Why are atheists so unhappy?

[Charles_Darwin]

Well, geez louise, I’ve been called bigoted, insane, and now delusional (all by atheists), and why, because I believe in God.

“all by atheists” they all happen to be invisible pink unicorn rejectionists too, but then you are IPUR aswell. Hmm i best steer clear of these IPURs.

 

[josie_L]

That is not how knowledge works. Human testimony is one of the lest reliable sources of evidence.

I have know doubt you believe there is a god, but then millions believed in Zeus. What you all have in common is you cannot substantiate that belief. Just because you believe you have experience god does not mean you actually have conclusive knowledge it exists. Surly you must realise that?

Do you therefore think every god that has ever been experience by man exists? I’m sure you don’t. I have no issue with your belief god exists, but it is not knowledge.

But these people believed whether he be callled Zeus, Thor, Allah, Yahweh that a God existed. And this human testimony to which you refer to is not an isolated event but a recurrent and everpresent experience which culminates in positive results and effects changes in the very being of that person. The saints are testimony of the heights of love that one can attain to when one believes and trusts in God.

 

[josie_L]

“all by atheists” they all happen to be invisible pink unicorn rejectionists too, but then you are IPUR aswell. Hmm i best steer clear of these IPURs.

The fact is Charlie I’ve been called these things by people who are supposedly less judgmental than theists, don’t you find that a little ironic?

 

[Gabriella_San_S]

merriam-webster.com/dictionary/belief
merriam-webster.com/dictionary/knowledge

That’s like me quoting the scriptures to you to substantiate a claim. How do you prove that merriam-webster authors aren’t delusional?

All right, and if the majority of the world’s population were atheists?

Ain’t gonna happen-you guys will always be on the fringe.

Ah, ok.

Glad we agree on something.

 

[Gabriella_San_S]

it’s more likely that you think you have experienced God but are just delusional in actuality

You worship*** pasta***? My Italian husband would get along great with you.

 

[josie_L]

You worship*** pasta***? My Italian husband would get along great with you.

Hey I’m Italian. Parla Italiano con il tuo marito? E perche non? Grazia a dio che sono Italiana, la mangare e buenissimo e la cultura e molto riccho.

 

[Gabriella_San_S]

Hey I’m Italian. Parla Italiano con il tuo marito? E perche non? Grazia a dio che sono Italiana, la mangare e buenissimo e la cultura e molto riccho.

http://bestsmileys.com/eating1/2.gif Whenever I hear an Italian speak that beautiful language,(even though I don’t capish) I am transported to a pizzeria in my delusional-(hey, if we can’t* win* 'em let’s at least* humor* them) mind… Ciao, Bella!

 

[Shredderbeam]

That’s like me quoting the scriptures to you to substantiate a claim. How do you prove that merriam-webster authors aren’t delusional?

I don’t know that they (along with every other dictionary and person who have ever used those two words) are not, but then, I try not to multiply entities unnecessarily (Occam’s razor).
Gabriella San:

Ain’t gonna happen-you guys will always be on the fringe.

It’s a hypothetical scenario, and while unrealistic, it’s certainly not logically impossible. The point that I am trying to make is if a majority of people believe “X” to be true, “X” is not necessarily true. It’s a logical fallacy, known as the appeal to authority: nizkor.org/features/fallacies/appeal-to-authority.html

 

[Gabriella_San_S]

I don’t know that they (along with every other dictionary and person who have ever used those two words) are not, but then, I try not to multiply entities unnecessarily (Occam’s razor).

You see how your argument proves that evidence of knowledge could just be relative,depending on who you’re getting your information from? Anybody’s knowledge, could be flimsy, subjective preferences, according to atheistic notions of reality. Without belief-anything goes, right?

