Why do women settle for men who treat them badly?

[whatevergirl]

Women in general love praise, love to please, and love to make sacrifices. So if a man first praises her, then criticizes her, then eventually deigns to praise her again, a lot of women will buy this. Similarly, a lot of women will put up with stuff because they think it’s a sacrifice for love, and that eventually the man will be pleased by it.

Some men respond to this, too. It’s as if the person pushes their buttons and gets them acting like an obedient child. Some bosses do this to their employees, too.

The whole thing is really a caricature of a real adult relationship, but it does seem to have a lot of power.

I had never looked at it in this way, that’s an interesting perception.

 

[the_phoenix]

I didn’t settle. And I’m a middle-aged, never-married single woman. Some say I may be a late vocation. Maybe Rosalind Moss’s upcoming order of nuns that has no age limit? Or maybe just remain a single, pro-life prayer warrior … I do not feel that I’m called to the marriage vocation, at any rate.

Tried dating on a very good, reputable Catholic Singles Website. There were in fact men there that seemed like real decent guys … Only none of them seemed right for me. Prayed about it in a Eucharistic Adoration Chapel, and the answer seemed to be that I’m not meant to be married. At which point, I immediately gave up looking any further for a compatible potential mate on the singles website, even though I still had several more months of active membership.

~~ the phoenix

 

[whatevergirl]

I didn’t settle. And I’m a middle-aged, never-married single woman. Some say I may be a late vocation. Maybe Rosalind Moss’s upcoming order of nuns that has no age limit? Or maybe just remain a single, pro-life prayer warrior … I do not feel that I’m called to the marriage vocation, at any rate.

Tried dating on a very good, reputable Catholic Singles Website. There were in fact men there that seemed like real decent guys … Only none of them seemed right for me. Prayed about it in a Eucharistic Adoration Chapel, and the answer seemed to be that I’m not meant to be married. At which point, I immediately gave up looking any further for a compatible potential mate on the singles website, even though I still had several more months of active membership.

~~ the phoenix

Not everyone is ‘called’ to marriage, that is so true! And I really like how you chose your words to explain that. Your story is so simple, yet so interesting. When you prayed about in a Eucharistic Adoration Chapel…did you actually hear God’s voice calling you to remain single? I ask, because when I ask for help in making life altering decisions, I can faintly hear a voice. And I have always felt that voice to be God’s. And a calmness comes over me, typically. It seems that happened for you, because you ‘immediately’ stopped looking…I think that is such a cool story.

I also believe that if you are at peace with decisions like this, then that is also God’s will showing through, also.

 

[chevalier]

Women who don’t return calls repeatedly, unless something earth shattering happened, are not interested. Women who don’t return text messages, emails, and any other type of communication within a 48 hr period, are generally not interested. I never rule anything out. I was not altogether interested in my husband when we met, although, it wasn’t him per se, I was just not ready for something serious, and I knew he was…and I was just open with him about that. We were friends …then started dating again after a year of friendship…and the rest is history.

But, more often than not, if a woman is interested in you, she will accept your request to go see a movie…or out to dinner. She won’t say no, and not call you. lol I feel badly that there seem to be so many women out there unable to just tell a guy…no, I don’t see us being together. That would be too simple I guess.

I never said we weren’t complicated, as times.

My view is similar to yours, although my experience is rather messy in this regard. It is generally my preference to let go of people who do not show interest unless I know them to care despite not being very outgoing. These days I generally don’t have problems reading people, but I used to have problems on the early stage, not being able to tell if a girl was interested “that way” or merely being drawn but not really keen on actually getting involved. I generally tend to have a powerful but short effect on women. This generally complicates matters. The lasting effect is much milder and is generally not able to compete with other attractions, which is fine by me, since I want someone interested in me, not someone who will stick to me despite being interested rather in someone else. So it’s not bad, really. I probably have it the way which suits me.

But, more often than not, if a woman is interested in you, she will accept your request to go see a movie…or out to dinner. She won’t say no, and not call you. lol I feel badly that there seem to be so many women out there unable to just tell a guy…no, I don’t see us being together. That would be too simple I guess.

Depends which guy, I suppose. Some people have something which makes you not want to get involved with them forever, but they still have something which draws you to them and/or makes you like the time you spend with them. I feel this kind of thing too, but I generally control it and I don’t get romantic or otherwise create false hopes. On the other hand, I can’t really blame people who don’t manage to keep it together because it may be very hard at times.

