where is the historical church founded by Jesus Christ?

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rev_kevin said:
In Matthew 16 when Jesus asked who do you say I am Peter answered, “You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God.” Why did he say that, because it was revealed to him by God who Jesus was and not by man. Then Jesus said that your are Peter or rock and upon this rock I will build my church. The church is Christ,:his body, his teachings and Peter understood this and because of his understanding Christ wanted him to spread his teachings. Then Peter was given the keys to the Kingdom or Heaven. Now these keys represent the authority to carry out church discipline, legislation and administration. To bring people to Christ by presenting them with the message of salvation found in God’s Word.
Then in Ephesians Paul describes the nature of the church. The church, under Christ’s control, is a living body, a family, a dwelling. Paul explains the wonderful things that we have received through Christ and refers to the church as a body, a temple, a bride, and a soldier. It says that God has put all things under the authority of Christ, and he gave him his authority for the benefit of the church, And the church is his body.
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And Christ gave ALL authority (on earth AND in heaven) to his Church (Matt. 16:15-19, 18:15-18, John 16:12-15, 20:21-23).
You always start off nice and trong, but you finish weak . . .
 
elvisman said:
Like I said - it doesn’t matter to me that presented your Baptist view - apparently, that’s all you know.
BUT - if you want to know the historical truth, read up on the Early Church Fathers. They’ve been proving you wrong on this entire thread . . .

Umm . . no - you’re a separated brother who remains divorced from the Body.

PS - I’ll bet you think that calling me “Sunshine” is annoying me. On the contrary!
Since you’re so angry, I guess I’ll have to call you a name befitting your demeanor. How about "Dark Cloud"? :rolleyes:
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Well I guess by now you know that I disagree with you. Not a big suprise. Oh by the way, the Baptist way is not the only thing I know, See I was raised Catholic almost became a priest but disagreed with most of the teachings. So its safe to say your wrong on this account. As far as the church fathers go, they have not proved me wrong but like I said you have to believe you are the only one who is right and it don’t matter to me. The sunshine name is because you bring sunshine to everyone you come into contact her. If you want to call me Dark Cloud go ahead because there is not light without darkness.
As long as someone believes in Christ and what he stands for you are not divorced from the body.
 
rev_kevin said:
Well I guess by now you know that I disagree with you. Not a big suprise. Oh by the way, the Baptist way is not the only thing I know, See I was raised Catholic almost became a priest but disagreed with most of the teachings. So its safe to say your wrong on this account. As far as the church fathers go, they have not proved me wrong but like I said you have to believe you are the only one who is right and it don’t matter to me. The sunshine name is because you bring sunshine to everyone you come into contact her. If you want to call me Dark Cloud go ahead because there is not light without darkness.
As long as someone believes in Christ and what he stands for you are not divorced from the body.
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I think the names should be the opposite. Rev you always bring a ray of sunshine in your posts. God Bless
 
elvisman said:
Whether or not somebody disagrees with it is irrelevant. The truth is the TRUTH.
Anti-Protestant?** Not at all - just the truth**.

You’re right. I can’t see myself moving away from the truth.
Just which part of this post do you find inaccurate?

**That’s the ***best *you can do? Come back when you have something of substance to contribute, instead of sophomoric ad hominems . . .​

