Why do fundamentalists believe the world is 6000-10000 years old?

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All true, but how does this contribute to the topic?
Perhaps you missed the part where I wrote that God can do things without human technology and without a natural explanation? The contribution to the topic includes certain Biblical references that point to a much younger age to the earth than current science indicates as in the case of the first man and the first woman. And by the way, there is nothing Protestant about any of that.

Peace,
Ed
 
Actually, no. There is the multiverse theory. There is the expansion-contraction theory where the Universe condenses up to a point and begins to expand again. The add-on to that theory is that the Universe may be infinite. There are definitely issues where science and Church teaching do not line up from an explanation standpoint. But, as I pointed out, God can do things without technology that leave no explanation.

Peace,
Ed
There are various speculations such as multiverse, etc, which aren’t worth the paper they are written on, but I fail to see what relevance your posts have to this thread. Let me put it more bluntly: Ed you are not being relevant here. Go have some coffee and wake up, dude.
 
Perhaps you missed the part where I wrote that God can do things without human technology and without a natural explanation? The contribution to the topic includes certain Biblical references that point to a much younger age to the earth than current science indicates as in the case of the first man and the first woman. And by the way, there is nothing Protestant about any of that.
Peace,
Ed
Yes it is Protestant in origination. The bible gives no indication whatsoever for the age of the earth or when Adam and Eve were first created. The chronologies in Genesis are religious chronologies and not scientific or strictly historical time lines. You are arguing for Biblical Literalism which has been sufficiently debunked in this thread.

Do you have something new to add?
 
Did you “accidentally” not see the quotes from the Catholic Encyclopedia that make it clear the manner in which you interpret the Deluge story is incorrect?

Did you also not see the quote from Fr. Jaki, who was a member of the Pontifical Academy of Science who also makes it clear that a literalist interpretation of the Deluge is not reasonable or accurate.

The Bible contains many literary genres through which the inspired writers communicate their message. Each *genus litterarium *has it’s own way of communicating. If you do not correctly and fully recognize the *genus litterarium and how it works, *thenyou are not reading the text as it was intended to read. Apparently, you read under the false belief that since the biblical text is inerrant than it must be historical. However, their is no justification for that position based on the history of biblical exegesis.

For example, are you aware that Origen, St. Augustine, St. Gregory of Nyssa and his school taught that Genesis 1 cannot be interpreted as creation in a literal six days? Furthermore, St. Thomas Aquinas said a direct creation in six days is favored “by a superficial reading of Scripture.”

In addition, St. Thomas Aquinas teaches in the Summa Theologica that the literal sense in Scripture is the basis for the other senses intended by the sacred writers. It would seem that you are stuck not actually on the literal sense but a literalism, which does not take one very far into the meaning.

Also, are you aware that the Vatican does not agree with literalistic reading of Scripture. Here is a quote from *Dei Verbum *( *Dogmatic Constitution on Divine Revelation)
*
12. However, since God speaks in Sacred Scripture through men in human fashion, the interpreter of Sacred Scripture, in order to see clearly what God wanted to communicate to us, should carefully investigate what meaning the sacred writers really intended, and what God wanted to manifest by means of their words.

To search out the intention of the sacred writers, attention should be given, among other things, to “literary forms.” For truth is set forth and expressed differently in texts which are variously historical, prophetic, poetic, or of other forms of discourse. The interpreter must investigate what meaning the sacred writer intended to express and actually expressed in particular circumstances by using contemporary literary forms in accordance with the situation of his own time and culture. For the correct understanding of what the sacred author wanted to assert, due attention must be paid to the customary and characteristic styles of feeling, speaking and narrating which prevailed at the time of the sacred writer, and to the patterns men normally employed at that period in their everyday dealings with one another.

I think you are discounting what the Church teaches about reading the Bible and holding fast to your own ideas without learning from the Church.
Here we go - so just tell us all a little bit more as regards those non Catholics in "The Pontifical Academy of Science"and Fr Stanley Jaki in no way,shape or form it seems the darling of creationists - it seems you are determined we should accept a small minority of Church Fathers and reject the vast majority on whom the Church’s teaching and tradition is actually based - twinc
 
Here we go - so just tell us all a little bit more as regards those non Catholics in "The Pontifical Academy of Sciece"and Fr Stanley Jaki in no way,shape or form it seems the darling of creationists - it seems you are determined we should accept a small minority of Church Fathers and reject the vast majority on whom the Church’s teaching and tradition is actually based - twinc
For my edification…would you please list some of the vast majority. After the Church realized the earth is not the center of the universe.
 
For my edification…would you please list some of the vast majority. After the Church realized the earth is not the center of the universe.
This is my area of expertise spn. Would you list ONE official abrogation showing 'the Church realized the earth is not the center of the universe. As regards the age of the earth, the Church has a martyrology already shown. Now show me any contrary prayer or declaration?
 
