Why do Catholics do that?

[drac16]

Yes, “Thou shalt not kill.”

Hence why we’re also against, except in extreme cases, war and the death penalty.

OK.

Why do catholics believe that that applies to an unborn child?

 

[7_Sorrows]

OK.

Why do catholics believe that that applies to an unborn child?

You yourself use the word child. Do you think killing a child - born or unborn is okay in the eyes of God?

 

[JRS_88]

OK.

Why do catholics believe that that applies to an unborn child?

It saddens me that that needs explaining. Wow.

 

[drac16]

You yourself use the word child. Do you think killing a child - born or unborn is okay in the eyes of God?

I’m just asking for answers from catholic sources. For the record, I am pro life. The Qur’an forces me to be pro-life. No, I don’t believe it’s OK to kill a child, except maybe in an ectopic pregnancy or other circumstances in which the mother’s life is at risk. I’m just trying to understand why catholics believe what they believe (that’s the point of this thread…to ask questions).

 

[drac16]

It saddens me that that needs explaining. Wow.

I’m allowed to ask questions, even if they may be controversial.

 

[TheTrinitySaves]

I’m allowed to ask questions, even if they may be controversial.

Do you accept Abraham?

 

[7_Sorrows]

I’m just asking for answers from catholic sources. For the record, I am pro life. The Qur’an forces me to be pro-life. No, I don’t believe it’s OK to kill a child, except maybe in an ectopic pregnancy or other circumstances in which the mother’s life is at risk. I’m just trying to understand why catholics believe what they believe (that’s the point of this thread…to ask questions).

Yes. I was confused because I thought I had read one of your posts before about being against abortion.

 

[drac16]

Do you accept Abraham?

Of course. He’s one of the most important prophets.

 

[TheTrinitySaves]

Of course. He’s one of the most important prophets.

More important than Muhammad?

 

[drac16]

More important than Muhammad?

No. The only way Abraham would have been the most important prophet is if we lived during his time. In the days of Abraham, Abraham was the most important prophet. Since we have the Qur’an, Muhammad is the most important one. His message was meant for all generations until Judgment Day.

 

[Peter_J]

OK.

Why do catholics believe that that applies to an unborn child?

It applies to human beings by default.

 

[Peter_J]

I’m just asking for answers from catholic sources. For the record, I am pro life. The Qur’an forces me to be pro-life.

Question: does the Koran force you to be against killing people in general? I ask because I would be against that even if I were not religious, but a lot of people like to see abortion as a religious issue.

 

[Hope_Philomena]

Yes, “Thou shalt not kill.”

Hence why we’re also against, except in extreme cases, war and the death penalty.

I have a question about this.

Why do Catholics allow extreme cases of war and death penalty, whereas they don’t allow extreme cases of abortion?

 

[Michael68]

I have a question about this.

Why do Catholics allow extreme cases of war and death penalty, whereas they don’t allow extreme cases of abortion?

What is an extreme case of abortion?

 

[tm21]

I have a question about this.

Why do Catholics allow extreme cases of war and death penalty, whereas they don’t allow extreme cases of abortion?

War and the death penalty involve the killing of an aggressor and can be an act of self defense and therefor be justified if certain conditions are met. Abortion is the killing of an innocent person and is therefor an intrinsic evil and can not be justified.

 

[tm21]

First, let me preface the following by stating that these misunderstandings on my part are most emphatically not a criticism of the Church. I am also familiar with counter-arguments to these statements below. It is my genuine struggle to understand, and not meant as a sign of disrespect.

No disrespect taken…these are good questions.

1.) The history of the Church’s anti-semitism, as outlined in great detail in Fr. Flannery’s book, “The Anguish of the Jews: 23 centuries of anti-semitism”. The book outlines many actions that the Church took throughout history that were very harmful to the Jewish people.

