Who knows the contents of the Bible better, Catholics or non-Catholics?

[Miriam1947]

I just bought a great book from myself today. (I do, after all, own the store )

My Daily Catholic Bible. It is the NAB version of the Bible with daily readings which are about 20 minutes long. Since I have many Bibles I can also find the same readings in my other Bibles. Like the RSV-CE, you know, the Bible the Pope uses. I will be so very happy if the NAB finally goes away.

But this looks like a great way to read the whole Bible in bite sized pieces. One of my customers told me about it. She’s giving two of them as Christmas presents so I gave myself a Christmas present as well.

 

[guanophore]

It’s just a question:

Who knows the contents of the Bible better, the average Catholic or average non-Catholic?

Not really, CU. It is a way of pitting Catholics against Protestants in a “whose better” context. For a person who claims to be seekng “Christian Unity”, this type of thread really seems to contradict your polemic.

Or perhaps your username is just a ruse, and you are really not interested in Christian Unity at all?

Luke 22:24-27

24 A dispute also arose among them, which of them was to be regarded as the greatest. 25 And he said to them, "The kings of the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and those in authority over them are called benefactors. 26 But not so with you; rather let the greatest among you become as the youngest, and the leader as one who serves. 27 For which is the greater, one who sits at table, or one who serves? Is it not the one who sits at table? But I am among you as one who serves.

Competition does not serve the purpose of unity, nor is it Christlike.

 

[iloveangels]

Post Script

Here are some data showing “bible engagement” by Protestants:
(only 19% read the bible on a daily basis)

I would bet that it’s far lower than that for Catholics. After all, only about 20% of Catholics even bother to show up at mass weekly.

 

[iloveangels]

I think at this point in the discussion a most startling assertion should be made. So it is that Catholics as a scholarly group know a great deal more than the protestant group. Fr Ronald Knox has been mentioned of course as the greatest scholar of ancient literature that perhaps has ever lived. Many know of his translation of the complete vulgate. No comments need to be made on this point as his work has a self evidence all it’s own for those who have read him.

Let us not forget St Jerome. He was consulted in his day by rabbi’s and scholars in the jewish communities in order to clarify thier own texts of the Torah, Haftorah and the mishnas.

There never has been a protestant or protoprotestant, so far as I know, who has ever had this level of achievement or influence in all of history in as far as the scriptures are concerned

God Bless

Cicero54.

St. Jerome died a long time ago. He’s not in this survey. He was kind of cranky; in fact, he was renowned for his crankiness. If he was alive now, he’d be blasting Catholics to read Scripture and stop fooling around. He said, after all, “Ignorance of Scripture is ignorance of Christ.”

 

[Cicero54]

St. Jerome died a long time ago. He’s not in this survey. He was kind of cranky; in fact, he was renowned for his crankiness. If he was alive now, he’d be blasting Catholics to read Scripture and stop fooling around. He said, after all, “Ignorance of Scripture is ignorance of Christ.”

Equally Pope Leo XIII issued an encyclical making it a matter of indugence for Catholics to read the Bible at least fifteen minutes a day. It appears that you have niether read Pope Leo’s views on this issue nor have you gone very far into St Jeromes writings. If you like I will be very glad to enter into a discussion of the essential writings of this great doctor of the Church. In fact I throw the gauntlet down before your feet for the purpose.

What say you?

Cicero

 

[iloveangels]

Equally Pope Leo XIII issued an encyclical making it a matter of indugence for Catholics to read the Bible at least fifteen minutes a day. It appears that you have niether read Pope Leo’s views on this issue nor have you gone very far into St Jeromes writings. If you like I will be very glad to enter into a discussion of the essential writings of this great doctor of the Church. In fact I throw the gauntlet down before your feet for the purpose.

What say you?

Cicero

Divino Afflante Spiritu. Yes, I have.

The problem is not with Scripture, nor with what the Church has said about it. Rather, the problem is that Catholics are afraid of Scripture and do not study it, or even read it, no matter what the Church has said about it.

