Who's Going to Pay the Bills?: Purpose-Driven Coronavirus Business Shutdowns Cause Economic Catastrophe

[HarryStotle]

part 2–

But if you want to compare, let’s look at Canada–I couldn’t find recent data, but from 1961- 2009 (almost 50 years…) 133 policemen were killed in the line of duty. So between 2-3 a year. Multiply by 10 to compare to US population and you get 20-30 a year; a long way from 135. Now why would that be?

JoeFreedom:

That is NOT systemic racism.

Well, if being black makes you 2.5 times more apt to be killed by police, I’d call that systematic racism.

You can call it whatever you’d like. The problem with settling on “systemic racism” is that such a determination completely ignores all of the other causal factors that enter into creating the current problem.

Being black also makes you 8 times more likely to commit a homicide or serious crime, so if you are only 2.5 times more apt to be killed by police although 8 times more likely to commit serious crime, it appears that the police are going “easy” on black perpetrators compared to others.

We would reasonably expect cops to engage with black criminals to a rate concomitant with the rate that they commit crime (8 times the rate for whites)

 Blacks were disproportionately represented as both homicide victims and offenders. Th e victimization rate for blacks (27.8 per 100,000) was 6 times higher than the rate for whites (4.5 per 100,000). The offending rate for blacks (34.4 per 100,000) was almost 8 times higher than the rate for whites (4.5 per 100,000) (table 1).
Source: https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/htus8008.pdf (page 3)

Now, if you wish to be completely honest in what appears to be your one sided appraisal, why not provide comparables to Canada or the UK in terms of how much more violent the criminals are in the US compared to the others? Or are you planning on off-loading what appears to be a societal problem onto the cops, as if policing is to blame for all of the ills of society? Right, cops in the US are responsible for being killed far more frequently there than in the other countries? Is that your take-away: It isn’t the criminal element that is responsible for higher criminality, it’s the cops?

One case of a black man unjustly killed by a cop and the “mob” goes on a violent rampage burning, rioting, looting, assaulting, raping and killing. That “mob” is esteemed in the media as the paragons of justice (largely peaceful protestors) despite the fact that the “in kind” repayment on the injustice done by the cop was inordinately beyond just, targeting mostly the innocent by destroying businesses and property; and all of that before any fair verdict could even be rendered since the evidence was and is incomplete. Right, trust the mob to just “know” intuitively which businesses and individuals were supposed to have been held accountable by losing their livelihoods and their lives for something that they had absolutely nothing to do with. A completely “re-envisioned” system of justice, that. Yeah, no thanks.

 

[farronwolf]

Evidently, these doctors are now against shutdowns:
Over 1,000 health professionals sign a letter saying, Don't shut down protests using coronavirus concerns as an excuse - CNN

Wonder if they feel the same way now with the current increase in cases?

 

[Zzyzx_Road]

Wonder if they feel the same way now with the current increase in cases?

No change. As a nation, we’re not that far from herd immunity. NY state and city are already there. IL is virtually there. MA is very close. AZ, CA, FL, MI and TX are not that far off. You can read my post in World News that details this.

No more lockdowns are necessary. Vulnerable people are responsible for their own precautions; they shouldn’t be transferring the costs of those precautions on to the healthy as they have been via the ruinous lockdowns. Remember we never ever locked down the healthy before this year. I sincerely hope we learned enough from this episode to never try it again. We not only didn’t do this in 1968 and 1957, we didn’t even do this in 1918. The economy went down some in those years, but nothing anywhere near close to this year.

The economic damage will be with us for a long time. Think tax revenues for instance, they won’t recover to their pre-virus levels this year. Maybe not even next year. So that presents a revenue problem for cities, counties and states, and we will be hearing a lot more about that in the coming months.

 

[farronwolf]

Yea well you might just do some research. We are no where near here immunity.

Where are you getting your misinformation.

Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health

 

[Zzyzx_Road]

Yea well you might just do some research. We are no where near here immunity.

Where are you getting your misinformation.

You’re not taking into account the cross immunity that already exists and has been demonstrated more than once in closed environments. Neither is Hopkins taking that into account. It is both you and Hopkins who are misinformed about this. In the case of Hopkins, they have no excuse, they have access to all the papers. Why they choose to perpetrate the misinformation regarding immunity I won’t guess, but it is firmly on them given the facts already in the public domain.