What you call truth is just your opinion and destorted version too often.​

Sophomoric, you say. Gee I guess you don’t like looking at the truth even though you claim to know it. BTW, you don’t listen to reason so I guess speaking to you as a youngster is all you get.
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rev_kevin said:
So sunshine, which is it? You say you don’t care that I presented a Baptist view but your only problem is that I presented it, and TAUNTED you with it as the truth. Now sunshine, can I present my Baptist view like you present your Catholic view. Oh but we can’t because we will be taunting you Please cry me a river. But guess what sunshine, with or without your permission, which I don’t really need, I will continue to present my Baptist view as the truth and you can’t do nothing about it but gripe, whine, and say your famous words WORNG,and your anti-Catholic. Oh ya, ignorante/ignorance is used by you also.
Quess what sunshine, you did not demonish my view, you just showed everyone that you are able to contradict yourself by using quotes like I did, go figure you doing the same thing that you don’t like others to do, MY my sunshine I think you need to practice what you preach. and don’t accuse others of something, then turn around and to the same thing. Funny isn’t it sunshine, how you just exposed yourself as a do as I say, not as I do person, I can but you can’t kind of person.We divorced our selves from the family of God, WRONG, as you would say, I’m still in the family whether you believe if or not sunshine. Now can we get back to the subject?
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👍
 
MyRdmrLvs said:
Well im sure that people have decided that having a discussion with you was not worth the effort do to the difficulty in reading your posts as well as your uncharitable tone. If you then decide that because they stop offering answers that you have some how bested them with your brilliance then good on you! reminds me of the guys in wrestling who would not shower for a few days before a match. you dont seam to understand my previous points so I will wait and see if you want to put more effort into it. otherwise I will just let yuo think you have won yet another debate:thumbsup:
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👍
 
elvisman said:
And Christ gave ALL authority (on earth AND in heaven) to his Church (Matt. 16:15-19, 18:15-18, John 16:12-15, 20:21-23).
You always start off nice and trong, but you finish weak . . .
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Did not have time to finish what I was saying, I had to pick my son up from school.
Where was I, oh ya, If you look at Colossians here Paul clearly teaches that Christ paid for sin, that Christ has reconciled us to God. See Christ is the head of the body, and because Christ is God, he is the herd of the church, his true believers. Christ is the founder, the leader and the highest authority on earth. No person, group or church can reguard any loyalty as more critical that that of loyalty to Christ. See it says that Christ is the head of the church, his body and once again Paul says that the church is the body of Christ when he says I am glad when I suffer for you in my body, for I am completing what remains of Christ’s suffering for his body, the church. God has given me the responsibility of serving his church by proclaiming his message in all its fullness to you Gentiles. See the church is Christ not a man made oginization like all churches are. Even the CC. Then in Matthew Peter seemed to have gotten a big head because he took Jesus to the side and corrected him. That is when Jesus said to Peter, “Get away from me, Statn! You are a dangerous trap to me. You are seeing things merely from a mans point of view, and not from God’s.” See Peter is fallible How do we know that some of what he has taught in the early years are not from God but from man. How do we know that the teachings of the CC is not of God but of man. If Peter could me fallible then the CC can also be fallible. See thats why I say that the church is the body of Christ and all who believe in him, not a orginization made by man.
 
rev_kevin said:
Did not have time to finish what I was saying, I had to pick my son up from school.
Where was I, oh ya, If you look at Colossians here Paul clearly teaches that Christ paid for sin, that Christ has reconciled us to God. See Christ is the head of the body, and because Christ is God, he is the herd of the church, his true believers. Christ is the founder, the leader and the highest authority on earth. No person, group or church can reguard any loyalty as more critical that that of loyalty to Christ. See it says that Christ is the head of the church, his body and once again Paul says that the church is the body of Christ when he says I am glad when I suffer for you in my body, for I am completing what remains of Christ’s suffering for his body, the church. God has given me the responsibility of serving his church by proclaiming his message in all its fullness to you Gentiles. See the church is Christ not a man made oginization like all churches are. Even the CC. Then in Matthew Peter seemed to have gotten a big head because he took Jesus to the side and corrected him. That is when Jesus said to Peter, “Get away from me, Statn! You are a dangerous trap to me. You are seeing things merely from a mans point of view, and not from God’s.” See Peter is fallible How do we know that some of what he has taught in the early years are not from God but from man. How do we know that the teachings of the CC is not of God but of man. If Peter could me fallible then the CC can also be fallible. See thats why I say that the church is the body of Christ and all who believe in him, not a orginization made by man.
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👍
 