 

[whatevergirl]

You have a powerful yet short effect on women? Aw. It just means you have not met the right person yet.

You don’t sound worried though, and I would suggest to anyone when dating to not worry about the future. Dating is meant to be fun…really.

 

[Simon_X]

I absolutely believe this goes back to the father/daughter relationship. Dads who are involved, loving, protective and expect certain standards of behaviour generally raise daughters with a solid sense of self-esteem who simply won’t tolerate poor treatment from anyone, much less a male partner. Dads are vital to raising healthy women. One thing I absolutely do NOT worry about is my girls ever settling for some guy who couldn’t stand eye to eye with their father and confidently assure him that his intentions were honorable or his commitment (in the case of marriage) above all else in this world!

I agree!

My daughter goes to an all girls High School and everyone of those girls has a father or guardian looking out for them…Each and every girl there is respectful, hardworking, intelligent, and have no self esteem issues (in most cases, maybe too much ego…lol). This is absolutely imperative in bringing up healthy young women. So far, I ve been very impressed with the young men that my daughter and her friends hang with too. All decent and respectful.

 

[Simon_X]

Ok. Let me preface this by saying that yes, I am a jerk, an a***ole or any other name you want to call me.

Here goes:

Nobody should put up with being treated like ****. Nobody. I grew up in the south and was taught that girls are special and you take care of them.

Sometimes you gotta call for an intervention. We did this for a good friends sister. She was getting hit and we told hubby that he was getting a divorce and leaving town and he was going to sign anything she sent him. And he did. It was illegal as hell, but the cops didn’t care. I know that I am an old-fashioned sexist stick-in-the-mud but I believe that if a girl is being treated this way it is up to the men in her family/church to talk with her and her special friend (hopefully before marriage) about what is right and what is wrong and how the cow is gonna eat the cabbage.

You can flame me now, I’m a big boy.

Bryan

You have my respect sir!

 

[chevalier]

You have a powerful yet short effect on women? Aw. It just means you have not met the right person yet.

Thanks. Yeah, I suppose so. None of the other parties to my 40 failures have been a right match, in retrospect. The law firm believes I can get anything done that doesn’t normally get done but is not illegal, as far as the clerks are ladies. In truth, I believe that’s because few of them have come up with the idea of smiling at people and not being scary attorneys. Although they do have a point anyway.

Generally, a representative example is something that happened when I was finishing my first year at university, five years ago. A sleepy lecture in legal history was starting and a young lady walked in. She walked right in my direction and asked me what it was. Told her, then it turned out she had already heard it, but I invited her to stay regardless. She declined, but she didn’t make it to the door. We talked the whole lecture through and I was getting her e-mail and phone number after it ended, plotting another meeting. I ended up kissing her on the hand in front of her mother because cheek felt too forward and handshake felt awkward. I’m actually still chuckling as I’m writing this. But it didn’t work out and she claimed she was basically seeing me the same as another girlfriend of hers. And I thought our weekly playing chess in the morning in a cafe throughout the summer meant something.

In fact, once upon a time (I was 17 then, so it was nearly 9 years ago), there was a girl who became something of my girlfriend on one evening by implicit display and popular acclaim, much to my surprise. On that same evening, she ended up on the blanket with a guy two or three years younger than she.

Some time ago, a former co-worker showed up on a grad site and then found me up (by accident) on some dating site and starting talking there via a “flirt” option. Last time she wasn’t single, now she was addressing me as handsome (she isn’t ugly herself, to put it lightly) and prefixing my name with dear. The conversation died shortly, mine being the last reply.

And those three weren’t just isolated cases. I have a knack for such stuff.

You don’t sound worried though, and I would suggest to anyone when dating to not worry about the future. Dating is meant to be fun…really.

Well, yeah, it is, but not as end to itself. Generally, I rather now prefer to keep it light and simple with women since I don’t like it getting romantic if you aren’t in love, convinced or otherwise committed to that person before others. And I generally mind my heart and avoid too much stress.

 

[chevalier]

I agree!

My daughter goes to an all girls High School and everyone of those girls has a father or guardian looking out for them…Each and every girl there is respectful, hardworking, intelligent, and have no self esteem issues (in most cases, maybe too much ego…lol). This is absolutely imperative in bringing up healthy young women. So far, I ve been very impressed with the young men that my daughter and her friends hang with too. All decent and respectful.

And where is that island?