 

[guanophore]

Experience. Lots of it. I’m pretty much turned off right now. I’m still Catholic and I’m resolved to stay Catholic, but I am not amused. The Church in the US is a sloppy mess.

What are you doing to help build up the Church?

 

[guanophore]

I’m not really bitter. I’m disgusted.

Perhaps God is calling you through this. He was certainly disgusted with the money changers in the Temple. Perhaps you are able to bring some Truth to bear, and help the flock of God learn to feed upon His Word?

 

[iloveangels]

What are you doing to help build up the Church?

The ball is in your court. I have been told exactly one time too many that I am a convert and thus not able to help because I don’t qualify. Soooo… When I see a cradle Catholic get off their hind part and do this first, then I will be more interested. Until then, Cheers!

 

[guanophore]

The ball is in your court.

You mean it is up to me to address your sense of disgust with the Church?

 I have been told exactly one time too many that I am a convert and thus not able to help because I don't qualify.

This is very interesting. Who tells you such things? I would take such a statement as a sign that I needed to look elsewhere for my ministry…

I am glad that Scott Hahn did not take your attitude.

 Soooo... When I see a cradle Catholic get off their hind part and do this first, then I will be more interested.    Until then, Cheers!

Jesus told Peter to follow Him, and not concern himself with what the man behind him was doing (or not). I think we are all given a share of talents, and it is incumbent upon us to put them to work (not bury them).

The disgust you express seems to be a powerful indicator that you need to act.

If you had not been told you don’t “qualify” because you are a convert what would you have done?

 

[iloveangels]

You mean it is up to me to address your sense of disgust with the Church?

Nope. If Catholics don’t care about the bible, then it’s not my job to do anything about it. I’m tired of the whole thing.

 

[guanophore]

Nope. If Catholics don’t care about the bible, then it’s not my job to do anything about it. I’m tired of the whole thing.

Hmmm.

I know there are way too many Catholics that don’t care about the Bible,but I also know that there are some who are virtually spiritually starving because they have never learned to feed themselves from it. I used to be one of them. Thank God He used some of my separated brethren to teach me how to ready, study, and pray the Scriptures.

You are right, you cannot “make” anyone care about Scripture, but you can infect others with an enthusiasm for the Word, and share your passion of it. You can pray and search for where God wants to use your passion for Scripture.

Getting “tired of the whole thing” us usually a result of our ego getting involved in the ministry to which God has called us. Granted, ego is what enables us to invest in things, but ego can also cause us to be disconnected from what God has called us to do. I think people don’t get disgusted with something unless they are being called to address it.

 

[iloveangels]

Hmmm.

I know there are way too many Catholics that don’t care about the Bible,but I also know that there are some who are virtually spiritually starving because they have never learned to feed themselves from it. I used to be one of them. Thank God He used some of my separated brethren to teach me how to ready, study, and pray the Scriptures.

You are right, you cannot “make” anyone care about Scripture, but you can infect others with an enthusiasm for the Word, and share your passion of it. You can pray and search for where God wants to use your passion for Scripture.

Getting “tired of the whole thing” us usually a result of our ego getting involved in the ministry to which God has called us. Granted, ego is what enables us to invest in things, but ego can also cause us to be disconnected from what God has called us to do. I think people don’t get disgusted with something unless they are being called to address it.

I don’t think I’m being called to address it. I think that’s pretty clear. Most Catholics like it the way it is.

 

[guanophore]

I don’t think I’m being called to address it. I think that’s pretty clear. Most Catholics like it the way it is.

The fact that God is calling you to use your gifts in service to His Body has no relation to how “most Catholics” respond, or fail to respond. You are responsible to God,and will answer to Him for whatever He has called you to do with your talents and gifts. The approval or response of others is irrelevant.

 

[iloveangels]

The fact that God is calling you to use your gifts in service to His Body has no relation to how “most Catholics” respond, or fail to respond. You are responsible to God,and will answer to Him for whatever He has called you to do with your talents and gifts. The approval or response of others is irrelevant.