By closed environments, I’m speaking of the Diamond Princess cruise ship that was anchored off of Yokohama, Japan in February. 3711 passengers and crew aboard, but only 712 actually infected. Or the USS Roosevelt: 4700+ crew, only 1156 infected. The Wikipedia pages for these ships will confirm these numbers for you. According to the papers that were written about these outbreaks: on both ships, there were recorded instances of roommate situations (including husbands and wives on the cruise ship) where one party was infected with symptoms and the other party never got infected despite being confined together for at least two weeks.

Now how is that possible? The only reasonable explanation so far is that there exists a coronavirus cross immunity. Which shouldn’t be that surprising given that coronavirus based illnesses have been common to humans since time immemorial; the only difference this time is that Covid-19 is much more serious than the usual coronavirus. I’ll have to dredge it up, but the current estimate of that cross immunity is around 50% of the population. This also explains why there are those in long term care facilities who don’t get Covid-19 even though they have underlying conditions that should have made them vulnerable to the virus they have definitely been exposed to.

Nor is Hopkins taking into account the CDC statement two days ago that the CDC now believes that the actual number of infected persons is about 10 times the confirmed cases. This didn’t come out of nowhere as you think; research results via antibody testing have confirmed that the number of infected is very definitely a multiple of the confirmed cases and these papers are in the public domain. For instance, look up the study at Stanford University that was released in April. They posited at that time that the actual infected was between 50 to 80 times the number of confirmed cases in Santa Clara County. The Los Angeles County version of that study came up with 25 to 50 times. As tests have become more widely available that number has since lowered. Yet even today the CDC still accepts that infected numbers are likely at least 10 times the confirmed cases.

 

[Zzyzx_Road]

One more for @farronwolf
How is it possible that no spikes were experienced in New York City despite all the protesting and riots that took place there?

While most other cities are experiencing case spikes to some extent. Spikes for these other cities, but no case spikes for NYC even though we saw thousands of protesters on the streets for at least a week if not more. Explain that one. Without the presence of cross immunity playing its part in herd immunity in NYC, you can’t.

 

[HarryStotle]

1cthlctrth:

Evidently, these doctors are now against shutdowns:
Over 1,000 health professionals sign a letter saying, Don't shut down protests using coronavirus concerns as an excuse - CNN

Wonder if they feel the same way now with the current increase in cases?

You may also want to investigate the extent to which that “rise” in cases is attributable to a rise in testing.

Given that, according to a number of very reputable epidemiologists, testing is only identifying about 10% of the active cases — most of which are asymptomatic, it would be very easy to statistically create a “spike” in cases by “spiking” the number of tests being administered.

Since 90% of cases are mild to asymptomatic, there have consistently been a far higher number of active cases than the testing ever revealed.

The far more critical element in assessing the severity of a “second wave” would be a spike in hospitalizations, especially the numbers of ICU beds.

 

[farronwolf]

We aren’t in the second wave yet. This is still the first.

But think what you want. Seems lots of southern states are rolling back their openings to some extent. It is summer time, the virus just went away, yet our Gov just paused elective surgeries. Information is wonderful.

Texas Hospital Says 100% Of ICU Beds Full—Then Removes Its Report

 

[farronwolf]

Darn Republicans trying to scare everyone with this Corona hoax. I think they are just trying to manipulate the voters so they can get more people elected from their party. Next they will want to give free money to people and businesses. This really has got to stop.

Texas Gov. Greg Abbott mandates face masks in most counties | The Texas Tribune

 

[Pattylt]

The far more critical element in assessing the severity of a “second wave” would be a spike in hospitalizations, especially the numbers of ICU beds.

And that’s just what some states are seeing. It isn’t the increase in testing positive thats concerning…I think people understand quite well that more testing will mean identifying more positives. No, this is an actual increase of the spread of Covid…especially in Texas, Arizona, California and smaller spikes in hospitalizations in many others.

Before we knew much about Covid, they were trying to figure out the ideal conditions for its spread. Remember when they thought that certain altitudes, humidity, temperatures would effect the spread?

