Why Do Protestants Shun Mary?

[Goya]

re: “With some reading and a little effort, the theology regarding Mary can be clarified.”

And that reading of scripture will clarify that scripture nowhere raises Mary to the lofty heights claimed by Rome.

More protestant nonsense.

The four patriarchates hold the Virgin Mary in the highest esteem, all in line with Rome. They only hedge on the last 2 dogmas (IC and Assumption), as dogmas.

The disciples of ‘the prophet’ Martin Luther stand alone in all of Christendom, in their steadfast, determined minimization of the role of Mary.

Only the protestant takes comfort in fiction that the womb used by the Lord in the Incarnation–God becoming Man–that the Ark of the New Covenant, holy enough to host The Word Incarnate–more holy than the “Holy of Holies”–could be tainted with sin…

…so mundane, that other sin-tainted humans could inconspicuously be ushered in to this life, with zero mention in the Bible, zero mention in history or Tradition…

…just a bunch of anonymous biological half-brothers, roaming about…

Seems Satan missed that one–oh, the possibilities…

Alas, the disciples of ‘the prophet’ Martin Luther, did not–or at least, they have found enough ambiguity in the deafening silence thereof, to concoct a bogus concept to which they cling whole-heartedly, for no other reason than to spite ‘Rome’–nothwithstanding what implications such a belief could–nay would–have, on the very Christ they pretend to glorify thereby.

NB: for all his faults…even Martin Luther held steadfast to the perpetual virginity of the Blessed Virgin Mary (which is why I attribute the wayward turn in this regard, to his disciples, and not to him directly).

 

[atmmgraves]

re: “With some reading and a little effort, the theology regarding Mary can be clarified.”

And that reading of scripture will clarify that scripture nowhere raises Mary to the lofty heights claimed by Rome.

And you ignoring all of the information heretofore provided to you in this thread that explain and buttress Catholic beliefs on this issue only serves to demonstrate your unwillingness to learn about Catholic beliefs.

 

[Charlemagne_III]

Interestingly, the very first edition of the King James Bible lists in the table of contents two days to be observed as “Holy Days” for Mary:

The Purification of the Blessed Virgin

The Annunciation of the Blessed Virgin

Check it out!

bibles-online.net/1611/Introduction/

16 clicks on your mouse and then zoom in to read the days

 

[Goya]

Luther’s actual words:

Scripture does not say or indicate that she later lost her virginity . . .
When Matthew [1:25] says that Joseph did not know Mary carnally until she had brought forth her son, it does not follow that he knew her subsequently; on the contrary, it means that he never did know her . . . ***This babble . . . is without justification ***. . . he has neither noticed nor paid any attention to either Scripture or the common idiom.

{Pelikan, ibid., v.45:206,212-3 / That Jesus Christ was Born a Jew (1523) }

“. . . she is full of grace, proclaimed to be entirely without sin. . . . God’s grace fills her with everything good and makes her devoid of all evil. . . . God is with her, meaning that all she did or left undone is divine and the action of God in her. Moreover, God guarded and protected her from all that might be hurtful to her.”

(Luther’s Works, American edition, vol. 43, p. 40, ed. H. Lehmann, Fortress, 1968)

It is a sweet and pious belief that the infusion of Mary’s soul was effected without original sin; so that in the very infusion of her soul she was also purified from original sin and adorned with God’s gifts, receiving a pure soul infused by God; thus from the first moment she began to live she was free from all sin"

(Sermon: “On the Day of the Conception of the Mother of God,” 1527)

She is full of grace, proclaimed to be entirely without sin- something exceedingly great. For God’s grace fills her with everything good and makes her devoid of all evil.

(Personal {“Little”} Prayer Book, 1522)

FWIW.

 

[zz912]

And that reading of scripture will clarify that scripture nowhere raises Mary to the lofty heights claimed by Rome.

Is this passage not in your Bible?

