They don’t have to justify their beliefs to anyone on Earth, not even themselves, if they aren’t so inclined. However, when they start demanding that others justify their beliefs, it raises the question of how they justify theirs.
Not to mention that this is a Catholic site…Because we decide to come here and talk philosophy and theology. Comes with the turf
God bless you.
never in my life have I asked an atheist, or anyone else for that matter to justify their beliefs to me. anyone who comes on this forum obviously wants to discuss some aspect of Catholic teaching or practice, and if they misunderstand, mis-state, or attack these, naturally we will respond.
Yeah, how’s stuff going over there? Looking forward to chatting more with you once all the drudgery is over, and you’re in my thoughts as well
Very much so. Notwithstanding my mock-serious answer above, though, it often seems that those of other religions or none at all are called to justify themselves when they respond to just such a proclamation of binding truth or allegations about their beliefs.
Why should we be respectful of the faith of a pagan who is claiming that Jesus is not God? We should be respectful of the “person” who is making the claim…at all times, but we are not called to be respectful of that person’s faith. Though we should be totally respectful of their God given right to believe what ever they want to.Yeah, how’s stuff going over there? Looking forward to chatting more with you once all the drudgery is over, and you’re in my thoughts as well
Very much so. Notwithstanding my mock-serious answer above, though, it often seems that those of other religions or none at all are called to justify themselves when they respond to just such a proclamation of binding truth or allegations about their beliefs.
Case in point – a Catholic posts that, oh, let’s find a good can of worms, gay marriage should be illegal; a non-Catholic (or even a Catholic who doesn’t care for enforcing Church morality on non-members) replies that the Church can do what it likes about Catholic marriages, but would it kindly keep its nose out of others’ business; cue the respondent getting jumped on. Suddenly everyone wants the respondent to justify his or her position, but usually the original poster is never called out on it unless more people who disagree jump into the fray, by which point the thread’s usually deteriorated into a sorry mess of flames, insults, character assaults, the whole nine yards.
Same thing happens if a Catholic posts a thread on the subject of ‘all atheists are X’, ‘Islam preaches Y’, and so on and on. It’s the people who attempt to respond to whatever allegations or proclamations – usually non-Catholics, but also a number of fine, upstanding members of the Church – who get called out, not the OP. For all the blather about charity that goes on, it’s telling and disappointing that conduct rule #7 is merely ‘Non-Catholics are welcome to participate but must be respectful of the faith of the Catholics participating on the board’, rather than ‘everybody must be respectful of the faith or unbelief of others participating’. It’s a sad double standard that seems to be thoroughly entrenched in the culture here, and one I’ve been pushing to change as best I can.
Because we are supposed to be respectful of yours, according to the forum rules. Respect goes both ways.
I have a hard time being respectful of the idea that Jesus is dead, there is no God, etc. I can respect a person’s right to have such a viewpoint, and not attack him for it…and I don’t have to be insulting in my lack of respect in the answers that I give to that faith. But I have no respect for those beliefs, and to me, respect for what a person believes is tantamount for agreeing with those beliefs. I can very respectfully agree to disagree.
But in order to comply with the stated rules of the forum, I have to respect the belief that a two-thousand-years-dead carpenter and preacher from the Middle East is in fact the son of a deity I do not particularly think exists. You, to do the same, need not show the slightest respect for my opinion that the guy had some good ideas but is not divine in any way, or for the years of thought and research I have put into reaching that conclusion. You can get away with an easy ‘I respect your right to believe what you do, but your beliefs suck’. Under the current rules, you can tell me that my beliefs are petty, founded in ignorance, a rebellion against truth, or pretty much anything you could think of – but that you, oh, respect me as a person – how nice. If I said any of that to you, I’d be crucified.
What do you think, what is the reason for this?
You are not seeming to understand what I say. I have to respect that you as a person have the right to believe that the sky is brown. I do not, in fact, have to respect that the sky is brown. For it is not brown. Respecting your faith that the sky is brown would be like agreeing with your belief that the sky is brown. I cannot put you down for that belief, but I do not have to believe it myself, or act as though you have any evidence or factual reason for believing that the sky is brown. I believe that the sky is blue. For me to respect that the sky is brown is wrong. I respect that you believe that the sky is brown…even though the sky is in fact not brown. Treating a person with respect is to not put the “person” down, no matter that they believe that the sky is brown. I do not have to act as though there is anything to the belief that the sky is brown. But I do respect your right to believe whatever you will, which means not insulting you as a person.
from forum rules:
Why is that a problem? It’s a CATHOLIC- oriented site! I wouldn’t expect to go to an atheist forum and go unchallenged when spouting religious dogma. There are several atheist or non-religious on this site and I have seen them treated with far more respect than I have seen of religious persons on atheist/skeptic forums.
Well, maybe you should agree with them, or at least part of them. Roman Catholicism is the only religion that’s completelly true, but that doesn’t mean that all that is true is Roman Catholicism. Most other religions do get at least some things right, and for that, they deserve our measured respect. Understanding other faiths also helps you understand your own better, which is another good reason to respect them. This doesn’t mean you’re claiming truth is subjective, only that “1+1=2” or “murder is wrong” is correct whether a Hindu or a Muslim or a Catholic says it.
Make the color of the sky a tenet of the Catholic faith, and I do have to respect this idea that the sky is brown, while you would not if I believed it – a double standard enforced by the rules.