It’s a** hypothetical scenario**, and while unrealistic, it’s certainly not logically impossible. The point that I am trying to make is if a majority of people believe “X” to be true, “X” is not necessarily true. It’s a* logical fallacy*, known as the appeal to authority

You left out* fantasies*, don’t forget fantasies.
And I’m all for "appealing to Authority"-you came to the* right forum for that!***

 

[pulcher_veritas]

I’m not atheist but I questioned Catholicism and was treated horribly or hurtfully by people friends, family, and just people I knew. I’ve never met an unhappy atheist. Yet, the atheist that just minding his/her own buisness seems to be attacked often. This is a stereotype much like those made about Christians in the media. No one insulted me while I was Catholic, but many did when I left.

 

[Gabriella_San_S]

might I suggest that you cannot have a productive discussion on the merits of theism with theists. At the end of the day they believe just because. They don’t rely on logic or reason (the only logical argument I’ve ever heard that makes even a shred of sense is the causation argument i.e**. Aristotelian** metaphysics).

Then there’s hope for you yet, based on faith* and* reason!

 

[Gabriella_San_S]

I’m not atheist but I questioned Catholicism and was treated horribly or hurtfully by people friends, family, and just people I knew. I’ve never met an unhappy atheist. Yet, the atheist that just minding his/her own buisness seems to be attacked often. This is a stereotype much like those made about Christians in the media. No one insulted me while I was Catholic, but many did when I left.

Welcome!
I’m sorry for the painful responses to your leaving the Church, maybe they were just as hurt by your leaving. Anyway, at the end of the day, we all get our feelings hurt and yet the Truth remains…God loves you infinitely, and faith* transcends* feelings. So take heart, dear friend! You are among friends here.

 

[Shredderbeam]

You see how your argument proves that evidence of knowledge could just be relative,depending on who you’re getting your information from? Anybody’s knowledge, could be flimsy, subjective preferences, according to atheistic notions of reality. Without belief-anything goes, right?

I don’t know what ideas you have about atheists, but I, for one, believe in a single, objective reality that all humans inhabit, and in objective truth. As such, I believe that I exist on the planet Earth, in the United States, among hundreds of millions of other humans who communicate using words whose meanings are generally set by common agreement. If there are any parts of the above that you do not accept, please let me know.
Gabriella San:

You left out* fantasies*, don’t forget fantasies.
And I’m all for "appealing to Authority"-you came to the* right forum for that!***

I think you may have missed my point. 90% of the population may believe that “X” is true, but “X” could be false. Example: 90% of the population believed that the Earth is flat, but the Earth is not flat.

 

[Charles_Darwin]

But these people believed whether he be callled Zeus, Thor, Allah, Yahweh that a God existed. And this human testimony to which you refer to is not an isolated event but a recurrent and everpresent experience which culminates in positive results and effects changes in the very being of that person. The saints are testimony of the heights of love that one can attain to when one believes and trusts in God.

You hit the nail in the head “when one** believes** and trusts in God”.

It is belief, it is not knowledge.

It doesn’t matter how you much really really really really believe it is true, it is still not knowledge.

The sheer fact that two people have such different ideas about the same thing shows that this experience is not consistent, but even if it was consistent, even if if god does exist, with the information we have available to us you belief would still not be knowledge.

I am not trying to say your belief is incorrect, though i personally believe is it, all i am saying is (right of wrong) you belief is not knowledge.

 

[Charles_Darwin]

The fact is Charlie I’ve been called these things by people who are supposedly less judgmental than theists, don’t you find that a little ironic?

I’m not sure to be honest. What i mean is, they are judging you as an individual though discourse. I’ve seen you judge entire groups based on dogma. That is discrimination at best and verges on bigotry.

Your obviously not a stupid person, and i am glad to be past the silly bickering stage that often happens (not blaming anyone) when two people of differing beliefs discuss those beliefs. I now know you are not a fundamentalist, however i must admit i though you were.

Your refer to atheists as if we belong to a group, that we share a doctrine. We don’t. My point is this, atheism is a pointless term. It tells you nothing about what a person believes, your response should have been to the individuals. When you as atheist your are grouping people that should not be grouped.

It would be like me saying… see all non cycling fans are supposedly less judgmental than cycling fans.

Well the fact that someone likes or dislikes cycling says nothing about how judgmental they are. The fact someone believes of has no belief in a god tells you nothing about how judgmental they are.

