Whore of Babylon

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On her hands is all the blood ever shed on earth.

First murder was Abel. Must be Eve. She ‘got herself a man’
Cain’s line set out to destroy Adam’s line. Oedipus complex.
It’s family baggage.
 
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Lorarose:
There’s just one teensy weensy problem with this “seven hills” business.
The city of Rome itself sits on seven hills.

Vatican city sits across the Tiber River away from the city.
Vatican city DOES NOT sit on seven hills.

The whore is a city. Most assume it is Rome, while some make the arguement for Jerusalem.
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She could be both Rome and Jerusalem. 1Cor 6.16 "Do you not know that he who joins himself to a prostitute becomes one body with her. For,as it is written, ‘The two shall become one’ ".
 
“Anyone have any idea on what “hill” Lateran stands? I’d sure like to know. Some fundamentalists might get smart and point out that “oh, but you Catholics admit that the seat of the Papacy is the Lateran and not the Vatican, and the Lateran is on blah blah blah therefore whore of Babylon blah blah blah…””

Good point.
Any “whore of Babylon” folks I’ve run into have assumed that the Vatican sits on the seven hills -and that is why the RCC qualifies as the “whore”
In fact - when I was in a particular protestant bookstore a few years ago - I found books on “Romanism” in the “cult” section, and one pamphlet made exactly this claim - that the Vatican sits on seven hills. Only problem is…it doesn’t.

As for the seat of the papacy…I did not know the “seat” was in the Lateran - I always thought it was in St. Peter’s.

I’m not sure what others would say - but my response would be that the Lateran does not sit on seven hills - but the city of Rome does.
The whore sits on seven hills.
This can only apply to a city that encompasses those seven hills.

I would ask them to point out all the seven hills that the Lateran sits on.
 
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Maranatha:
Did Martin Luther himself advance that theory? I understand that he moved Revelations out of his Bible and to an unnumbered appendix.

It was later protestents that moved the book back in.
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True he seperated Revelation from the new testametn canon along with James and some other books. Initially his preface to Revelation slammed the book as non-sense but in Later editions he wrote about how the book was useful and revelant especially to promote the catholic church as the whore of Babylon and the church as anti-christ. So when he could find a political purpose for the book he did change his negative view of the book to a postive one. He never did put it into the canonical sextion of his Bible though. Although his preface became more favorable and he used it often to prove in his mind anyway that he was living in the last days and they were battling the beast and anti-christ of revelation the Pope and that the due to her corruption and worldliness the catholic church ceased to be the bride of christ but now became the whore of Babylon. Well 500 years later we are still chuggin along waiting for the Pope to turn into the anti-christ.
Luther was wrong but other prots keep on accusing us of the same old song.
 
how about this. the seven hills are the seven continents.

It is a worlwide religion. Idolatry. Unconscious love of things mistakenly attached to people.
 
Lorarose said:
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[snip]
In fact - when I was in a particular protestant bookstore a few years ago - I found books on “Romanism” in the “cult” section, and one pamphlet made exactly this claim - that the Vatican sits on seven hills. Only problem is…it doesn’t.

As for the seat of the papacy…I did not know the “seat” was in the Lateran - I always thought it was in St. Peter’s.

I’m not sure what others would say - but my response would be that the Lateran does not sit on seven hills - but the city of Rome does.
The whore sits on seven hills.
This can only apply to a city that encompasses those seven hills.

I would ask them to point out all the seven hills that the Lateran sits on.
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Ancient Rome, the one within the old walls, sits on seven hills. The Vatican is outside those walls on a separate hill. If the Pope’s bishopric covers Rome and the Vatican, then it covers eight hills.
 
“Babylon” is an early Christian code-word for Rome. It is used in many early Christian documents – for example, 1 Peter 5,12-14

12 I write you this briefly through Silvanus, whom I consider a faithful brother, exhorting you and testifying that this is the true grace of God. Remain firm in it. 13 The chosen one at Babylon sends you greeting, as does Mark, my son. 14 Greet one another with a loving kiss. Peace to all of you who are in Christ.

Clearly, “the chosen one at Bablyon” is the Church in Rome. In Revelations, John’s description of Babylon with seven hills makes it plain – the real Babylon was flat, and Rome is famous as the “City of Seven Hills.”