Another inconvenient fact for creationists on biblical literalist:

St. Augustine and St. Gregory of Nyssa and his school taught a theological form of biological evolution. :eek:
Here we go again - but listen and take note - "all the other[majority]of Church Fathers did not and they are what Catholic teaching and tradition are all about.What has got hold of some Catholics who it seems are prepared to accept anything and everything except what is in the Bible and Church teaching - twinc
 
Then we still have a problem, as someone correctly pointed out earlier: what about the dinosaurs?

My work is with dinosaurs and ancient, extinct species of plant and animal life. We have, in our possession, a 90% + or - "complete skull of a Tyrannosaurus, estimated to be 67 myo. We have in our possession a Jinfengopteryx, the oriental version of the Archaeopteryx. Our skeleton is 100% complete. It has a reptilian mouth with teeth, not a beak. It had feathers, but, could not yet fly as its feathers were not slightly angular, as is needed for flight.

We have Saber toothed cats (est. between 1.8 myo - 10,000 yo), Trilobites (est. at 450 myo), Keichousaurs ( est. around 210 myo), Ammonites of various ages, which went extinct 65 million years ago (when dinosaurs went extinct), petrified wood, that is between 210 - 240 million years old, fossil fish, such as Knightia, Diplomystus, Priscacara, Phareodus, Heliobatus, Mioplosus, Notogoneus, and others that went extinct about 35 million years ago (or more), when the three lakes of the Wyoming, Colorado and Idaho border area dried up.

These are not occasional anomalies, as someone earlier said. They are regularly found fossil animals. I can take you to the digs and we can chip away for ourselves. I promise you’ll see many complete fossils - not pre-placed by tricksters.

Recently, an almost “complete” T-rex skeleton was discovered in eastern Montana, est. to be 67 - 65 myo. You can purchase it for your home for about $8 million dollars.

So, it is absurd to think that they did not exist. It is absurd to think they did not pre-date modern man. It is absurd to think that they were occasional anomalies.

jd
 
This is my area of expertise spn. Would you list ONE official abrogation showing 'the Church realized the earth is not the center of the universe.'Indeed while your at it, list one official declaration that says catholicism allows one to believe in evolution? As regards the age of the earth, the Church has a martyrology already shown. Now show me any contrary proyer or declaration?
I understand this is your area of expertise. That’s why I asked for the education. Instead you’ve chosen to disregard my request under the guise that you know better than I do.

Whether you accept the Catholic Encyclopedia provided by CAF is not my concern. But here is the link dealing with evolution.

oce.catholic.com/index.php?title=Evolution

Peace
 
Then we still have a problem, as someone correctly pointed out earlier: what about the dinosaurs?

My work is with dinosaurs and ancient, extinct species of plant and animal life. We have, in our possession, a 90% + or - "complete skull of a Tyrannosaurus, estimated to be 67 myo. We have in our possession a Jinfengopteryx, the oriental version of the Archaeopteryx. Our skeleton is 100% complete. It has a reptilian mouth with teeth, not a beak. It had feathers, but, could not yet fly as its feathers were not slightly angular, as is needed for flight.

We have Saber toothed cats (est. between 1.8 myo - 10,000 yo), Trilobites (est. at 450 myo), Keichousaurs ( est. around 210 myo), Ammonites of various ages, which went extinct 65 million years ago (when dinosaurs went extinct), petrified wood, that is between 210 - 240 million years old, fossil fish, such as Knightia, Diplomystus, Priscacara, Phareodus, Heliobatus, Mioplosus, Notogoneus, and others that went extinct about 35 million years ago (or more), when the three lakes of the Wyoming, Colorado and Idaho border area dried up.

These are not occasional anomalies, as someone earlier said. They are regularly found fossil animals. I can take you to the digs and we can chip away for ourselves. I promise you’ll see many complete fossils - not pre-placed by tricksters.

Recently, an almost “complete” T-rex skeleton was discovered in eastern Montana, est. to be 67 - 65 myo. You can purchase it for your home for about $8 million dollars.

So, it is absurd to think that they did not exist. It is absurd to think they did not pre-date modern man. It is absurd to think that they were occasional anomalies.

jd
You don’t understand…As Twinc said earlier…those sharp dagger like teeth were for tearing away at lush vegetation. 🤷
 
I understand this is your area of expertise. That’s why I asked for the education. Instead you’ve chosen to disregard my request under the guise that you know better than I do.

Whether you accept the Catholic Encyclopedia provided by CAF is not my concern. But here is the link dealing with evolution.

oce.catholic.com/index.php?title=Evolution

Peace
spn, on another thread Michael Francis closed the apologetics on evolution under threat of a ban. I do not know if this thread is included. I am presuming it does. Until I hear to the contrary I am taking a rest from the subject too.
 