The thing is i would never group everyone that does not like cycling and start making assumptions about them, that would be absurd. I belief it is equally absurd for theists to do that same with everyone that has no belief in a god.

 

[Charles_Darwin]

Ain’t gonna happen-you guys will always be on the fringe.

I would not be so sure, other than the USA in the 1st would we are probably the majority already. In Europe we certainly are.

However i agree that in places where eduction is lacking religion will continue to dominate.

 

[Charles_Darwin]

You see how your argument proves that evidence of knowledge could just be relative,depending on who you’re getting your information from? Anybody’s knowledge, could be flimsy, subjective preferences, according to atheistic notions of reality. Without belief-anything goes, right?

That’s not how knowledge works.

What on earth does being an atheist have to do with “notions of reality”.

Also what on earth does this mean… ** Without belief-anything goes, right?**

 

[Gabriella_San_S]

I would not be so sure, other than the USA in the 1st would we are probably the majority already. In Europe we certainly are.

However i agree that in places where eduction is lacking religion will continue to dominate.

My friend, now*** who*** is speculating? And without knowledge? And*** judging*** a majority class of people, who you know little to nothing about, personally? Uneducated? Is that what you are calling** religious** people? Please be more careful to adhere to*** your own*** standards next time. Thank you.

 

[Charles_Darwin]

My friend, now*** who*** is speculating? And without knowledge? And*** judging*** a majority class of people, who you know little to nothing about, personally? Uneducated? Is that what you are calling** religious** people? Please be more careful to adhere to*** your own*** standards next time. Thank you.

Where did i say that? I said that in general religion is more prevalent in countries with low eduction standards. Of course the USA does not fall under that rule, and there are many more factors.

However i am not speculating that the rise of atheism in Europe has been astounding, i imagine the USA will follow suit though it may take a bit of time. However it is not something i really care about.

There is a direct link between scientific education and atheism. There is also a link between IQ and Religiosity, but that does not mean that everyone that is religious has a low IQ. Like i said there are many more factors, upbringing being the biggest one.

http://hypnosis.home.netcom.com/images/_iq_vs_religion.png

 

[Mijoy2]

I guess that’s hard to say since they are Atheist. I’d like to think that as long as they’re doing well in school and don’t turn to a life of crime and drugs then I’m proud of them still. The important thing is that they follow their own path and that that path leads them to happiness. If I’ve done my job right ‘as I believe I have’ as their father then they’ll be OK.

This hit home so hard it felt like a blow to the stomache. I apologize but feel I must write this.

I used to feel this way too. My children were not atheists (thank my wife) but I was deeply synical and agnostic (probably the best term).

One day this all changed when I pondered the evidence and found it credible to a certain level. Then I realized what I may have done. He left thier souls, in my hands and I led them astray. I was devistated beyond mention. I realized I attempted to impose my beliefs on them. I did this with my own twisted logic and pride. I was above all that religious non-sense.

I may have been corrrect. There may be no God. BUT, I thought, what if there was something to all this and I led them astray because I know my ideas were better then 2000 years of Christianity that has essentially engulfed the world (as prophesised) after beginning with a simple disobedient Man’s death on a cross. It was all too profound to ignore. It was all too beautiful to ignore. I came to believe it was all too True to ignore. And I led them astray. I pray to God every day to guid me in the remedy of my error.

I tried my best to turn things around but they were in thier late teens at the time. Today they are both Catholic. I wish I could say they were more devout then they are but they do have a strong belief in God and follow thier faith. I now ask God to help do what I can and to work with me.

My marriage was in shambles for the same reason; my lack of caring about the sanctity and disresolve of Holy Matrimony. My “happiness” was deserving of much more…of course. Since then, my wife and I got married again, this tiime in the Catholic church and our life has changed immeasurably for the better. Funny thing, NOW I am happy (however it has a much different meaning to me now), then I was in pursuit of happiniess…and miserable. “Lose your life and you will find it”.

I beg you to reconsider if your children are young. I profoundly apologize for any intrusion of privacy. I do not want anyone to suffer the pain I have suffered over this.
Much more importantly, souls may be in the balance.