Now that summer is here and we’re seeing a true spike in cases, I think we realize that what has changed is that we started opening up…especially bars, crowds anywhere where people gather together without distancing, indoors and for more than 15 minutes. Sigh…it seems certain things can reopen IF the distancing can be maintained and people wear the masks. But, the masks became political! For some reason we can require someone to wear shirts and shoes in a restaurant or store but it’s asking too much to temporarily wear a mask to help with a pandemic! I’m an American and even I don’t understand us! :hugs::hugs::hugs:

 

[1cthlctrth]

Here is a list of # of DEATHS related in any way to covid-19, according to the CDC website:

week-ending # Deaths

---

2/01/2020: 0
2/08/2020: 1
2/15/2020: 0
2/22/2020: 6
2/29/2020: 5
3/07/2020: 33
3/14/2020: 52
3/21/2020: 561
3/28/2020: 3,124
4/04/2020: 9,904
4/11/2020: 16,004
4/18/2020: 16,886
4/25/2020: 15,199
5/02/2020: 12,949
5/09/2020: 10,933
5/16/2020: 8,917
5/23/2020: 6,915
5/30/2020: 5,817
6/06/2020: 4,577
6/13/2020: 3,577
6/20/2020: 2,532
6/27/2020: 1,024
7/04/2020: 302

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/COVID19/index.htm

Note that late reporting will probably increase the week-ending July 4 number, but you get the idea: the number of DEATHS (the only real important number) continues to decrease. So, if there’s an “increase” in the number of known cases of covid-19 as the result of increased testing, or for whatever reason, we are finding that the death rate continues to look lower and lower.

 

[1cthlctrth]

The following is a sort by percentage of deaths that are in any way related to COVID-19 from week-ending February 1st to week-ending July 4th.

This helps to identify which states appear to be doing the worst job in fighting COVID-19.

Jurisdiction of Occurrence	All Deaths involving COVID-19	Deaths from All Causes	% of Deaths that are COVID-19-related	Governor	Party
New York	31,355	106,591	0.29	Andrew Cuomo	Democratic
New Jersey	13,484	48,741	0.28	Phil Murphy	Democratic
Connecticut	3,835	13,953	0.27	Ned Lamont	Democratic
Massachusetts	7,489	33,468	0.22	Charles D. Baker	Republican
District of Columbia	577	3,202	0.18	(MAYOR) Muriel Bowser	Democratic
Rhode Island	880	5,022	0.18	Gina Raimondo	Democratic
Maryland	3,380	26,180	0.13	Larry Hogan	Republican
Louisiana	2,853	22,345	0.13	John Bel Edwards	Democratic
Illinois	6,280	54,533	0.12	J.B. Pritzker	Democratic
Pennsylvania	6,873	60,545	0.11	Tom Wolf	Democratic
Delaware	502	4,448	0.11	John C. Carney Jr.	Democratic
Michigan	5,427	48,885	0.11	Gretchen Whitmer	Democratic
Colorado	1,586	19,509	0.08	Jared Polis	Democratic
Indiana	2,478	30,953	0.08	Eric Holcomb	Republican
Minnesota	1,370	20,700	0.07	Tim Walz	Democratic
Mississippi	972	15,008	0.06	Tate Reeves	Republican
New Hampshire	356	5,794	0.06	Chris Sununu	Republican
Virginia	1,938	32,577	0.06	Ralph Northam	Democratic
Georgia	2,205	38,347	0.06	Brian Kemp	Republican
Iowa	716	13,440	0.05	Kim Reynolds	Republican
New Mexico	437	8,294	0.05	Michelle Lujan Grisham	Democratic
Arizona	1,484	29,831	0.05	Doug Ducey	Republican
California	5,655	124,617	0.05	Gavin Newsom	Democratic
Washington	1,122	24,848	0.05	Jay Inslee	Democratic
Ohio	2,438	54,446	0.04	Richard Michael DeWine	Republican
Alabama	973	23,523	0.04	Kay Ivey	Republican
Nevada	472	11,701	0.04	Steve Sisolak	Democratic
Nebraska	245	7,100	0.03	Pete Ricketts	Republican
Missouri	920	27,860	0.03	Mike Parson	Republican
Florida	3,171	97,194	0.03	Ron DeSantis	Republican
Wisconsin	760	24,371	0.03	Tony Evers	Democratic
South Carolina	676	22,691	0.03	Henry McMaster	Republican
North Carolina	957	32,536	0.03	Roy Cooper	Democratic
Texas	2,515	89,694	0.03	Greg Abbott	Republican
North Dakota	78	2,867	0.03	Doug Burgum	Republican
Kentucky	547	20,148	0.03	Andy Beshear	Democratic
South Dakota	86	3,392	0.03	Kristi L. Noem	Republican
Kansas	268	11,615	0.02	Laura Kelly	Democratic
Oklahoma	379	16,528	0.02	Kevin Stitt	Republican
Vermont	57	2,637	0.02	Phil Scott	Republican
Utah	163	8,692	0.02	Gary Herbert	Republican
Arkansas	262	14,164	0.02	Asa Hutchinson	Republican
Maine	111	6,540	0.02	Janet T. Mills	Democratic
Tennessee	520	33,129	0.02	Bill Lee	Republican
Idaho	93	6,216	0.01	Brad Little	Republican
Oregon	209	15,661	0.01	Kate Brown	Democratic
West Virginia	98	8,354	0.01	Jim Justice	Republican
Wyoming	18	2,004	0.01	Mark Gordon	Republican
Alaska	11	1,680	0.01	Mike Dunleavy	Republican
Montana	20	4,373	0.00	Steve Bullock	Democratic
Hawaii	17	4,994	0.00	David Ige	Democratic