Luke 1:26 And in the sixth month, the angel Gabriel was sent from God into a city of Galilee, called Nazareth,27 To a virgin espoused to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin’s name was Mary. 28 And the angel being come in, said unto her: Hail, full of grace, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women. 29 Who having heard, was troubled at his saying, and thought with herself what manner of salutation this should be.

30 And the angel said to her: Fear not, Mary, for thou hast found grace with God. 31 Behold thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and shalt bring forth a son; and thou shalt call his name Jesus. 32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the most High; and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of David his father; and he shall reign in the house of Jacob for ever. 33 And of his kingdom there shall be no end.

34 And Mary said to the angel: How shall this be done, because I know not man? 35 And the angel answering, said to her: The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the most High shall overshadow thee. And therefore also** the Holy which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God**. 36 And behold thy cousin Elizabeth, she also hath conceived a son in her old age; and this is the sixth month with her that is called barren: 37 Because no word shall be impossible with God.

38 And Mary said: Behold the handmaid of the Lord; be it done to me according to thy word. And the angel departed from her.

39 And Mary rising up in those days, went into the hill country with haste into a city of Juda. 40 And she entered into the house of Zachary, and saluted Elizabeth. 41 And it came to pass, that when Elizabeth heard the salutation of Mary, the infant leaped in her womb. And Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Ghost: 42 And she cried out with a loud voice, and said: Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb. 43 And whence is this to me, that the **mother of my Lord **should come to me? 44 For behold as soon as the voice of thy salutation sounded in my ears, the infant in my womb leaped for joy. 45 And blessed art thou that hast believed, because those things shall be accomplished that were spoken to thee by the Lord.

 

[Eldee]

Why do Protestants shun Mary? Perhaps it is for the same reason that Catholics have shunned the reading of the bible by the masses of the faithful. Understand that Protestants made the scriptures the basis of their faith, immediately following the reformation.
Human nature seems to need to draw lines of demarcation between competing entities. And so when groups like Catholics and Protestants define themselves they do it in a way that accents their rivalry. That is, if the one emphasizes a certain form of worship, the other will do the opposite.

 

[JoeT777]

Why do Protestants shun Mary? Perhaps it is for the same reason that Catholics have shunned the reading of the bible by the masses of the faithful.

What makes you think that Catholics ‘shunned reading Scripture’. Mass contains the Liturgy of the Word., its an integral part of the Mass and has been since Christ. It was even part of the Mass during the so called protest started in the 1520’s.

Understand that Protestants made the scriptures the basis of their faith, immediately following the reformation.

A book is the basis of faith? Do Protestant/reformers worship book?

Human nature seems to need to draw lines of demarcation between competing entities. And so when groups like Catholics and Protestants define themselves they do it in a way that accents their rivalry. That is, if the one emphasizes a certain form of worship, the other will do the opposite.

That’s not exactly the way I see it, the Catholic Church isn’t competing with anything or anybody. Her role is to be an infallible source of doctrine, and grace through the sacraments. I don’t see Protestant or reformers as rivals, rather as those who have abandoned the Kingdom of God to create their own little kingdoms.

JoeT

 

[SjMelnychuk]

Why do Protestants shun Mary? Perhaps it is for the same reason that Catholics have shunned the reading of the bible by the masses of the faithful. Understand that Protestants made the scriptures the basis of their faith, immediately following the reformation.
Human nature seems to need to draw lines of demarcation between competing entities. And so when groups like Catholics and Protestants define themselves they do it in a way that accents their rivalry. That is, if the one emphasizes a certain form of worship, the other will do the opposite.

The way I see it is that Catholics do not rival against Protestants. We are all brothers and sisters in Christ though there are a few doctrinal differences. The very name Protestant comes from the word Protest. It is the Protestant Churches (majority - not all) who are or whose movement began in protest against the Catholic Church but none of this has to do with the topic of who Mary is or why some are perceived to shun Mary.