You don’t understand…As Twinc said earlier…those sharp dagger like teeth were for tearing away at lush vegetation. 🤷
If he is right, there should be no reason for finding anything but fossilized leafy matter in the stomachs of the Tyrannosaurs, Tarbosaurs, and other apparent meat eaters among the dinosaurs. But, that’s not what has been found!

jd
 
If you look at what the Church teaches, there are certain divinely revealed truths. For Catholics, as we affirm at Mass, He has spoken through the prophets.

First, if you believe in miracles such as those Jesus performed and in Jesus Christ as an actual person and as God, then God can raise the dead and give sight to the blind and create the Universe out of nothing. These things are literally true.

Ed, I do believe in Jesus and his miracles he preformed while on earth. I do also believe that God can and does preform miracles also, however, the Old Testiment was written by the Hebrews to teach the young men to read and Gods ways. It is a book of Gods ways not history.

If science, so called, cannot comment on or explain these things, it should be obvious that God can do things without offering a scientific explanation. In fact, God uses no technology at all as we understand it.

Ed, Gods ways will never be explained by humans, however, God did give us the ability of reasoning and a drive to explore our surroundings. Man then must try to explain these things he has learned to other humans. I do not see this as rejecting creationism, but as using a gift that God has given us.

We are descended from two individuals. They are not part of a group of other human individuals. Finally, the Church teaches that the woman was formed by God from the man’s side. Even if a scientist from today stood next to Jesus and watched him perform His miracles, what explanation could he give? Feeding 5,000 people with a few loaves and fishes? What? God made more appear just as each disciple reached into the basket? Of course. This is what God can do and it literally does not offer a natural explanation.

No one is disputing that we are decended from two individuals, we are only saying that the Old Testiment should not be taken literaly. Remenber Ed, the Old Testment was written thousands of years ago by the most learned and religious Hebrew leaders of that time. What we now know today about the Earth and God (through Jesus’s teachings), would darf their knowledge of the world and religion then.

As far as the age of the earth, the Church offers no final teaching. It does say that the Universe has a finite age.

I agree with this.

Hope this helps,
Ed

Go with Gods Grace!
 
Then we still have a problem, as someone correctly pointed out earlier: what about the dinosaurs?

My work is with dinosaurs and ancient, extinct species of plant and animal life. We have, in our possession, a 90% + or - "complete skull of a Tyrannosaurus, estimated to be 67 myo. We have in our possession a Jinfengopteryx, the oriental version of the Archaeopteryx. Our skeleton is 100% complete. It has a reptilian mouth with teeth, not a beak. It had feathers, but, could not yet fly as its feathers were not slightly angular, as is needed for flight.

We have Saber toothed cats (est. between 1.8 myo - 10,000 yo), Trilobites (est. at 450 myo), Keichousaurs ( est. around 210 myo), Ammonites of various ages, which went extinct 65 million years ago (when dinosaurs went extinct), petrified wood, that is between 210 - 240 million years old, fossil fish, such as Knightia, Diplomystus, Priscacara, Phareodus, Heliobatus, Mioplosus, Notogoneus, and others that went extinct about 35 million years ago (or more), when the three lakes of the Wyoming, Colorado and Idaho border area dried up.

These are not occasional anomalies, as someone earlier said. They are regularly found fossil animals. I can take you to the digs and we can chip away for ourselves. I promise you’ll see many complete fossils - not pre-placed by tricksters.

Recently, an almost “complete” T-rex skeleton was discovered in eastern Montana, est. to be 67 - 65 myo. You can purchase it for your home for about $8 million dollars.

So, it is absurd to think that they did not exist. It is absurd to think they did not pre-date modern man. It is absurd to think that they were occasional anomalies.

jd
Awesome! 👍
 
Here we go - so just tell us all a little bit more as regards those non Catholics in "The Pontifical Academy of Science"and Fr Stanley Jaki in no way,shape or form it seems the darling of creationists - it seems you are determined we should accept a small minority of Church Fathers and reject the vast majority on whom the Church’s teaching and tradition is actually based - twinc
What is this Church teaching that you allude to?
 
Here we go again - but listen and take note - "all the other[majority]of Church Fathers did not and they are what Catholic teaching and tradition are all about.What has got hold of some Catholics who it seems are prepared to accept anything and everything except what is in the Bible and Church teaching - twinc
Again, what is this Church teaching that you vaguely allude to?
 
I invite everyone to read part 5 of this encyclical:

vatican.va/holy_father/leo_xiii/encyclicals/documents/hf_l-xiii_enc_10021880_arcanum_en.html

God can do things that are outside of the realm of scientific explanations.

Peace,
Ed
God Himself is outside the realm of scientific explanations. But what is it that you think God did that is relevant to the topic of this thread? You are still leaving me to guess what you are thinking and I am not very good at that.
 
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