I don’t think I’m being called to do anything about it, guanophore. There are two predominant responses to any comment about lack of programs/activities etc in the Catholic Church, especially when those comments are made by a convert. And they’re both complete artifacts of the culture:

1. You’re a convert, therefore you’re not quite over being a Protestant, therefore you’re evil, hiss, hiss, OR
2. Guess what? God is calling you to fix it and you are now on the hook. But when you try to fix it, it reverts to choice #1, because no one really wants anything fixed.

No, if this is going to get fixed, it’s going to have to be somebody else who does it. Not me. God isn’t calling me. This is just a quirk of Catholic culture.

 

[guanophore]

I don’t think I’m being called to do anything about it, guanophore.

And actually, your thought that you are not being called may not be relevant either. Jonah was sure that the Ninevites would not respond, so did not want to Go. That did not prevent God from sending him.

And when he continued to refuse the call, he got into some really deep water.

If you are disgusted about the apathy over His Word, how must Jesus feel? He grieved over those who rejected Him, and abandoned Him. Perhaps you are participating in His suffering for His own people who do not receive Him through His Holy Word?

 

[iloveangels]

And actually, your thought that you are not being called may not be relevant either. Jonah was sure that the Ninevites would not respond, so did not want to Go. That did not prevent God from sending him.

And when he continued to refuse the call, he got into some really deep water.

If you are disgusted about the apathy over His Word, how must Jesus feel? He grieved over those who rejected Him, and abandoned Him. Perhaps you are participating in His suffering for His own people who do not receive Him through His Holy Word?

I’m not Jonah. Like I said, this is just one of the many quirks of Catholic culture.

 

[guanophore]

  There are two predominant responses to any comment about lack of programs/activities etc in the Catholic Church, especially when those comments are made by a convert.  And they're both complete artifacts of the culture:

1. You’re a convert, therefore you’re not quite over being a Protestant, therefore you’re evil, hiss, hiss, OR

Wow. I have never heard a Catholic say such a thing. How AWFUL is that?

1. Guess what? God is calling you to fix it and you are now on the hook. But when you try to fix it, it reverts to choice #1, because no one really wants anything fixed.

You seem to be discouraged, and it does not sound like you have gotten much supports for your efforts. I agree, it is cultural.

However, that still does not get you “off the hook” so to speak, since it is God’s hook you are on, not the Catholic cultural artifact hook. We all have to ask, seek, and knock until our individual vocation comes into clarity. If you have tried doorknobs and they don’t turn, then you have to move on.

No, if this is going to get fixed, it’s going to have to be somebody else who does it. Not me. God isn’t calling me. This is just a quirk of Catholic culture.

God has called each and every one of us. We all have a role to play to build up the Body of Christ. You are right, you are not able to “fix” the apathy of other Catholics, but you have a responsibilty to keep your lamp burning. As St. Christopher says, it is better to light a single candle than to curse the darkness.

1 Cor 12:14-26

14 For the body does not consist of one member but of many. 15 If the foot should say, “Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body,” that would not make it any less a part of the body. 16 And if the ear should say, “Because I am not an eye, I do not belong to the body,” that would not make it any less a part of the body. 17 If the whole body were an eye, where would be the hearing? If the whole body were an ear, where would be the sense of smell? 18 But as it is, God arranged the organs in the body, each one of them, as he chose. 19 If all were a single organ, where would the body be? 20 As it is, there are many parts, yet one body. 21 The eye cannot say to the hand, “I have no need of you,” nor again the head to the feet, “I have no need of you.” 22 On the contrary, the parts of the body which seem to be weaker are indispensable, 23 and those parts of the body which we think less honorable we invest with the greater honor, and our unpresentable parts are treated with greater modesty, 24 which our more presentable parts do not require. But God has so composed the body, giving the greater honor to the inferior part, 25 that there may be no discord in the body, but that the members may have the same care for one another. 26** If one member suffers, all suffer together; if one member is honored, all rejoice together.**

Because we are members one of another, our choices affect each other. The apathy about Scripture causes you disgust. Your refusal to answer the call of God will affect other members of His body as well.