Rome in those days meant the Roman Empire, not the Church – which was a tiny sect persecuted by the authorities. Christians drew a parallel between the Babylonian Captivity of the Jews (in the 6th Century BC) and the rule of the Roman Empire, which held all people captive.

It would be hundreds of years before “Rome” would come to be synonimous with “Catholic Church.” Protestants who don’t know history like to pretend that a First Century Christian would mean the Catholic Church when referring “Rome,” but rather the Roman Empire.
 
vern humphrey said:
“Babylon” is an early Christian code-word for Rome. It is used in many early Christian documents – for example, 1 Peter 5,12-14

12 I write you this briefly through Silvanus, whom I consider a faithful brother, exhorting you and testifying that this is the true grace of God. Remain firm in it. 13 The chosen one at Babylon sends you greeting, as does Mark, my son. 14 Greet one another with a loving kiss. Peace to all of you who are in Christ.

Clearly, “the chosen one at Bablyon” is the Church in Rome. In Revelations, John’s description of Babylon with seven hills makes it plain – the real Babylon was flat, and Rome is famous as the “City of Seven Hills.”

Rome in those days meant the Roman Empire, not the Church – which was a tiny sect persecuted by the authorities. Christians drew a parallel between the Babylonian Captivity of the Jews (in the 6th Century BC) and the rule of the Roman Empire, which held all people captive.

It would be hundreds of years before “Rome” would come to be synonimous with “Catholic Church.” Protestants who don’t know history like to pretend that a First Century Christian would mean the Catholic Church when referring “Rome,” but rather the Roman Empire.
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:clapping: :tiphat: 👍
 
the Office of the Pope was identified as the anti-christ.
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And they also claim that the anti-Christ (666) is the Pope.

Ok then, let’s examine what this “666” does. It says in the Book of Revelation 13:5-6; “The beast was given a mouth uttering proud boasts and blasphemies, and it was given authority to act for forty-two months. It opened its mouth to utter blasphemies against God, blaspheming his name and his dwelling and those who dwell in heaven.”

Now, looking at the verse above, can these Protestants claiming that the Pope is 666 prove that the present Pope, and all popes in history, ever uttered blasphemies and boasts against God?

Pio
 
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hlgomez:
And they also claim that the anti-Christ (666) is the Pope.

Ok then, let’s examine what this “666” does. It says in the Book of Revelation 13:5-6; “The beast was given a mouth uttering proud boasts and blasphemies, and it was given authority to act for forty-two months. It opened its mouth to utter blasphemies against God, blaspheming his name and his dwelling and those who dwell in heaven.”

Now, looking at the verse above, can these Protestants claiming that the Pope is 666 prove that the present Pope, and all popes in history, ever uttered blasphemies and boasts against God?

Pio
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The “Beast” is fairly clearly the Roman Emperor. Revelation was written from Patmos (a prison island) during Domitian’s Persecution. Domitian was the second Emperor to officially persecute Christians - - Nero was the first.

Nero committed suicide, and there was a legend he would come back (the legend of Nero Revividus.) Domitian was like Nero in many ways (especially to Christians!)

If you look at the description of the Beast, he has a healed wound in the throat – Nero committed suicide by stabbing himself in the throat. The second beast makes the Nero-Domitian link pretty clear.

John uses the Pythagorian system to arrive at “the number oif the beast.” Irenaeus, who got his information from Polycarp, (who knew John) says John reckons according to the Greek (Pythagorian) system.

In ancient times, there were no separate symbols for numbers – letters were used instead. A man’s name could be read as a number, and Pythagoras had devised a system to translate the numbers into something that would supposedly tell you about the man.

The Greek form of Nero’s name would yield “666” when written in Hebrew. In the Pythathagorian system, the number 6 is “incomplete, imperfect, bad.” The triple repitition – “bad, bad, bad” is applied to Nero.

Now, we can’t PROVE John meant Nero (and Domitian) but in the earliest latin versions of Revelation, the number is given as “616” – which is what you get from the Latin version of Nero’s name.
 
<The Greek form of Nero’s name would yield “666” when written in Hebrew. In the Pythathagorian system, the number 6 is “incomplete, imperfect, bad.” The triple repitition – “bad, bad, bad” is applied to Nero.