 

[whatevergirl]

The Dating Memoirs of chevalier.…I can see it now. Could make the NY Times Bestsellers list…and maybe become an HBO series.

I remember dating. I regretably, did too much of it in college. I seemed to think that every Tom, Bob, and Harry that came my way…who asked me out…I should say yes to be polite. That was very dumb. I wasted a lot of time, listening to guys’ tales of woe, lamenting about ex’s…and wanting to sleep with me…more than I care to lament about myself. I did learn though, in all of it, what I ultimately wanted in a husband. I think if nothing else, dating can act as sort of a scouring method…whereby, you can eliminate personalities that you know you’d never compromise with. I think that when my husband and I crossed paths, I had been a bit jaded, and truthfully, told myself that maybe marriage was not for me…not on the menu. I was only 21 telling myself this. lol I thought I was a wise one.

But, I remember the day like it was yesterday, that I prayed to God…“whoever it is that you might have for me for a life partner…just show me, and I’ll date him. Even if it is someone I wouldn’t pick for myself.” God has a sense of humor. My husband was an unlikely candidate…not because he wasn’t a great catch…he was! (and still is!) But, because he is 10 years older than me, he was ready for a commitment, and I wasn’t. But, we got to know one another…a very slow romance ensued…and here we are now, some 18 yrs later, nearly.

The moral being…surrender to God in all things, even dating, and let Him matchmake you. God doesn’t make junk, and He will put you with who HE thinks is best for you. And all the guys that came and went in my college years…it all seemed oddly worth it, because then I could recognize a real blessing when it came along. Not to knock anyone. There is someone for everyone. I just don’t think those men were my type…for some reason, ‘players’ were always attracted to me… Maybe they liked the chastity challenge…I dunno.

But…if marriage is on the menu for you, allow God to do the matchmaking. Take it easy…sit back…enjoy a nice dinner with a woman…get to know yourself through the process. That is such an important thing. If there were ever a piece of advice I learned during dating, it was this…discover yourself through dating…and don’t morph into someone you’re not for someone else. Too many marriages begin that way…

OH and of course…don’t ever settle.

 

[Simon_X]

And where is that island?

It exists, believe me…

 

[chevalier]

It exists, believe me…

I want a ticket.

 

[chevalier]

The Dating Memoirs of chevalier.…I can see it now. Could make the NY Times Bestsellers list…and maybe become an HBO series.

I remember dating. I regretably, did too much of it in college. I seemed to think that every Tom, Bob, and Harry that came my way…who asked me out…I should say yes to be polite. That was very dumb. I wasted a lot of time, listening to guys’ tales of woe, lamenting about ex’s…and wanting to sleep with me…more than I care to lament about myself. I did learn though, in all of it, what I ultimately wanted in a husband. I think if nothing else, dating can act as sort of a scouring method…whereby, you can eliminate personalities that you know you’d never compromise with. I think that when my husband and I crossed paths, I had been a bit jaded, and truthfully, told myself that maybe marriage was not for me…not on the menu. I was only 21 telling myself this. lol I thought I was a wise one.

I could narrate that series in my best grandfather voice. I even dress like I’m retired, if you look at it. Typically a ten year old woollen set of grey trousers and three-button navy jacket, coming with a grey woollen waistcoat over a white shirt with blue stripes, and a tie. And my university’s badge in the lapel. And my umbrella is older than I. My English accent is long-dead and my native Polish isn’t much more modern, barring I say “lol” in real life or call people noobs if they deserve it.

But, I remember the day like it was yesterday, that I prayed to God…“whoever it is that you might have for me for a life partner…just show me, and I’ll date him. Even if it is someone I wouldn’t pick for myself.” God has a sense of humor. My husband was an unlikely candidate…not because he wasn’t a great catch…he was! (and still is!) But, because he is 10 years older than me, he was ready for a commitment, and I wasn’t. But, we got to know one another…a very slow romance ensued…and here we are now, some 18 yrs later, nearly.

Ha! Good for you. I’m beginning to think it’s not very likely in my case. I’m becoming more and more logical, talking sharp like a supreme court opinion, calm and rational, able to feel emotion but hardly easily enthused. And yes, rather jaded, although not as much I have already been before. Perhaps I am unable to lose my head for someone, perhaps I have not met the right person. Who knows. At least I’m able to handle infatuations without creating unnecessary commitments and to handle the biological drive without doing stupid things.

The moral being…surrender to God in all things, even dating, and let Him matchmake you.