 

[SjMelnychuk]

Why do Protestants shun Mary? Perhaps it is for the same reason that Catholics have shunned the reading of the bible by the masses of the faithful. Understand that Protestants made the scriptures the basis of their faith, immediately following the reformation.
Human nature seems to need to draw lines of demarcation between competing entities. And so when groups like Catholics and Protestants define themselves they do it in a way that accents their rivalry. That is, if the one emphasizes a certain form of worship, the other will do the opposite.

Also as someone noted, the Mass is filled with Sacred Scripture. You can’t say Catholics shun Protestants for reading the bible. In fact, we’re encouraged to know Sacred Scripture. It’s just Catholics have a different view is the bible cannot be the sole rule of faith, notably Tradition came before the NT was canonized by quite a few hundred years and for the majority of the Churches history. The issue goes back to people trusting in their own fallible interpretation while neglecting the fact that the bible says the Church is the pillar and foundation of truth. If Protestants were to see scripture they take out of context and place them back into its right context people would have a far better understanding of Mary and perhaps more Protestants would not only begin to understand who Mary is, they’d probably become Catholic

 

[ZellieFan]

As a former Protestant, I grieve for our Protestant brothers and sisters because they don’t have a relationship with Our Lady. It is simple ignorance–not malice. They just don’t understand. Our Lady of Guadaloupe said “I am the Mother of all who dwell in this land. . .” She is still their Mother whether they know it or not. I have placed my family under Our Lady’s mantle without their permission. I believe she loves them just the same.

 

[Cyberseeker]

Catholicism has always held a special place of veneration (not worship) for the importance of Mary in Christian theology.

When, why, and who were the first Protestants to begin the shunning of Mary in their theology?

Shun? :ehh: I think Mary was a wonderful person, and I greatly admire her.

 

[rstrats]

SjMelnychuk,

re: “Really?? No scripture raises Mary as Queen of Heaven?”

Yes, really. There simply is no scripture that refers to the Messiah’s mother as the queen of heaven.

re: “Revelation 11:19-12:2…It’s rather easy to call Mary the Ark of the New Covenant.”

Or as the commentary of the New American Bible (the official Roman Catholic Bible for America) states: “The woman adorned with the sun, the moon, and the stars (images taken from Gn 37:9–10) symbolizes God’s people in the Old and the New Testament. The Israel of old gave birth to the Messiah (Rev 12:5) and then became the new Israel, the church, which suffers persecution by the dragon (Rev 12:6, 13–17); cf. Is 50:1; 66:7; Jer 50:12.”

 

[Jeanne_S]

SjMelnychuk,

re: “Really?? No scripture raises Mary as Queen of Heaven?”

Yes, really. There simply is no scripture that refers to the Messiah’s mother as the queen of heaven.

re: “Revelation 11:19-12:2…It’s rather easy to call Mary the Ark of the New Covenant.”

Or as the commentary of the New American Bible (the official Roman Catholic Bible for America) states: “The woman adorned with the sun, the moon, and the stars (images taken from Gn 37:9–10) symbolizes God’s people in the Old and the New Testament. The Israel of old gave birth to the Messiah (Rev 12:5) and then became the new Israel, the church, which suffers persecution by the dragon (Rev 12:6, 13–17); cf. Is 50:1; 66:7; Jer 50:12.”

Here is a suggestion.You can go to the section under apologists,submit your question to one of them,or to Fr.Serpa specifically.

 

[rstrats]

Jeanne S,
re: “Here is a suggestion.You can go to the section under apologists,submit your question to one of them,or to Fr.Serpa specifically.”

To what question are you referring?

 

[Philthy]

The Protestant rejection of Mary is quite simple: Having completed her earthly role she is currently unnecessary with respect to salvation.

 

[cheezey]

Just following here. Mostly, I play in the Clubhouse.

What you should see is what is in the Catechism below. The Church has never taught worship or adoration of Mary, but rather devotion, which is altogether different.

