I heard the pope had entertained the idea of moving the sign of peace, that would be great.
 
Hopefully someday the Vatican can address the misunderstandings of what the understandings of Vatican II were supposed to be? It’s pretty obvious that this is what happened to our culture in the United States. I’m sure someday we are going to look back and ask ourselves what happened to our Catholic Church.
 
dfp42 said:
Hopefully someday the Vatican can address the misunderstandings of what the understandings of Vatican II were supposed to be? It’s pretty obvious that this is what happened to our culture in the United States. I’m sure someday we are going to look back and ask ourselves what happened to our Catholic Church.
Click to expand...
Who is looking back? I’m looking at it now and asking that question.
 
dfp42 said:
I don’t remember ever seeing this or being taught in Catholic school in the early 90’s. Is this an American thing that got added into the mass recently or do they teach this in Catholic schools now?
Click to expand...
I was actuallu surprised to find out this posture is encouraged in some of the eastern rites.
 
Katrina5 said:
What is your parish like, Catharina? I see you have a lot of posts, I could probably figure it out, right?😉
Click to expand...
First, see Post # 24.

Also, the church structure is old (in American terms, 150 yrs) and lovely.
Very old fashioned, stained glass windows honoring saints, carved
wooden stations of the cross. beautiful main altar and side chapel,
statues, etc…

does that answer your question?
 
Chatter163 said:
The practice started with the charismatic movement in the 1970s and has spread since that time.
Click to expand...
Raising hands during prayer was a common posture in the early CHurch, so no, it did not “start” in the 1970’s
 
catharina said:
First, see Post # 24.

Also, the church structure is old (in American terms, 150 yrs) and lovely.
Very old fashioned, stained glass windows honoring saints, carved
wooden stations of the cross. beautiful main altar and side chapel,
statues, etc…

does that answer your question?
Click to expand...
Thank you! Yes it does answer my question. I love the old churches, not just the beauty of stained glass, etc., but the sacred feeling they have.
I have just read two books by Michael S. Rose, one is called Ugly as Sin about modern, i.e. stuck in 1969, architecture. There were reasons for statues and stained glass-- beauty helps lead us to God.
We have been duped into thinking V2 had something to do with being more like Protestants.
A topic for another time.
Thank you again, I read #24.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top