I’m more of a believer in free will and doing the right job than in the idea that God micromanages our lives. However, to be honest, I’ve already done what you suggest, regardless.

God doesn’t make junk, and He will put you with who HE thinks is best for you.

Again, generally, on the philosophical level, I would stick more to our free will and our obligation to conduct ourselves right. However, we can ask and we can have faith, after all.

And all the guys that came and went in my college years…it all seemed oddly worth it, because then I could recognize a real blessing when it came along.

Not exactly a wasted time, either. It has shaped my character and my personality into what I am now and I wouldn’t exchange it for anything else, with all the flaws that I have.

Not to knock anyone. There is someone for everyone.

Take a lawyer who nearly became an archaelogist, (I was able to give a three hour lecture on ancient history off the top of my head before I was adult), but who also nearly became an IT specialist (I could actually qualify as one in some fields even now; I’ve worked on all PCs since hard-drive-less XT and I’ve wasted more of my youth on computers than should be mentioned in polite company… I can mentally handle three-level arrays and I’m able to get a web portal done overnight or code in a language I don’t really know), who hated maths in school but loved it in every other field of life. Show me an IT guy who talks dead languages, show me a lawyer who can code like a little software studio, show me a history buff who makes life out of litigation. And let’s not forget the strong science-fiction/fantasy interest (“do not be so proud of the technological terror you have created”, Darth Vader ). I am honestly starting to believe that it’s rather unlikely that any supposed match exists.

 

[chevalier]

I just don’t think those men were my type…for some reason, ‘players’ were always attracted to me… Maybe they liked the chastity challenge…I dunno.

Possible. I generally attract non-Catholics more than I do Catholics. Perhaps you were a good catch because it was visible that a man would have a good life with you?

But…if marriage is on the menu for you, allow God to do the matchmaking. Take it easy…sit back…enjoy a nice dinner with a woman…get to know yourself through the process.

Of course. I just don’t believe in any quick dating. Granted, if I were immediately sure, I would immediately act. Barring such unusual circumstances, however, I just prefer to talk. When I’m done talking, typically little romance exists.

That is such an important thing. If there were ever a piece of advice I learned during dating, it was this…discover yourself through dating…and don’t morph into someone you’re not for someone else.

I don’t really believe in using others to help myself even if it is a mutual benefit. On the other hand, my experience so far has been highly educational, even though I did not really do things I did to learn. Definitely am I not going to morph anyhow into anything for anyone, although good Catholic girls tend to have a beneficial influence even on such old jerks as myself.

OH and of course…don’t ever settle.

Of course. That’s unfair to the one settled for, unfair to the one settling (yes, one can be unfair to oneself), unfair possibly to one not yet met. Settling is definitely not my style. Which is most of the reason I’m single.

 

[whatevergirl]

If I didn’t know better, chev…I’d think you were my 25 yr old nephew. (I’m 39–my sister/his mom, is 53) He has his PhD in economics and teaches at Loyola now…the way you describe yourself sounds so much like him.

He is single, and I think because he is so cerebral, I’m not quite sure if there is a compatible match for him in the near future. I tell him too to never settle, and I know he won’t. Opposite from his brother, who was a jock in school, dated all the pretty cheerleader types, and almost became a professional baseball player (until he broke his shoulder)…I know his tastes are worlds away. There is nothing wrong with being picky. It is your right to be discerning of who you might consider to be a suitable partner to take through life with you. It’s interesting how two brothers could be polar opposites.

The difference between you and my nephew however is he is a self proclaimed atheist. For that, I am a bit worried about who he will marry–another atheist? Or might he choose someone religious, preferably Catholic, who will bring him back to his Catholic roots. Not sure why he turned his back on The Church, but in academia, it is an epidemic it seems.

You said something poignant, and I’d like to go back to it…you said…that you feel at this point, you ‘won’t lose your head’ over someone…and you know, I think in the movies, there is this depiction of love as someone who can’t sleep, eat, or think…because they are so lost in thought over their love interest. That isn’t always the case. I did feel butterflies, etc in my stomach, when I knew that my husband was the right one.

But, I had an overwhelming sense of peace. Peace in knowing that he was the ‘one.’ By the one, I mean God’s one for me. I don’t think that is micromanaging…God is directing our lives, and we let Him. I think that with other love interests that I had prior to my husband, I would lose sleep, etc…because I always felt uneasy about those people. Like were they being honest, etc etc…Not to say that true love can’t cause a person to go a little nuts. It can. I was in love with my husband, and he me…but in saying…‘yes’ when my husband proposed (on one knee ) that meant more to him, than anything else.