This very special devotion . . . differs essentially from the adoration which is given to the incarnate Word and equally to the Father and the Holy Spirit, and greatly fosters this adoration."516 The liturgical feasts dedicated to the Mother of God and Marian prayer, such as the rosary, an “epitome of the whole Gospel,” express this devotion to the Virgin Mary.…

I was wondering when someone would quote the CCC.
Thank you.

I pray in a nearby Catholic Chapel. A lot. I cannot count the number of people who come in, sit and pray at the feet of Mary, and then leave. They do not even pass Jesus, much less pray at His feet.

I find it fascinating that a Protestant seeing a Catholic doing something, seemingly anything, will often assume that the Catholic is perfectly following the teachings of the Catholic Church and from what they see, vehemently disagree. With that, I can understand why some Protestants would see this and think “worshipping Mary?!” Protestants thinking like this are poorly taught, if they are taught at all, just as some Catholics are poorly catechised and thus bypass Jesus. A co-worker abandoned his Catholic faith, in part, because he didn’t believe he should “worship” Mary. (Among other misconceptions regarding his own faith.) I felt compelled to set him straight!
Can I guess he was poorly catechised?

On each “side”, there are misconceptions.
On each “side”, there should be questions, not assumptions.

Just my opnion.

People and things consecrated to God are not to be used for normal/carnal purposes again. Mary was consecrated to God when the Holy Spirit overshadowed her. She is the Ark of the New Covenant, and the Ark is reserved to God alone. Man is not supposed to touch it.

This is the best response I have read on this matter. Ever!
Thank you!

 

[Jeanne_S]

Jeanne S,
re: “Here is a suggestion.You can go to the section under apologists,submit your question to one of them,or to Fr.Serpa specifically.”

To what question are you referring?

Mainly that you persist in your assertion that there is no biblical foundation for venerating of Mary,no biblical reference to her being an intercessor between us and God,etc

 

[JoeT777]

Mainly that you persist in your assertion that there is no biblical foundation for venerating of Mary,no biblical reference to her being an intercessor between us and God,etc

There is no biblical reference to men flying. Yet, he and many others get on an airplane every day of the week. I wonder how he explains planes, trains trucks, and automobiles?

JoeT

 

[Cyberseeker]

Esther was an extraordinary queen - brave and beautiful. Deborah was a wise leader at a time when most leaders were men, but she was the one God chose as judge during a dangerous time.

As for Mary, she was the greatest woman of all. She was the human mother of the incarnated Christ! I respect, admire, and speak highly of her. As a protestant, am I missing something?

 

[GaryTaylor]

Esther was an extraordinary queen - brave and beautiful. Deborah was a wise leader at a time when most leaders were men, but she was the one God chose as judge during a dangerous time.

As for Mary, she was the greatest woman of all. She was the human mother of the incarnated Christ! I respect, admire, and speak highly of her. As a protestant, am I missing something?

Not a thing, its the point the Catholic Church been working on last couple hundred years with the protestant world. It would go a long way with world peace if we all acknowledge the East-West understanding of the Incarnation of the Word of God and what unites orthodoxy. We need to always remember, “worship” worship God. To do this leads directly to the conclusion of honor for His will, and the most holy family. Thats “His will”.

Personally I think this issue has a good deal to do with the growth of evil in the world. Too much chaos and lack of honor for “His will”. The Bible doesn’t explicitly tell you this either.

Its not Gods will to suppress the veneration of Mary whom He chose from all eternity, its the battle of good and evil. To me to not seek to understand and embrace the teaching is one thing, to fight against it is alarming. Intercession and prayer follows, communion of Saints.

To some its a sin to venerate the Saints, Mother of God, Icons, and Crucifix etc. Imho thats narrow minded and attempts to tame the Holy Spirit and speaks directly against a line of succession in the apostolic Churches which date right to the Cross. If God, the God of Christianity ever sent anyone to speak from Him, it would be here through this succession and its right to listen to them.