(source: the same CDC website)

 

[GodIsPerfection]

The protracted Covid agenda is to terrify the public from voting in person on November 3.

They want you to be screaming for mail-in or drop-off balloting, so the election process can be hijacked.

I’ve been expecting a parcel delivery by USPS for 18 days, but it has now been declared “missing in the mail.” It will be re-shipped by the retailer to me by UPS.

So, how much confidence should we place in USPS to handle “mail-in” ballots properly?

Pluck up your courage, put on your mask, go to your polling place, and vote in person on November 3

Isaiah 41:10

10 Fear thou not; for I am with thee: be not dismayed; for I am thy God: I will strengthen thee; yea, I will help thee; yea, I will uphold thee with the right hand of my righteousness.

 

[Anrakyr]

They want you to be screaming for mail-in or drop-off balloting, so the election process can be hijacked.

I’ve had enough, I want to be charitable but as a computer engineer with security training let me assure you of one fact:

The amount of time and effort to circumvent the security on mail in ballots is not worth the pay off. First you have too find a legal citizen who can vote, make sure they are already registered, hijack that information and pray harder then a Dominican nun that at no point nothing the person does (living or dead) ever interferes.

All of which is a moot point when (and this is extremely important)
AMERICANS DONT ELECT THE PRESIDENT ANYWAY!

So why would you hyjack the ballots of people whose vote doesn’t matter?

 

[GodIsPerfection]

The amount of time and effort to circumvent the security on mail in ballots is not worth the pay off. First you have too find a legal citizen who can vote, make sure they are already registered, hijack that information and pray harder then a Dominican nun that at no point nothing the person does (living or dead) ever interferes.

All of which is a moot point when (and this is extremely important)
AMERICANS DONT ELECT THE PRESIDENT ANYWAY!

So why would you hyjack the ballots of people whose vote doesn’t matter?

Precisely. The votes of people who do matter are hijacked.

A notable example was the 1948 Senatorial election of Lyndon B. Johnson in Texas. Six days after the polls closed, and Johnson lost, mysteriously, a box containing 200 ballots showed up, tipping the election in Johnson’s favor.

In 2018, in New Mexico’s 2nd Congressional District, Democrat, Xocitil Torres Small appeared to be losing when the polls closed. Counting of mail-in absentee ballots proceeded slowly, because there were over 8, 000 of them in 2018, compared to only 2,500 in 2014 and 2,900 in 2016.

From The Albuquerque Journal

"The latest developments in a race that has gotten national attention and prompted questions about vote-tallying procedures – similar to other races in Florida and Arizona – came Monday when the roughly 1,100 provisional and hand tally ballots were added to the vote count in Doña Ana County.

When those ballots were added to the mix, Torres Small’s lead in the contest increased from about 2,800 votes to 3,539. The Doña Ana County Canvassing Board will meet today to review the election returns and certify results, according to the Secretary of State’s Office.The current unofficial election results that include the provisional ballots show Torres Small with 100,570 votes and Herrell with 97,031 votes.

Torres-Small’s opponent, Yvette Harrel stated: “They had magically found 4,000 ballots that had not been counted,” said Herrell, referring to absentee ballots in Doña Ana County the Secretary of State’s Office had announced after midnight on Election Night.