I have a sixth sense about these things, and you are still quite young. You are what, 26? There is no rush. And you are quite at peace with who you are as a man…that is so important. Soooooo many women and men marry to find themselves in another. You will already be coming to the table, knowing who you are…and where you’re heading.

It’s too bad you and my nephew aren’t in the same side of the world…you two would be great friends, I just know it. lol

Have a nice week, chev.

 

[SeekerJen]

Now my friend is all upset because she’s apparently trying to have a baby with her boyfriend (the one I described on page one) and the pregnancy isn’t happening, and because he’s been spending time with the daughter he fathered as a teenager but hadn’t seen since she was little (he has a second daughter that I don’t think he sees much, and since he doesn’t work he’s obviously not paying child support). AND she’s being clingy and needy (I had occasion to witness her end of a phone conversation with him that made me want to crawl under the table), so he knows the gravy train’s not running out soon.

I don’t know what to say. I’m pretty sure she’s not going to listen to me, and it’s getting painful to listen to her. Any advice?

 

[Liberanosamalo]

Seeker, if that silly woman can’t see that she is on her way to becoming the 3rd unmarried mother for the babydaddy, then you can’t stop her. He’s a user. And she is letting herself be used.

And she’s risking bringing another baby into the mix. Apparently, he’s out the door when the babies come, so if she wants a device to completely get rid of him, a baby will do just fine.

The only thing she doesn’t know is if he will spend any time with her baby or not. His record is 50/50 there. So it’s her call if she wants to bring a child into the world with that kind of father. She can control that now.

Once is an accident. Twice is a pattern. 3 times… she’s been warned and if she proceeds, she can’t whine later and say she wasn’t aware of the problem. He’s a loser. I hope she’s well enough off to take complete care of a child.

 

[whatevergirl]

Hi Jen;

Sorry your friend isn’t able to see the problem here. And the problem really is more with your friend, than the guys she attracts. That is the key. Often, when women allow themselves to take in strays like this, who are non commital, and users…there really is more wrong within themselves than outside of themselves. There will always be users on the planet, but a self assured confident woman, will not allow such a man into her life. A confident, self assured woman will also not wish to get pregnant with someone she isn’t married to. She is intentionally trying to get pregnant with this guy? Yikes.

I might be bold in this case, Jen, and simply tell her that she needs some counseling. Because without getting to the root of why she tolerates this type of thing, she will continue to attract users. My sister had a low self esteem after her divorce, even though she initiated it, and she attracted a total user. I could see it a mile away. But she couldn’t. She had to sink really low with this guy, before she started questioning why she was tolerating such behavior. She still dates users, albeit she’s a bit better in her selection process now, but still. Until a person can love him/herself…there’s no hope for finding a solid relationship. Men and women who like to manipulate will seek out women and men who are unsure of themselves, insecure, and confused. Insecure men are typically attracted to insecure women.

So,while it’s easy to say…dump him…she should break it off…until she can get to the root cause of why she tolerates this, she will continue to attract these types. I will keep her in my prayers.

Liberano also made some great points, as usual.

 

[SeekerJen]

Thanks, ladies.

Hmm, I don’t know how she’d take the suggestion of counseling. She did make a comment yesterday that she always seems to attract the guys who aren’t successful, who aren’t “great catches”. And she admits to low self-esteem, although sometimes she uses that as an excuse for her poor choices.

She doesn’t always make poor choices: when her marriage fell apart, she recognized that her job wasn’t making enough for her to support herself, so she moved in with her father and went back to school. Now she’s almost done with a masters degree and has done really well in her studies. She has a lot of good friends and a close-knit extended family, and she is careful to keep in touch with all of them. All of her poor choices seem to revolve around men. I suspect she won’t feel as though she’s a success until she’s married with a baby, even if she does land a good job after graduation.

 

[whatevergirl]

I just had a lightbulb moment, Jen…This might work.

Buy her a book about stuff like this…there are a ton out there like Smart Women, Dumb Choices…something like that. Can’t recall the exact title, but it’s a good book, I’ve been told. It might help her to see patterns that she exhibits when choosing men, but in an objective way through reading about other women. See, she makes good choices in pretty much everything, it sounds, excluding her choices of men. These books do help.

I think she is looking to you for help, I really do. Without coming out and saying it, she is. So it’s not like you would be giving her unsolicited advice.