Why are Protestants confused by Gays?

[LutheranDK]

I’m curious here, and maybe the various Prots can answer: how does your church re-read the Bible or re-interpret the anti-homosexual activity passages in the Bible?

To me, it’s pretty clear, in black and white, that this kind of stuff isn’t much favored.

Please do not make the mistake of mistaking liberal “theology” for Protestant (in various denominations) orthodoxy.
Luther would turn in his grave if he knew what the church that, also against his wishes, bears his name has said.
It send a shiver down my spine…

 

[FaithofAbraham]

YOu are basing your opinion on the premises that the Bible is the divine word of God. At the same time you are comfortable with ignoring much of the Divine Word, I assume, under the belief that God later changed His mind and said many of the eternal laws I set forth no longer apply.

The truth is, imo, that both Judaism and Christianity maintain the fiction that the entire Hebrew Bible is the Divine word of God, and in the area of homosexaulity, this has caused nothing but problems.

Acts 15 gives only a few rules for Gentiles, and in that it is the same as Judaism, Gentiles needn’t convert and observe all Torah, only Noahide.

One of those prohibitions in both Christianity and Noahide is against fornication, so Gentiles are justified to point to the Tanach regarding homosexuality while still not observing all the Laws of Moses.

 

[truagape]

Let us start with your assent to the propaganda in post #2.

What in post # 2 do you take away as merely being propaganda?

 

[truagape]

the English word sodomy is not specifically used and translated that way in each case .

Which cases would you be referring to?

 

[Singinbeauty]

You say you would leave a Protestant church if it spoke out about Catholics, and yet that’s what you are doing…

Show me where I have spoken against catholics… You are probably taken what I have said out of context…

 

[truagape]

You should have seen me before I became Catholic; I have ADD.

You didn’t say “women lying with women”; you said “What about the women?”

Anyways, now that that’s cleared up.

The commandments apply to everyone; not just to the men. The same penalty goes for the women as for the men.

So are you saying that neither Moses nor the Law ever spoke out against lesbianism? What about bestiallity? Did God only address the men and leave this prohibition for women only to be implied?

 

[jmcrae]

So are you saying that neither Moses nor the Law ever spoke out against lesbianism? What about bestiallity? Did God only address the men and leave this prohibition for women only to be implied?

Sure, why not; many things are only implied in the Bible.

When you are at work, do you need a detailed list of things you are not allowed to do, or just the rule that shows how to do it correctly, and one or two examples of incorrect implementation that show what the rule is for?

 

[truagape]

Sure, why not; many things are only implied in the Bible.

When you are at work, do you need a detailed list of things you are not allowed to do, or just the rule that shows how to do it correctly, and one or two examples of incorrect implementation that show what the rule is for?

I think you completely missed my point.

 

[jmcrae]

I think you completely missed my point.

So, Moses has to say, Men should not lie with men, and women should not lie with women, and human beings should not lie with animals, and adults should not lie with children, and living creatures should not lie with inanimate objects, or else you don’t believe it, and then you would say, “So it’s okay if I lie with a plant, then? Because it’s a living thing but it’s not an animal.”

What you do is you read what it says - no adultery, no men lying with men, and you extrapolate that, okay, men are supposed to lie with women to whom they are married; nobody else. And from there it’s pretty easy to conclude that animals are out, women on women are out, inanimate objects are out, and so on and so forth.

I don’t know why this has to seem like rocket science.

 

[truagape]

So, Moses has to say, Men should not lie with men, and women should not lie with women, and human beings should not lie with animals, and adults should not lie with children, and living creatures should not lie with inanimate objects, or else you don’t believe it, and then you would say, “So it’s okay if I lie with a plant, then? Because it’s a living thing but it’s not an animal.”

What you do is you read what it says - no adultery, no men lying with men, and you extrapolate that, okay, men are supposed to lie with women to whom they are married; nobody else. And from there it’s pretty easy to conclude that animals are out, women on women are out, inanimate objects are out, and so on and so forth.

