Who's Going to Pay the Bills?: Purpose-Driven Coronavirus Business Shutdowns Cause Economic Catastrophe

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LisaB:
Don’t get me wrong, if the government has extra money to give away, I’ll take it,
Because of THAT mentality RIGHT THERE! GIMME, GIMME, GIMME!!!
And to hell with the future or integrity, right?!
Relax. All I was saying is that the money would have been better spent if it was allocated only for the people who were actually economically affected by the pandemic. Those people could have also gotten a bigger check, making more of a difference to them. Giving a little bit to everyone, especially those still working, is a waste of government money.
 
You may think it’s wrong. I think it’s right. VN tore the country apart for years and years. But people (you?) are being very nonchalant about 59,000+ covid -19 deaths. I really don’t get that. Esp. since I’m going to make the assumption that the same people who are rabidly anti-abortion are the ones saying, “Hey, it’s only 59,000+ deaths! What’s the big deal?”
For me I think it’s logically inconsistint to be pro abortion and pro COVID restrictions and those imposing them here are pro abortion so I go out when I want to and if I run into a pro abortion politician my actions may end up in me being arrested.
 
Good job bringing important questions into the topic.
First, there was the WHO’s now famous declaration on January 14th:


World Health Organization (WHO)
@WHO

Then, there was Trump quick travel ban, despite knowing leftists would call him xenophobic:


In early and late February, while thousands of coronavirus cases were confirmed across the world, WHO bureaucrats continuously urged nations NOT to impose travel bans.
“WHO continues to advise against the application of travel or trade restrictions to countries experiencing COVID-19 outbreaks,” an official WHO statement from February 29 reads.
Despite WHO bureaucrats stopping the experts from recommending travel bans to nations looking to keep the coronavirus from spreading, President Trump moved forward with travel bans on China and Iran within weeks of the first confirmed case in the U.S.
 
Then, there was Trump quick travel ban, despite knowing leftists would call him xenophobic:
First off it’s racist because you are pretending that separating them from us solves problems. A travel ban is only effective if it’s for everyone. Otherwise a guy goes to the Philippines, gets say an waitress sick who served an Australian who then goes home and shares a beer with his son who then next day boards a plane to the US for school.

Lest we locked out China! Go team.
 
First, there was the WHO’s now famous declaration on January 14th:
…which was before anybody knew better, so there is no reason to single out the WHO.
Then, there was Trump quick travel ban…
…which was low-hanging fruit. It did not inconvenience Americans, and it fed Trump’s base who likes any excuse to exclude foreigners.
Breitbart:
world-health-organization-stopped-medical-experts-from-recommending-coronavirus-travel-bans
Instead of focusing on the one-sentence summary, let’s look at the entire WHO statement of Feb. 29:
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WHO:
In general, evidence shows that restricting the movement of people and goods during public health emergencies is ineffective in most situations and may divert resources from other interventions. Furthermore, restrictions may interrupt needed aid and technical support, may disrupt businesses, and may have negative social and economic effects on the affected countries. However, in certain circumstances, measures that restrict the movement of people may prove temporarily useful, such as in settings with few international connections and limited response capacities.

Travel measures that significantly interfere with international traffic may only be justified at the beginning of an outbreak, as they may allow countries to gain time, even if only a few days, to rapidly implement effective preparedness measures. Such restrictions must be based on a careful risk assessment, be proportionate to the public health risk, be short in duration, and be reconsidered regularly as the situation evolves.

Travel bans to affected areas or denial of entry to passengers coming from affected areas are usually not effective in preventing the importation of cases but may have a significant economic and social impact. Since WHO declaration of a public health emergency of international concern in relation to COVID-19, and as of 27 February, 38 countries have reported to WHO additional health measures that significantly interfere with international traffic in relation to travel to and from China or other countries, ranging from denial of entry of passengers, visa restrictions or quarantine for returning travellers. Several countries that denied entry of travellers or who have suspended the flights to and from China or other affected countries, are now reporting cases of COVID-19.
Far from being a casual dismissal of the risks of the virus, the WHO statement shows a careful balance between the needs of containing the virus and the needs for economic activity to sustain life - not unlike the balancing act that is going on right now as domestic stay-at-home orders are being lifted in order to maintain economic activity. It seems a bit unfair to blame the WHO for taking into account the same factors that many US leaders are taking into account right now.

And then there is Trump, who for no good reason muddies the waters by setting guidelines for reopening the economy, and then issuing tweets that incite his followers to oppose those same guidelines, like “Liberate (…fill in a state with a Democratic governor…)”.
 
Nothing like a liberal to scream racism. RAAAAACISM! Everything is racism. You must have the Saul Alinsky’s Rules for Radicals book memorized.
 
“WHO continues to advise against the application of travel or trade restrictions to countries experiencing COVID-19 outbreaks,” an official WHO statement from February 29 reads.
Despite WHO bureaucrats stopping the experts from recommending travel bans
Do a search under “Do travel bans work.” The experts say they delay the spread of a disease–maybe up to a week or two–but they don’t stop it.

For example: https://www.livescience.com/coronavirus-travel-restrictions-effectiveness.html

But for all the conservatives here, here is a March 23 article from the Cato Institute, definitely a conservative think tank: https://www.cato.org/blog/travel-restrictions-spread-covid-19-what-does-research-say

Their conclusions? “The existing literature finds that travel restrictions likely delayed the spread of COVID-19 internationally by a short period of time, from a few days to several weeks.”

Then they ask the next logical question: Did the US travel ban matter? And they concluded that a) it was too full of holes (excluded US citizens, etc.) and b) it was way too late–it had already spread around the world, so excluding travellers from China still exposed the US to Iranians, Italians, etc. c) it was counter-productive because it lulled people into a false sense of security–“it likely undid any benefits by delaying other actions.”