elvisman said:
And Christ gave ALL authority (on earth AND in heaven) to his Church (Matt. 16:15-19, 18:15-18, John 16:12-15, 20:21-23).
You always start off nice and trong, but you finish weak . . .
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So if all authority on earth and in heaven is given to the CC or as you say “the church” then this would mean that God gave up his authority on earth and in heaven and gave it to the CC correct? Does this mean that the church becomes God because God no longer has authority on earth and in heaven? So whatever Peter locks in earth will be locked in heaven and whatever he opens on earth will be open in heaven correct? Well what if Peter locked the wrong thing and opened the wrong thing after all we can see in verse 23 that he was seeing things merely from a humann point of view and not from God’s. So with this in mind the CC could be wrong in some of their teachings after all they did come from the rock.
 
rev_kevin said:
So if all authority on earth and in heaven is given to the CC or as you say “the church” then this would mean that God gave up his authority on earth and in heaven and gave it to the CC correct? Does this mean that the church becomes God because God no longer has authority on earth and in heaven? So whatever Peter locks in earth will be locked in heaven and whatever he opens on earth will be open in heaven correct? Well what if Peter locked the wrong thing and opened the wrong thing after all we can see in verse 23 that he was seeing things merely from a humann point of view and not from God’s. So with this in mind the CC could be wrong in some of their teachings after all they did come from the rock.
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Amen
 
Dokimas said:

What you call truth is just your opinion and destorted version too often.​

Sophomoric, you say. Gee I guess you don’t like looking at the truth even though you claim to know it. BTW, you don’t listen to reason so I guess speaking to you as a youngster is all you get.
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Nice cop out.
NNNNEXT!!
 
rev_kevin said:
So if all authority on earth and in heaven is given to the CC or as you say “the church” then this would mean that God gave up his authority on earth and in heaven and gave it to the CC correct? Does this mean that the church becomes God because God no longer has authority on earth and in heaven? So whatever Peter locks in earth will be locked in heaven and whatever he opens on earth will be open in heaven correct? Well what if Peter locked the wrong thing and opened the wrong thing after all we can see in verse 23 that he was seeing things merely from a humann point of view and not from God’s. So with this in mind the CC could be wrong in some of their teachings after all they did come from the rock.
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Ehhh! WRONG again.
Peter had the power in matters of doctrine - faith and morals, just aas the Pope does today. Verse 23 had nothing to do with that.
Hey - if you have a problem with Church Authority - take it up with Jesus. HE’S the one that gave it.
 
elvisman said:
Ehhh! WRONG again.
Peter had the power in matters of doctrine - faith and morals, just aas the Pope does today. Verse 23 had nothing to do with that.
Hey - if you have a problem with Church Authority - take it up with Jesus. HE’S the one that gave it.
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Kev, can’t you get it through your head that if it’s not what Elvis says then it’s wrong. You seem quite bright so why are you having such a hard time with this concept? :eek:
 
Dokimas said:
Kev, can’t you get it through your head that if it’s not what Elvis says then it’s wrong. You seem quite bright so why are you having such a hard time with this concept? :eek:
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Or do like I do ignore him, works best for me. He is a very rude person, so I don’t care a a bit what he says. And if you ignore he is just talking to himself.
 
tweetymom said:
Or do like I do ignore him, works best for me. He is a very rude person, so I don’t care a a bit what he says. And if you ignore he is just talking to himself.
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I would if I wasn’t a glutton for punishment. 😃
 
Dokimas said:
Very good comments. I don’t see a church where everyone sells all they have to help the needy. The CC like many ‘big’ churches have magnificent structures worth mega bucks. Seems far from the early church.
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Are you talking about all the Protestant that so big its in a footballand have 7 preachers
 
Bill_Pick said:
Are you talking about all the Protestant that so big its in a footballand have 7 preachers
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You know what they say, “If the shoe fits, wear it.” Translation: of course I’m speaking of them as well.
 
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