Why Do Atheists Or Anybody Else For That Matter

[crowonsnow]

Speaking as a former atheist, atheists think that religious people are deluded and seeking false comforts that prevent them from seeing the truth. Atheists want believes to see their ‘truth’ and proselytize for atheism. Don’t give up on them though! If they’re here, they’re curious. I certainly was, and I’m living proof that atheists can be and are converted.

That may be true of some atheists but it isn’t good to judge people without knowing them.

As an observer I find the religious phenomenon extremely interesting. And so I’m here. I know this stuff isn’t real, but the human behavior involved is still nothing short of fascinating. To watch people go through this stuff makes me feel like I’m invisible to them. It’s just a very rewarding experience personally. I feel like some kind of cultural anthropologist.

 

[Jesus_N_Cherie]

Make the color of the sky a tenet of the Catholic faith, and I do have to respect this idea that the sky is brown, while you would not if I believed it – a double standard enforced by the rules.

I have a tremendous respect for Catholicism, as well as for many other religions. That doesn’t prevent me from thinking they’re wrong, or from saying so. What makes Catholicism unique insofar as discussion on this board is concerned is that respect for it is enforced: no other theological stance is so protected. Get a bit heated about anything else, nothing happens, but touch Catholicism and the hammer comes down. The rules require respect for Catholicism alone, from everybody, without acknowledging that respect must be mutual to be any good. End result, it often isn’t

I don’t say this often, but look up to Paul here. Went to Athens, got up to preach, and didn’t just giggle and say ‘what a crock of ****!’ Instead, he congratulated them on their spirituality, and sold them on the new and improved version – all without once showing less than the highest respect for their beliefs.

Congratulating them on their spirituality is not respecting their beliefs. It is praising them for their desire to know the truth. Then he went on to tell them how his beliefs were the truth, and theirs were false.
It was him saying, “you are a wonderful people who do well in that you are taking your faith and beliefs seriously.” He is not saying, “it is wonderful that you think that the sky is brown.”
Rather, He is saying, "you wonderful people who take your beliefs so seriously, let me tell you what the Truth is, that you may be led to salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ.
And when they say, “But Paul, the sky is brown.” He says, “No, it is a fallacy to believe that the sky is brown. It is blue, and let me tell you why, and how I know.”
He doesn’t need to resort to name calling. He doesn’t need to resort to anything other than giving no credit whatsoever to anything that is not the truth, and addressing the fallacy by contradicting it with the truth.

I am not afraid of agreeing with what is the truth, be it protestant or Catholic…though the Roman Catholic Church is totally right.
My experience on the threads is people who are not Catholic and are trying to discredit Catholicism. They come on the forum to debate issues that stand to divide the protestants from the Catholics. So most of what they say on the threads I have been on thus far is an attack on Catholicism.
I have a number of protestant friends. We agree on many points in the Faith of Jesus Christ, both from Catholic and protestant viewpoints. There are a great many things that we totally agree on, to the point that we can talk about our faith without ever arguing. That is not, however, what I have found here in this Catholic forum.

 

[strngrnrth]

The atheist position is loud and clear all around me for hours most days. The radical antitheist position blares from sources as diverse as yelling alcoholics on the corner and glossy womens’ magazines. I have been surrounded by it in many forms a majority of my life. I used to argue it myself. This is where I get to present the other view.

 

[AnAtheist]

Speaking as a former atheist, atheists think that religious people are deluded and seeking false comforts that prevent them from seeing the truth. Atheists want believes to see their ‘truth’ and proselytize for atheism.

I don’t care at all what people believe as long as they leave me alone with it. Noone has to justify his faith.
What one has to justify though are rules based on their faith only but imposed on everyone. Here in Germany e.g. it is forbidden to have a BBQ or public dance on Good-Friday, bishops get payment from the state and children are more or less forced to religion classes in public schools. And there are more examples where state and church are not properly separated.
I will proselytise for LAICISM as long as things like the above stated happen.

 

[HelenaMT]

I don’t care at all what people believe as long as they leave me alone with it. Noone has to justify his faith.
What one has to justify though are rules based on their faith only but imposed on everyone. Here in Germany e.g. it is forbidden to have a BBQ or public dance on Good-Friday, bishops get payment from the state and children are more or less forced to religion classes in public schools. And there are more examples where state and church are not properly separated.
I will proselytise for LAICISM as long as things like the above stated happen.

I think the fact that we have no “state religion” in America is why we have so many more religious people here. I can imagine how much less respect religion would get here if they were paid salaries from the same source as our politicians !

 

[annem]

What one has to justify though are rules based on their faith only but imposed on everyone. Here in Germany e.g. it is forbidden to have a BBQ or public dance on Good-Friday, bishops get payment from the state and children are more or less forced to religion classes in public schools. And there are more examples where state and church are not properly separated.
I will proselytise for LAICISM as long as things like the above stated happen.

But haven’t Germans who wanted to home school their children in religious beliefs have to leave Germany and go to the UK? Is that what you mean by laicism?

May God bless you, ANnem

 

[AnAtheist]

But haven’t Germans who wanted to home school their children in religious beliefs have to leave Germany and go to the UK?

This is not quite true. In Germany homeschooling is not allowed at all. You may of course school your children in any belief you like but you have to send them to an official school. The problem is that those people did not want to have their children educated at public schools or those run by the big Churches, because they fear the teachings they might get there. Like biology.

Is that what you mean by laicism?