Meanwhile other countries were MUCH more effective. For example here is a CDC evaluation of Singapore’s (1,169 cases, but only 14 deaths) measures: Evaluation of the Effectiveness of Surveillance and Containment Measures for the First 100 Patients with COVID-19 in Singapore — January 2–February 29, 2020 | MMWR

Taiwan is the poster child of how to deal with a pandemic (429 cases, 6 deaths, and a population of 24 million) And a 7-minute video from PBS Newshour followed two ex-pat Taiwanese coming back to Taiwan–one from the UK and one from Australia. See what Taiwan does. Then compare it to the US… Taiwan’s aggressive efforts are paying off in fight against COVID-19 | PBS NewsHour
 
Nothing like a liberal to scream racism. RAAAAACISM! Everything is racism. You must have the Saul Alinsky’s Rules for Radicals book memorized.
I’m not liberal for one and secondly I explained why closing the boarders to specific countries is counter productive.
So, that only leaves the bad reasons. We (being Americans in this case) closed the boarder to Iran and China because it looks good in the polls. It appeases the voters and propagates racial under tones, deliberately or not.
 
First, there was the WHO’s now famous declaration on January 14th:
Yes. WHO gets their information from the Chinese authorities. They lied about SARS. Gee, do you think they would lie again? Would you want to bet tens of thousands of lives on your guess?

Again, compare Taiwan. Dec. 31 they realized something fishy was going on in Wuhan. Within a couple DAYS they sent two of their own doctors to Wuhan to check it out (Taiwan doesn’t belong to the WHO because of Chinese opposition). The doctors came back, basically told the health authorities, “This is going to be bad.” And Taiwan sprung into action. About two MONTHS before almost everyone else. And Taiwan has a law that hospitals must stock at least 1 month’s supplies in case of emergency. And they had a plan.
Imagine that!

Result? 429 cases, 6 deaths in a population of 24 million. Good work!
 
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A final post this morning. Yet more facts! NO opinions! Remember Trump saying “no one saw this coming?” Well, take a wild guess as to who saw this coming: every single expert on inflluenza and pandemics.

Let’s take Fauci himself, in a speech at Georgetown on Jan. 10, 2017
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/fauci-warned-of-trump-pandemic-2017_n_5e8a0548c5b6e7d76c65c8a4

""The thing we’re extraordinarily confident about is that we are going to see this [a pandemic] in the next few years…The mistake that so many people have made … is a failure to look beyond our own borders in the issue of the globality of health issues, not only things that are there that will come here but surprises that we’ll have…”

“THE NEXT FEW YEARS” Nailed it.

And I suspect few if any people here have watched the 5-part Netflix series, “Pandemic.” Watch it. By pure chance they finished filming last summer/fall. It follows pandemic experts from around the world as they track outbreaks in animals, make plans, beg for funding, etc. Guess what ALL of them say? It’s coming…in fact the last scene is a WHO expert standing in a duck farm in China saying “It’s going to start here, or a place very much like this…” Again, nailed it. One of the stars of the show is Dr. Syra Madan, a pandemic expert with the NY Dept. of Health. Her parents were immigrants from Pakistan. She has devoted her life to this…and guess what? Last year she organized an international gathering that actually war gamed a pandemic. And yes, the Chinese participated. Anyway, very informative and entertaining as well.

Finally, I’ll repeat John Barry’s conclusion from his book on the 1918-20 pandemic: "“If there is a single dominant lesson from 1918, it’s that governments need to tell the truth in a crisis. You don’t manage the truth. You tell the truth.”
 
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You’re in a very bad place, not everyone here is American. I’m fine.
Not great but fine.
Yes there is; stay home unless you’re needed and wait it out.

It’s not my fault Americans choose a crappy fractured government system. It’s not my fault your states are bidding against each other for medical equipment. It’s not my fault you elected an Annoying Orange for president who didn’t use his powers to retool the country when you had the chance.

The rest of the world understands what needs to be done.
So, that only leaves the bad reasons. We (being Americans in this case) closed the boarder to Iran and China because it looks good in the polls. It appeases the voters and propagates racial under tones, deliberately or not.
Something is off here…can’t quite put my finger on it.
 
Something is off here…can’t quite put my finger on it.
Americans can be used interchangeable for USaisn’s (a term more accurate but comes with the baggage of this exact conversation) or anyone in the two continents (which are often over looked as they are not in the USA)

Excuse the confusion.
I’m Canadian.
 
Thank you for the clarification.

I wasn’t aware that Canada had also closed its borders to Iran and China.
 
Racism is indeed an issue and an affront to human dignity.

I don’t think closing borders with China or Iran was racist.
 
Maybe just as Hitler came along to save the downtrodden from WWI German Populace,
the AntiChristian shall come along and use Hunger as a weapon to corral some to him?
 
You cannot legally exclude United States Citizens from U.S. soil. You can order them to be quarantined, and you can make the argument that he should have done that, but you can never be denied entry into the U.S. if you are a citizen. Even known and suspected terrorists must be granted admission if they are citizens.
 
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That’s racist and xenophobic! We are all just humans! Why exclude non citizen undocumented aliens!? I suspect this is also somehow mysogonistic.

End sarcasm.
 
Why? I don’t follow.
If a woman can take actions that will definitely kill another human being why should I be under de facto house arrest because I might have a virus that might infect somebody else who might die.

In my area the elderly are not allowed to leave their homes. I concede it may not be prudent given the risk, but I strongly object to it being mandated.

Especially since the same government classifies murdering babies as essential.
 
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