Now, we can’t PROVE John meant Nero (and Domitian) but in the earliest latin versions of Revelation, the number is given as “616” – which is what you get from the Latin version of Nero’s name.>

I had read that “616” appeared in earlier translations - but I never learned why.
Thank you.
That’s what I love about our Catholic faith - the more I learn the more it makes perfect logical sense.
 
Why on earth would people call the Church that? That’s pathetic! Maybe I should join a non-Catholic group and ask them why they think that, eh?😉
 
More anti-Catholic hatred that has been carried on since the days of Martin Luther. They feel the need to defame the Church in order to to validate themselves. :whacky:
 
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Malachi4U:
Like anti-Catholic bigots? You’ll love these sites:

http://www.bible.ca/catholic.htm

http://jesus-is-lord.com/anti1.htm

Of course, to believe what these sites above claim you must interpret Scripture the way they say and leave parts of it out and add things they want.

Forgive them and pray for them.
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quite the marketing technique. Music right out of Doom. I thought the huge red letters on black a nice touch. I think Satan just loves the imagery they use to represent him. Obviously evil
Great marketing for hiding his work.

I
 
Lorarose said:
<The Greek form of Nero’s name would yield “666” when written in Hebrew. In the Pythathagorian system, the number 6 is “incomplete, imperfect, bad.” The triple repitition – “bad, bad, bad” is applied to Nero.

Now, we can’t PROVE John meant Nero (and Domitian) but in the earliest latin versions of Revelation, the number is given as “616” – which is what you get from the Latin version of Nero’s name.>

I had read that “616” appeared in earlier translations - but I never learned why.
Thank you.
That’s what I love about our Catholic faith - the more I learn the more it makes perfect logical sense.
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Just for specifics, Nero’s title in Greek (the language of Revelation) was Neron Caesar, which in Hebrew is NRWN QSR. In Latin, it is of course Nero Caesar or NRW QSR. In Hebrew, N=50, thus the discrepancy in 666/616.
 
Paris Blues:
Why on earth would people call the Church that? That’s pathetic! Maybe I should join a non-Catholic group and ask them why they think that, eh?😉
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Aaahhhh, Paris. Don’t go there at this point in your career. You need to concentrate on your relationship with Christ right now. :love:
 
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Benadam:
On her hands is all the blood ever shed on earth.

First murder was Abel. Must be Eve. She ‘got herself a man’
Cain’s line set out to destroy Adam’s line. Oedipus complex.
It’s family baggage.
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Thanks. Is this what the whore of Babylon did, does, will do? Is location the only thing that qualifies us as the whore of Babylon?
 
mark a:
Thanks. Is this what the whore of Babylon did, does, will do? Is location the only thing that qualifies us as the whore of Babylon?
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Hi Mark,

No. The fact that the Catholic Church didn’t reject truth from sources outside of it’s own heritage qualifies it to those not broad minded to tell the difference between Truth and it’s imitation. This makes the Church the whore in that she looks idolatrous to them.

Also the fact that the feminine spirit it’s a symbol of is a personal projection of Eve. The fall disordered the quality or the proper orientation of human bonds. The maternal care given to Cain was tainted with the fears and consequent needs of his mother. The Mother child bond becomes the primary bond because it is not part of the freedom of self determination lost by sin. Since this bond is the precursor to reforming the self determined bond of Holy Matrimony it must be re-established in perfection in order that the bond of marriage and all bonds between persons can be made perfect. This is the importance of Mary’s perfection and sinless womb. The materal care that Cain recieved made Eve and her son an archetype of the male female bond. It is the source of the Whore riding the beast. The oedipus complex as well. So Mary becomes the New Woman who re-establishes that bond between man and woman by virtue of a sinless womb and perfect human love to her son. This recognition of Mary’s role in salvation history makes catholicism look pagan too. It is unfortunately this maternal dynamic has been expressed in the cultures that sprouted from Cain but not as the whore riding a beast but as nature worshipped by man. These cultures are limited to the created world in their understanding of God. They can rise to a pantheistic view of God at best. There’s alot more to the story if you wish. in case i’m blabbing on I give it a rest .
 
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