1 Cor 7:7
But each has his own special gift from God, one of one kind and one of another.

We must each discover and use our gifts, for we will be judged upon whether we did this, or not.

When we are acting in accordance with our gifts and calling, we will have rightousness, peace and joy. Disgust is not one of the fruits of the Spirit, which means that it has another purpose. For those who love the Lord, all things work together for the good, so this disgust and discouragement you feel is intended for your good, and therefore, to the good of His Body.

 

[guanophore]

I’m not Jonah. Like I said, this is just one of the many quirks of Catholic culture.

No, you are not. You have a gift and a calling that is appropriate to your station in life.

I guess you are right, it is a quirk of Catholic culture. We believe the Apostles taught that every member of the body is connnected to every other member, and that we all are called to bear one another’s burdens. That means you are called upon to bear the burdens of those who lack enthusiasm for the Word of God, and to pray for them without losing hope.

 

[iloveangels]

Wow. I have never heard a Catholic say such a thing. How AWFUL is that?

Pretty awful. I often don’t mention being a convert because of the reaction it can get from some people.

You seem to be discouraged, and it does not sound like you have gotten much supports for your efforts. I agree, it is cultural.

Yup. A lot of Catholics really like it this way, no matter how much complaining they do. There are a lot of defense mechanisms in play.

However, that still does not get you “off the hook” so to speak, since it is God’s hook you are on, not the Catholic cultural artifact hook. We all have to ask, seek, and knock until our individual vocation comes into clarity. If you have tried doorknobs and they don’t turn, then you have to move on.

Ask and you shall receive, seek and you will find, knock and it shall be opened unto you. If God wants things to happen, he makes it possible. I’m not finding it possible.

God has called each and every one of us. We all have a role to play to build up the Body of Christ. You are right, you are not able to “fix” the apathy of other Catholics, but you have a responsibilty to keep your lamp burning. As St. Christopher says, it is better to light a single candle than to curse the darkness.

1 Cor 12:14-26

14 For the body does not consist of one member but of many. 15 If the foot should say, “Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body,” that would not make it any less a part of the body. 16 And if the ear should say, “Because I am not an eye, I do not belong to the body,” that would not make it any less a part of the body. 17 If the whole body were an eye, where would be the hearing? If the whole body were an ear, where would be the sense of smell? 18 But as it is, God arranged the organs in the body, each one of them, as he chose. 19 If all were a single organ, where would the body be? 20 As it is, there are many parts, yet one body. 21 The eye cannot say to the hand, “I have no need of you,” nor again the head to the feet, “I have no need of you.” 22 On the contrary, the parts of the body which seem to be weaker are indispensable, 23 and those parts of the body which we think less honorable we invest with the greater honor, and our unpresentable parts are treated with greater modesty, 24 which our more presentable parts do not require. But God has so composed the body, giving the greater honor to the inferior part, 25 that there may be no discord in the body, but that the members may have the same care for one another. 26** If one member suffers, all suffer together; if one member is honored, all rejoice together.**

Because we are members one of another, our choices affect each other. The apathy about Scripture causes you disgust. Your refusal to answer the call of God will affect other members of His body as well.

I’m involved in some things and trying to figure out what comes next, guanophore. It’s not yet clear.

1 Cor 7:7
But each has his own special gift from God, one of one kind and one of another.

We must each discover and use our gifts, for we will be judged upon whether we did this, or not.

When we are acting in accordance with our gifts and calling, we will have rightousness, peace and joy. Disgust is not one of the fruits of the Spirit, which means that it has another purpose. For those who love the Lord, all things work together for the good, so this disgust and discouragement you feel is intended for your good, and therefore, to the good of His Body.

Thank you.