It is notable that Fr. Flannery was highly respected in the Catholic Church (and among Jews) and was in fact assigned as the first director of Catholic-Jewish Relations for the U.S. Bishops’ Committee for Ecumenical and Interreligious Affairs. Treatment of Jews over the centuries includes many dark periods…for both Catholics and Protestants. Note Martin Luther’s 1543 Treatise “On the Jews and their lies”. Sadly the positive actions of the Catholic Church toward Jews are almost always omitted in these discussions. For example, Pope Clement VI tried to protect the Jewish communities by two papal bulls (the first on July 6, 1348 and another 26 September 1348) saying that those who blamed the Black plague on the Jews had been “seduced by that liar, the Devil” and urging clergy to protect the Jews. Also, Pope Pius XI’s Encyclical “Mit Brennender Sorge” (“With Burning Anxiety”) promulgated in March 1937 was a stinging rebuke of the racist falsehoods being promulgated by the German Nazi regime. Israeli diplomat and historian Pinchas Lapide in his book “Three Popes and the Jews”, chronicles the overt and covert efforts of Pope Pius XII and two preceding popes that saved the lives of hundreds of thousands of Jews during the Holocaust.

2.) The concept of the Trinity in light of clear and unmistakable directives in the Book of Deuteronomy that there is only one Lord, and no other. This is perhaps the most confusing theological concept to many people, Catholic and non-Catholic alike.

Just because a theological concept is difficult, doesn’t mean that it is untrue. Certainly the concept that the person of Jesus Christ is both human and divine is a difficult concept…yet one we all accept through faith. The Christian belief in the Trinitarian God does not contradict the truth that there is but one God. There is one nature and essence (God) and Three Persons (Father, Son, Holy Spirit). To better understand your position, what do you think Jesus’ relationship with the Father is?

3.) The “de-Judaizing” of the Church for the purpose of converting Gentiles throughout the world, and the adoption of what one might consider to be “pagan” religious practices that have no basis in the Bible, some of which are actually prohibited in the Old Testament.

Could you be more specific please?

4.) The Gregorian calendar compared to the Jewish calendar. Particular dates follow on different times of the year when they should be aligned, such as Passover.

Why is this important?

5.) The Christian Sabbath as falling on Sunday, versus Saturday, the 7th day.

Catholics (and 99.0% of all Christians) celebrate Sunday as the new Sabbath because it has always been celebrated since biblical times on the 8th day…Christ’s resurrection from the dead, the day of the new creation. It is noteworthy that the only day in the Bible that the “breaking of the bread” is recorded taking place is the 1st day of the week: Sunday (Acts 20:7). We also have the testimony of Christian apologist Justin Martyr, who in about AD 150 wrote: “But Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly, because it is the first day on which God, having wrought a change in the darkness and matter, made the world; and Jesus Christ our Savior on the same day rose from the dead.” (First Apology, Chapter 67)

6.) Ascribing to Mary some “divine” attributes in particular prayers which should only really be attributed to the Creator.

When we live in Christ, we become partakers in his divine nature (2 Peter 1:4). Peter and Paul raised people from the dead! That God allows the faithful in heaven to receive prayers and pass on to God petitions is certainly possible if God desires it. That fact that he desires that the saints intercede for us in heaven makes perfect sense to me. Our God, is the God of the living, not of the dead (Luke 20:38) and we are commanded to pray for one another and we are told that the prayers of the righteous are particularly effective (James 5:16). Who could be more righteous than those who live in the direct presence of God in heaven?! Those in heaven and us believers on earth are all members of Christ’s one body.

7.) The heavy use of and promotion of statuary in light of the prohibitions against idolatry.

The use of statuary is not an offense against the prohibition of idolatry. If it is an offense then God would have been guilty of commanding idolatry when he told the Hebrews to construct in the inner sanctuary two huge gold plated Cherubim (1 Kings 6:23). It is only idolatry if one worships statues as if they themselves are God…which Catholics absolutely do not.

I hope this information is helpful to you!

 

[PJM]

MY REPLY

Hi, I’m the OP, thanks for sharing this!

This 1st issue is puzzling to me personally; as Jesus, & most of the Apostles were Jews, as were a great many of the early Church members. Pleading [partial [ignorance here as at no time in my lengthy faith formation was a prejudice against Judaism evident.

2.) The concept of the Trinity in light of clear and unmistakable directives in the Book of Deuteronomy that there is only one Lord, and no other. This is perhaps the most confusing theological concept to many people, Catholic and non-Catholic alike

My friend have you ever heard of “THE INFALLIBLE RULE FOR RIGHT UNDERSTANDING OF THE BIBLE?”