I don’t know why this has to seem like rocket science.

You just insist on missing the point don’t you!
Look, stop walking into walls for one moment and consider what I am saying:

God took the time to outlaw bestiality both to men and women. He did this not once, not twice, but three times within the Levitical Law Code. In Exodus, Leveticus, and Dueteronomy. According to your reasoning, he also condemned homosexuality but only felt the need to address the men. And in only one book at that! Did it ever occur to you that he was addressing a specific practice that was common in Cannanite rituals? Did it ever occur to you to let the context and scripture play a role in understanding what was actually being communicated in this prohibition? God had a history of referencing both men and women where applicable. And the context does a beautiful job of putting this fact into perspective!

 

[BrooklynBoy200]

Generalization, not really. Most Protestant denominations don’t even blink about divorce or contraception. More and more, protestants are turning their head on abortion and homosexuality. Euthanasia is also making strong gains in Protestantism.

The Catholic Church seems to stand alone against the tide of popular moral whimsy.

Actually i usually find protestants to be pretty anti-divorce. I agree about all the other things though.

 

[truagape]

The Bible affirms that the earth is round and hangs upon nothing

Interestinglly, Galellio promoted the same thing. Yet how did the church respond to him during his time?

Did the church acknoledge this Biblical reference to support his findings at that time?

 

[FaithofAbraham]

Additionally masturbation is sex with yourself, and since you are the same sex as yourself, masturbation is also gay and fornication.

 

[jmcrae]

Interestinglly, Galellio promoted the same thing. Yet how did the church respond to him during his time?

Did the church acknoledge this Biblical reference to support his findings at that time?

Yes, he died of old age while being burned at the stake - or was that being hung from the rafters and then drawn and quartered, I always forget.

Galileo was forbidden to preach in Church that the Sun is the centre of the Universe; when he did not desist, he was put under house arrest. The reason was not anything to do with what the Church thought of his theories; it’s just that their idea was that the Church is for learning about religion, not science.

 

[truagape]

The reason was not anything to do with what the Church thought of his theories;

And what did the church think of his thories?

 

[jmcrae]

And what did the church think of his thories?

Well, they accepted Copernicus’ theories with no difficulty; Copernicus was a Jesuit priest until the day he died, and always in good standing with the Church, so I suppose they didn’t worry one way or the other about that aspect of it. I think Copernicus lived before Galileo, but he had similar ideas.

The part they had trouble with, regarding Galileo, was that he was teaching science as though it were on the same level or the same thing as religion.

 

[truagape]

Well, they accepted Copernicus’ theories with no difficulty; Copernicus was a Jesuit priest until the day he died, and always in good standing with the Church, so I suppose they didn’t worry one way or the other about that aspect of it. I think Copernicus lived before Galileo, but he had similar ideas.

The part they had trouble with, regarding Galileo, was that he was teaching science as though it were on the same level or the same thing as religion.

So the church did use scripture to support Galileo’s findings?

 

[jmcrae]

So the church did use scripture to support Galileo’s findings?

I don’t think they cared one way or the other. It’s science; not religion. Why would they want to “support” his findings? What has the Church got to do with it?

That was the whole point of why they didn’t want him preaching about it in Church. (He was a priest.) They didn’t think it was an appropriate subject for Church.

 

[jmcrae]

Additionally masturbation is sex with yourself, and since you are the same sex as yourself, masturbation is also gay and fornication.

Good points.

 

[truagape]

I don’t think they cared one way or the other. It’s science; not religion. Why would they want to “support” his findings? What has the Church got to do with it?

It seems to me that his findings would have been affirmed by scripture. Especially seeing how centuries later some quote the bible to harmonize the scientific fact that the earth really is round. Wouldn’t the church want to emphasize the accuracy of the bible during those days?