There are good arguments to force people into schools, the law was introduced in the 19th century to fight child labour. But as religion is taught in public schools as well, that causes lots of problems. Laicism means, no religion in public schools whatsoever, and everybody can teach their children as they like.
Of course public schools may teach about religions, that is actually a very good thing, but not a particular faith as such.

 

[myredeemerlives]

As Christians, the reason we bother people with our faith and belief in God is because one day you will give an account to God for your life. (whether you believe it or not) and as God fearing Christians we care about your soul and where you will spend eternity, so we tell you about Jesus… who died for you so you could have eternal life.

I think the reason many athiests like yourself fear religion is because you love your sinful life… and you don’t want to change it. The thing is, God’s rules are good and are for our benefit and are nothing to fear. Man, if everyone followed the ten commandments… earth would be a beautiful place to live.

 

[crowonsnow]

As Christians, the reason we bother people with our faith and belief in God is because one day you will give an account to God for your life. (whether you believe it or not) and as God fearing Christians we care about your soul and where you will spend eternity, so we tell you about Jesus… who died for you so you could have eternal life.

As an atheist I look at Christians who are concerned about their personal salvation and feel the same way. I wonder how they can be more concerned about themselves than about the future well being of the planet and all its inhabitants. It seems selfish. So the feeling is mutual - and friendly.

There is no afterlife in the sense of having a soul, but there is a future life in the sense that we should care about our descendents who in effect are ourselves. Let’s leave them a better world.

 

[cpayne]

As an atheist I look at Christians who are concerned about their personal salvation and feel the same way. I wonder how they can be more concerned about themselves than about the future well being of the planet and all its inhabitants. It seems selfish.

False dichotomy. (To be fair, the previous post was also at least an implied false dichotomy.)

Concern for personal salvation would only be selfish if it excluded concern for others as well. However, at least in the CC, faith and good works go together.

 

[Carjack1]

i think athiest just need some guidance to the right place

 

[AnAtheist]

i think athiest just need some guidance to the right place

Valhalla?

 

[Carjack1]

Valhalla?

You are on a Catholic website, what do you think ?

 

[crowonsnow]

False dichotomy. (To be fair, the previous post was also at least an implied false dichotomy.)

Concern for personal salvation would only be selfish if it excluded concern for others as well. However, at least in the CC, faith and good works go together.

Without personal salvation a Christian has no reason to live. But I admit having met two Christians - I believe they were Quakers - who’s concern for others went beyond personal salvation. This concern on their behalf did remind me of the Jesus character in the gospel stories.

In the end we can only judge others on what they do, not what they say, so we’re largely in agreement. What a person believes is only made known to others through his actions.

 

[cpayne]

Without personal salvation a Christian has no reason to live.

I’m not sure where this idea comes from?

Anyway, sorry, I’ve got to get to other things now. If anyone responds, I can’t get back until later. See you all!

 

[crowonsnow]

I’m not sure where this idea comes from?

Anyway, sorry, I’ve got to get to other things now. If anyone responds, I can’t get back until later. See you all!

It comes from Christians. I’m sure if you took a poll and asked Christians if they considered their personal salvation more important than the well being of the next ten thousand human generations, the vast, vast majority would pick personal salvation.

But if you are a good observer and simply ignore what people say, you’ll find that Christians do care about the human future, albeit not as much as they could if personal salvation wasn’t getting in the way.

 

[myredeemerlives]

I’d like to know how an athiest can truly believe that everything came from nothing, and that order can come from chaos? This is why I believe in an intelligent designer. You can’t look at the human body and seriously think that it came about by random chance?

To say there is no human soul is ridiculous to me… what is it that makes you, you? You love and care for others and show a whole range of emotions… you are the very image of the God who created you.

The bible says that men are without excuse when it comes to believing in God, because His attributes are clearly seen in creation. Perhaps some deeper study on evolution would help you see what a faulty theory it really is. It’s all guessworks and could be’s and maybe’s.

I’m not prepared to stake my eternity on a bunch of theories. Not when creation clearly points to a creator.

 

[annem]

This is not quite true. In Germany homeschooling is not allowed at all. You may of course school your children in any belief you like but you have to send them to an official school. The problem is that those people did not want to have their children educated at public schools or those run by the big Churches, because they fear the teachings they might get there. Like biology.

This is so sad, to see Germany turning against religion. Homeschooling is not allowed and yet people are forced to send their children to “official” schools to be taught true evil, and things their parents do not agree with. Religious belief is the one true freedom on which all other rights are built. And without true religious freedom governments tend to slide into all sorts of abuses, as witness this now in Germany.

This is…very, very sad.

God bless, Annem

 

[annem]

Another instance of anti Christian hatred from Germany was found at the Christival, a pro-Christian festival of young people, who were protested by some 450 people, who shouted “No God, no state, no patriarchy”, “Masturbation instead of Evangelization” or “Never again Jesus”.

God bless, Annem

 

[Jesus_N_Cherie]

Without personal salvation a Christian has no reason to live. But I admit having met two Christians - I believe they were Quakers - who’s concern for others went beyond personal salvation. This concern on their behalf did remind me of the Jesus character in the gospel stories.

In the end we can only judge others on what they do, not what they say, so we’re largely in agreement. What a person believes is only made known to others through his actions.

May they know we are christians by our love. But love of people does not apply to love of the earth…as many athiests want us to do. We can take care of our environment, but when it comes to caring more for the environment than for the wellfare of humans, something is drastically wrong. God created the world. He controls climate change. There is nothing we can do to change that.