*The Secretary of State’s Office half an hour later also announced that an additional 4,000 or so absentee ballots had been counted by election workers in the Doña Ana County Clerk’s Office but not yet added to the vote count.

In Wisconsin, in 2018, many absentee voters in predominantly Republican Districts never received their blank ballots from USPS.

The issue of mail-in or drop-off ballots being subject to election fraud is not limited to Presidential election. It also affects representation in Congress and at your local government level.

If you want a fair election, insist on voter ID and voting in person.

 

[1cthlctrth]

The issue of mail-in or drop-off ballots being subject to election fraud is not limited to Presidential election. It also affects representation in Congress and at your local government level. If you want a fair election, insist on voter ID and voting in person.

Well summarized, and great specific examples. Here’s more:

15 Election Results That Were Tossed Over Fraudulent Mail-In Ballots

“With ballot harvesting, the politically connected visit the homes of people and vote the ballots for them. These are victims often afraid of consequences,” J. Christian Adams, president of Public Interest Legal Foundation, said.

Between 1992 and 2018, at least 20 voter fraud cases resulted in overturned elections, according to The Heritage Foundation’s Election Fraud Database.

Bongino | The Differences Between Absentee and All-Mail Voting

The Daily Signal highlights the differences between the two processes.

Absentee balloting is usually reserved for people who cannot make it to the polls due to “illness, travel, military service, or residence on a college campus.” In absentee balloting, a voter requests the ballot and usually has to sign and authenticate a formal request. Different states have different ways of identifying the voter.
As such, the potential for fraud is low, if not non-existent.

However, with all-mail voting, the ballot is just sent to the prospective voter, regardless of if they requested it or not. Hans von Spakovsky of the Heritage Foundation said regarding all-mail voting that, “With all-mail [voting], they just send out a ballot and without certainty it’s going to a live voter. The problem with all-mail voting is that ballots are mailed to every registered voter. We know voter registration rolls are in bad shape all across the country, with multiple duplications and sending out ballots to people that don’t live there.”

As well, in 2005, the Commission on Federal Election Reform (co-chaired by former President Jimmy Carter and former Secretary of State James Baker) determined that the biggest source of election fraud were absentee ballots.

New report argues perils of mail-in voting go beyond fraud | Fox News

When ballots were sent to inactive voters in Nevada’s May primary, ballots were found piled up in post office trays, outside apartment complexes, and on community bulletin boards in and around Las Vegas.

Today in 2020, four people - including a sitting city councilman and a councilman-elect - face criminal charges for trying to rig an all-mail election in Paterson, New Jersey," Snead said.

He added: “Automatically mailing ballots, weakening election safeguards, and trying to impose a national mail-in election on an entire country in four months is a recipe for disaster. We need to ensure it is easy and safe to vote this November, but not at the expense of the credibility of our democracy.”

 

[Anrakyr]

Accept you don’t vote for your president so it doesn’t matter.

 

[Freddy]

My state in Australia (NSW) has just had 15 new cases yesterday. And we’re getting seriously worried about it. Florida has three times the population and it’s just had 15,000.

That figure makes zero sense to me. If it was a third world country with almost no access to testing, no means to pass on medical information and recommendations as to how to avoid catching it or no ability to track cases then it would still be barely believable.

Has anyone got an answer for why the figures are off the chart?

 

[Sarcelle]

That figure makes zero sense to me. If it was a third world country with almost no access to testing, no means to pass on medical information and recommendations as to how to avoid catching it or no ability to track cases then it would still be barely believable.

When it comes to accessible and affordable healthcare or the lack of it, Florida or for that matter, the US might as well be third world. With a stalled economy, a significant number lost their jobs and with that their healthcare.

I have a sneaking suspicion that a lot more are infected but aren’t counted because they can’t afford to get a diagnosis or the treatment.

 

[Freddy]

Freddy:

That figure makes zero sense to me. If it was a third world country with almost no access to testing, no means to pass on medical information and recommendations as to how to avoid catching it or no ability to track cases then it would still be barely believable.

When it comes to accessible and affordable healthcare or the lack of it, Florida or for that matter, the US might as well be third world. With a stalled economy, a significant number lost their jobs and with that their healthcare.

I have a sneaking suspicion that a lot more are infected but aren’t counted because they can’t afford to get a diagnosis or the treatment.

But the testing is free, isn’t it? Please don’t tell me that you have to pay for hospitalisation if you test positive…