**Never Ever; can, may or DOES
One verse, passage or teaching have the power or authority to Invalidate, make void or override another Verse, passage or teaching:

Were this even the slightest possibility; [it’s NOT!] it would render the entire Bible
useless to teach or learn Christ Faith”**

Please check out these 2 sites
[1] jewsforjesus.org/newsletter-jun-1987/the-trinity-in-the-old-testament

[2] bible.ca/trinity/trinity-oneness-unity-plural-nouns-pronouns-verbs-adverbs.htm

3.) The “de-Judaizing” of the Church for the purpose of converting Gentiles throughout the world, and the adoption of what one might consider to be “pagan” religious practices that have no basis in the Bible, some of which are actually prohibited in the Old Testament

My friend, I’d like to respond to this, but can’t without specifics. Provide the specifics & I’ll attempt to respond to them.

BUT Christ never intended the RCC to be closely modeled after Judaism; indeed what Christ envisioned and accomplished was to be a NEW, a more perfect Religion and set of Faith beliefs and practices; with a limited amount of OT Jewish practices kept in a modified form. The use of Priest is a great example of this.

Further it was this large scale denial of Christ as the Messiah that led God through Jesus who is a part of the Trinity; to establish a New & a Separate Faith-religion to replace Judaism as the NEW One True Faith. Amen!

What Christ intended to do, is precisely what He accomplished:

Pagan’s would have their Temples Jews their Synagogues & Catholicism their “churches” & and in each case it is the set of Faith beliefs and practices that identify that body.

4.) The Gregorian calendar compared to the Jewish calendar. Particular dates follow on different times of the year when they should be aligned, such as Passover

This is obviously a difference of opinion, & Not going to be changed. Judaism if I recall correctly, largely did & do not recognize Christ as the long awaited Messiah, and therefore choose not to accept the “BC” & “AD” - Before Christ & After {his} Death demarcations.

5.) The Christian Sabbath as falling on Sunday, versus Saturday, the 7th day

This is a changeable CHURCH PRACTICE, not a unchangeable DOCTRINE; honoring the day of the week of Christ Resurrection

6.) Ascribing to Mary some “divine” attributes in particular prayers which should only really be attributed to the Creator

This is simply incorrect, but a common lack of right understanding. Because SPACE is limited on CAF, please send me a private message on this topic and I’ll reply in detail to it.

7.) The heavy use of and promotion of statuary in light of the prohibitions against idolatry

This overlaps your point #6, and if you send me a PM, I’ll address this with the Mary issue you raise.

SINCERE thanks for sharing, hope to hear from you soon.

GBY
Patrick [the OP]

 

[PJM]

Can I cheat and reverse it to a negative?

Why do Catholics refrain from talking about Jesus? Do they take “Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing then in the name of the father, son, holy spirit” seriously?

I’ve never had a Catholic approach me once to talk about Jesus, and the Catholics I do know are very quiet about their faith.

GREAT QUESTION & Thanks from me the OP:thumbsup:

My friend, there is absolutely NO lack of discussion about JESUS in the RCC.

Directly and indirection His Name is mentioned multiple times at EVERY Mass; and in every Gospel reading [one per every Mass], JESUS is the TOPICAL-center of attention.

My friend, not sure where your getting your information.

Watch a Catholic Mass on EWTN sometime: they are at:
8am
noon
7 pm
Midnight every day of the week.

When we “CROSS” ourselves we recite: “in the name of the Father, the SON [Jesus] and the Holy Spirit”…AMEN! *

John 10:30
I and the Father are one.

God Bless you!*

 

[Hope_Philomena]

What is an extreme case of abortion?

Very young child pregnancies, ectopic pregnancy, etc etc. Things that endanger the life of the mother.

 

[PJM]

There is also a third type of sin__the unforgivable sin which is when people leave the church. If a women has had an abortion she can still regain her salvation by confessing and receiving penance from the archbishop.

I may be wrong here:shrug:

But Pope Francis in the Year of Mercy [last year] empowered ALL priest to be able to forgive the sin of Abortion; and I [me here] believe at the end of the year he Francis extended that indefinitely

Also [Me again here] don’t think that EVERY diocese has an “Archbishop”; hence the Local Ordinary [Bishop] can also forgive this sin.

GBY

Patrick